Muslims More Unpopular Than Atheists in USA now

[Jolly_Penguin]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry...theists-in-the-us_us_57daeecde4b04a1497b31612

We used to be the most hated group in the USA. Now this article says that our standing hasn't improved a whole lot there, but Muslims have become even more hated than us between when comparing 2003 and today. I find it funny that the article is written in a way to disparage people being concerned with Islam (and confounding that for hating Muslims) but seems to not care at all about people disliking atheists.

Here in Ontario, I would have to agree that Islam has worsened its image since 9/11 etc... which is not what I had expected. I thought it was going to be really bad for Muslims for about a decade and then it would return to as it was before... with most not knowing or caring about the religion. It would seem the constant barrage of headlines about Al Qaeda and Daesh have kept the people reliably anti-Muslim.

And pushing up against that we see the ever growing regressive left that demands you not criticize Islam (again confusing that with hating Muslims).

Islam is a horrible religion (like Christianity) that shouldn't be encouraged and should be criticized. But Muslims are human beings that deserve respect and empathy. Why is this so hard for the world to figure out?

 

[Shadowy Man]

Islam is a horrible religion (like Christianity) that shouldn't be encouraged and should be criticized. But Muslims are human beings that deserve respect and empathy. Why is this so hard for the world to figure out?

What religion would you say is admirable and should be encouraged?

 

[Jolly_Penguin]

The church of moving beyond religion and progressing as a species.

 

[dismal]

Islam is a horrible religion (like Christianity) that shouldn't be encouraged and should be criticized. But Muslims are human beings that deserve respect and empathy. Why is this so hard for the world to figure out?

What religion would you say is admirable and should be encouraged?

Encouraged by whom? By atheists? By force of government?

It seems the answers to those would generally be none and none. Unless, perhaps, there were some religion that could be argued to be correlated with good policy and/or societal norms. And muslimism seems pretty weak on those fronts.

 

[Shadowy Man]

What religion would you say is admirable and should be encouraged?

Encouraged by whom? By atheists? By force of government?

It seems the answers to those would generally be none and none. Unless, perhaps, there were some religion that could be argued to be correlated with good policy and/or societal norms. And muslimism seems pretty weak on those fronts.

By Jolly Penguin. Jolly said that Islam and Christianity are horrible religions that should not be encouraged. I was wondering if he had a positive opinion about any religion. Is Judaism also horrible and should be discouraged? How about Buddhism? Sikkhism? Bahai?

 

[dismal]

Encouraged by whom? By atheists? By force of government?

It seems the answers to those would generally be none and none. Unless, perhaps, there were some religion that could be argued to be correlated with good policy and/or societal norms. And muslimism seems pretty weak on those fronts.

By Jolly Penguin. Jolly said that Islam and Christianity are horrible religions that should not be encouraged. I was wondering if he had a positive opinion about any religion. Is Judaism also horrible and should be discouraged? How about Buddhism? Sikkhism? Bahai?

I'm sure christians, zoroastrians, mormons and atheists may think christianity, zoroastriansm, mormonism and atheism respectively should be encouraged, but I was considering whether there is some objective criteria for shouldness that can be argued.

I'm willing to consider that religions could be treated like rules, and in a rule utilitarian sense whichever rule results in the best outcome for society should be encouraged, even if I personally do not believe the shit.

 

[ronburgundy]

Islam is a horrible religion (like Christianity) that shouldn't be encouraged and should be criticized. But Muslims are human beings that deserve respect and empathy. Why is this so hard for the world to figure out?

I agree that ideas and people are distinct and need to be treated differently, with all ideas being fair and moral targets for as much and as harsh criticism anyone sees fit to direct at them. Ideas have no rights or moral standing.
However, I think it's more complicated than simply saying something like "You can hate the ideology but love the ideologue", because endorsing an ideology is itself a voluntary act that impacts others. Identifying as a Muslim is a choice to endorse the defining ideas, values, politics, and actions that are inherent to the founding documents of Islam. As is also true of Christianity and Judaism.

When the trait is not biological but a matter of choice and entails actions that impact others and people should be judged and respected based upon their actions that impact others. IOW, a Muslim should be respected in the same sense that an admitted member of the Nazi party should be respected. Nazis are also "human beings" and are more than the ideas, values, and politics they endorse by declaring allegiance to that party. Yet their allegiance to that party is itself an act on which the deserve to be evaluated. Note that this comparison does not require that Islam as an ideology is identical to Naziism, only that they are both ideologies that seek to promote ideas, feelings, and actions that impact personal and political acts and thus endorsing them is itself a consequential act that impacts others. In sum, when an association is not incidental but a chosen alliance, then there can be legitimate "guilt by association".

 

[thebeave]

Muslims are more unpopular in the USA than atheists?

This forum must be an anomaly, I guess. Funny how times change.

 

[Elixir]

Why is this so hard for the world to figure out?

Because a person is intelligent, and people are idiots.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

OH, FFS, we really can't have anything, can we?

Stupid Muslims. I'm glad the Mormons killed their God.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

Why is this so hard for the world to figure out?

Because a person is intelligent, and people are idiots.

There's nothing to figure out. People have always found security identifying with the group. There are groups called muslim and groups that don't like muslims. Maybe most of the world will get past thinking in labels but I doubt it will happen in fifty of my lifetimes.

 

[untermensche]

In all things what is needed most is rational examination.

Islam is patent nonsense and has no basis in truth.

The same with Judaism and Christianity.

And there is no difference in a Muslim and Jew or a Christian based merely on some ancient writings.

All their differences are political. A matter of random contingency.

Many Israeli's are bigoted and hateful and they have killed and tortured many innocent people in their occupied territories.

Many Christians invaded Iraq, after GW said his god told him to do it.

And Muslims have carried out their own violence and repression.

What these groups are and do is based almost exclusively on political situations, and has almost nothing to do with this thing that really causes very little in itself, religion.

 

[Crazy Eddie]

We used to be the most hated group in the USA.

That was an apparition. Lots of groups were hated with far more gusto before the relative social peace of the late 90s and early 2000s; when hatespeech goes out of fashion, atheists are the easy target just because most Americans are (or pretend to be) Christians. Otherwise, atheists haven't been the "most hated" group since at least the Iraq War.

Islam is a horrible religion (like Christianity) that shouldn't be encouraged and should be criticized. But Muslims are human beings that deserve respect and empathy. Why is this so hard for the world to figure out?

Because people who don't know any Muslims and don't know anything about them as people fill the voids of their knowledge with what they DO know. And what little information they have includes things like "Islam is a horrible religion" and "Muslim men are patriarchal and oppress their wives" and "Muslims are insecure and easily offended and resort to violence when they get pissed" and "Muslim culture is hard to understand."