Can Animals Consent to Sex (thread split)

[Lion IRC]

If medical science eventually allows people to become donkeys, cows, sheep, etc- and it eventually will, given the exponential rate at which technology is progressing (another thing to be afraid of, conservatives!)- and two or more consenting adults want to have sex as the animal of their choice, who am I to judge? Conservatives don't think far ahead enough with this stuff. They never do. *sighs*

Adult animals routinely give consent to sexual activity.
#Discovery_Channel
https: /en.m. wikipedia. org/ wiki / Naturalistic_fallacy

 

[Jarhyn]

If medical science eventually allows people to become donkeys, cows, sheep, etc- and it eventually will, given the exponential rate at which technology is progressing (another thing to be afraid of, conservatives!)- and two or more consenting adults want to have sex as the animal of their choice, who am I to judge? Conservatives don't think far ahead enough with this stuff. They never do. *sighs*

Adult animals routinely give consent to sexual activity.
#Discovery_Channel
https: /en.m. wikipedia. org/ wiki / Naturalistic_fallacy

He didn't say anything about animals consenting with each other?

Animals may consent with each other. They cannot generally consent to sex with humans because of the underlying asymmetries involved in power, comprehension, and knowledge.

Humans shaped like animals can obviously give consent though. And as per GN's point, they soon *will*.

Though I'm guessing that the reality of it will be more involving a situation more akin to "Surrogates" than anything else, since it will probably be better to remote into a thin client meatsuit than to fully exchange the meatsuit for any but those who are absolutely committed to living as the target format.

Though The bigger issue will come insofar as the question of whether we allow child shaped adults to exist. Personally, I would demand that any such body be clearly identifiable as "aftermarket": weird colored skin, furry, horns, impossible hair, weird eyes, or the like.

 

[Lion IRC]

Adult animals routinely give consent to sexual activity.
#Discovery_Channel
https: /en.m. wikipedia. org/ wiki / Naturalistic_fallacy

...He didn't say anything about animals consenting with each other

So what?

 

[Jarhyn]

Adult animals routinely give consent to sexual activity.
#Discovery_Channel
https: /en.m. wikipedia. org/ wiki / Naturalistic_fallacy

...He didn't say anything about animals consenting with each other

So what?

So... Your comment has no actual relationship to the post you were commenting on. So, that.

 

[Lion IRC]

I disagree.
I think it was quite relevant.

 

[Jarhyn]

I disagree.
I think it was quite relevant.

That animals can consent with each other? While most of us understand that doesn't matter so much among animals, we pretty universally accept that this can be the case.

Or are you implying that animals can consent with people?

You do realize that informed consent relies on informational symmetry, right? It's like, the whole reason why you can get fired for sleeping with a subordinate at work, even between adults. As it is, this is WAY off topic.

 

[Lion IRC]

Consent 'splaining

 

[Jarhyn]

Consent 'splaining

Yes, I am explaining the mechanics of consent, largely because personally, I like engaging in activities that require a very formal understanding of what consent is and why that is important.

If you want to fuck a "dog", ethically, you best be investing in some pup hoods.

 

[Elixir]

This thread was split off from "Trans Girls In Sports" as a separate but potentially interesting topic

Into "Political Discussions"? What is this, Animal Farm 2021?

 

[Jarhyn]

This thread was split off from "Trans Girls In Sports" as a separate but potentially interesting topic

Into "Political Discussions"? What is this, Animal Farm 2021?

To be fair, it is a fairly political issue. After all, there are laws about it now. Even in Washington (after that one dude had a horse to fuck him to death).

 

[GenesisNemesis]

If medical science eventually allows people to become donkeys, cows, sheep, etc- and it eventually will, given the exponential rate at which technology is progressing (another thing to be afraid of, conservatives!)- and two or more consenting adults want to have sex as the animal of their choice, who am I to judge? Conservatives don't think far ahead enough with this stuff. They never do. *sighs*

Adult animals routinely give consent to sexual activity.
#Discovery_Channel
https: /en.m. wikipedia. org/ wiki / Naturalistic_fallacy

You and me baby ain't nothin' but mammals
So let's do it like they do on the Discovery Channel

 

[Rhea]

This thread was split off from "Trans Girls In Sports" as a separate but potentially interesting topic

Into "Political Discussions"? What is this, Animal Farm 2021?

