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Your top 10 reasons for rejecting Christianity


But that little bit posted; the 'wink smiley' and "welcome aboad" (the faith train) - isn't something that needs challenging. I would have thought this "great puzzle" in the minds of the responding posters, would have got that moment of Eureka, when I clarified, I was posting a little ironic humour.

So much emphasis, so much suspicion.
 
A winking emoji according to dictionary.com means
The winking face emoji is a great go-to emoji for flirtatious situations. Though it's often used to flirt, this emoji is also a useful way to playfully joke or to silently let the reader in on a secret.

Learner was not flirting with anyone and claims he was engaging in ironic humor, which is defined as
The humorous and mildly sarcastic use of words to convey something opposite from or different to the words' literal meaning.
This is according to the online humor scrapbook.

So the jury is still out as to what exactly Learner was attempting to convey.
Because the scientific method works, and doctors use modern medicine to bring people back from "the dead" all the fucking time.
You can consider this action having already happened with the invention of CPR and the defribulator. Humans flatline - the heart stops, the lungs stop. By ancient rules, they are DEAD. Then CPR is applied, or a defib (tools of science created through physical understanding of the natural world) and the person is “resurrected.”

Looking for angles, an example from some of the posts - and why I say atheists make particulary "good" lawyers (of a kind). Looking for angles - you could find a tecnicality somewhere to get a crook of the hook, or get an innocent person guilty, so to speak.

Creating from Nothing is true, when regarding the above.:D
 
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So that’s an interesting point.

What does resurrection mean - and at what point is something a faith-based statement.
The meaning of "resurrect" is in the dictionary. The only "naturalistic" way to use the word is metaphorically, like when you "resurrect a long dead cause". Redefining religious concepts till they seem "naturalized" looks something like "enabling" to me.

But given my interpretation, I do not believe SIB’s “faith statement” is anything like Learners in any way, and so yes, I would argue that Learner is wrong to try to tether them together as like statements.
My interpretation went a little differently...

Learner's error was the tu toque: you people believe crazy shit so whattaya doing criticizing my crazy shit?

But I agree with him that there are postchristian secularists whose beliefs are as batshit insane as his. A case in point are the transhumanists taking the christian mythology but "naturalizing" it with tech-speak so that it'll seem "scientifically plausible". To make it appeal more they present it as "just advances in medical science". But the frozen bodies they're talking about aren't children pulled out of a cold lake, but rich people pulled out of refrigerators.

SIB's faith statement looked like some of that slipping into the convo. Learner spotted it as nutty... and I think it's fucking nutty too. So to me pointing at someone else's shared nuttiness is not the worst thing in that post by Learner that got so much reaction.

Sort of. We are comparing claims to see what ones are more reliable. Do any march what we see and experience?

1) A dude died, woke up, and flew away 2000 years ago by some unknown means as taught by literal Christians..

vs

2) Medical advancements will probably raise the dead in the future. There is probably "how much decay" and a time component. I am talking about bringing someone back with, at least, a large portion of their memory. But I mean far futhur than we can today.

vs

3) the one added: They are both "nutty". Comparing died, woke up, and flew away to medicine might raise the dead in the future isn't that bad.

SO, what belief is more reliable? How do they relate to each other?
 
A winking emoji according to dictionary.com means
The winking face emoji is a great go-to emoji for flirtatious situations. Though it's often used