If it trends scientific or ethical, we can move it.

 

[laughing dog]

This thread was split off from "Trans Girls In Sports" as a separate but potentially interesting topic

Into "Political Discussions"? What is this, Animal Farm 2021?

If it trends scientific or ethical, we can move it.

Why did you leave out "stupid"?

 

[Patooka]

Adult animals routinely give consent to sexual activity.
#Discovery_Channel
https: /en.m. wikipedia. org/ wiki / Naturalistic_fallacy

...He didn't say anything about animals consenting with each other

So what?

I'm very certain that when the phrase "animals giving consent to sex", is used, it is in regards to specifically giving consent for a human to fuck them. I cannot prove this, but I am also unwilling to wear a shirt in public that states, "Animals give consent to sex".

Prove me wrong.

 

[Jarhyn]

So what?

I'm very certain that when the phrase "animals giving consent to sex", is used, it is in regards to specifically giving consent for a human to fuck them. I cannot prove this, but I am also unwilling to wear a shirt in public that states, "Animals give consent to sex".

Prove me wrong.

Yeah, animals can try to give that consent, but humans cannot accept it meaningfully any more than an adult can meaningfully or ethically accept clear advances from a child.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

So what?

I'm very certain that when the phrase "animals giving consent to sex", is used, it is in regards to specifically giving consent for a human to fuck them. I cannot prove this, but I am also unwilling to wear a shirt in public that states, "Animals give consent to sex".

Prove me wrong.

Yeah, animals can try to give that consent, but humans cannot accept it meaningfully any more than an adult can meaningfully or ethically accept clear advances from a child.

I see it as a different situation with animals--we can legally kill our animals. We can arrange for them to have sex with their own species, or we can deny them that ability. Why can't we make that one decision?

I think the applicable law should be cruelty to animals. You harm the animal in the process, it's illegal. No harm done, it's just yuck. I do not believe the state should prohibit private yuck.

 

[Jarhyn]

Yeah, animals can try to give that consent, but humans cannot accept it meaningfully any more than an adult can meaningfully or ethically accept clear advances from a child.

I see it as a different situation with animals--we can legally kill our animals. We can arrange for them to have sex with their own species, or we can deny them that ability. Why can't we make that one decision?

I think the applicable law should be cruelty to animals. You harm the animal in the process, it's illegal. No harm done, it's just yuck. I do not believe the state should prohibit private yuck.

And on some levels, I agree with you. I'm fact, when I joined these forums, I made similar arguments. The problem with it is that it's really hard to walk that line: people, and animals too, get in a lot of really hairy (furry?) situations when sex gets into the mix. At some point it's hard to separate out your wants from their needs and they don't exactly have mouths or even minds capable of getting that deep into it.

At this point I think that a lot has to do with a particular cognitive dissonance that happens with pets: we pretty much assume they aren't technically "people" but we treat them like "people" nonetheless. It just seems a bad idea to think that you should be able to manipulate and groom something that can't really ever get away from you for sexual purposes. The implications of someone who could do that are really fucking bad.

Everyone who I've ever known who HAS done that (yes, I've encountered a few...) is also the sort who engages in abusive or coercive relationships.

In reality, we have to ask the question of what particular form that harm takes; to me, it is the harm of the decay this causes to normal consent behaviors.

 

[Angra Mainyu]

Yes, they can, consent to sex. Purely for example, there is a clear difference between a non-human animal being raped by a human while struggling to escape or just frozen out of fear, and one that, says, initiates sex with a human and likes it.

Moral questions are whether lawmakers should ban it, whether human who have sex with nonhuman animals always behave immorally, and so on, not whether in fact they can consent.

 

[bilby]

If it trends scientific or ethical, we can move it.

Why did you leave out "stupid"?

Because in that case, it's very clearly in the correct forum.

 

[thebeave]

I don't see what the big deal is about raping animals. We take their lives without their consent for food and sport. Why not have sex with them without their consent.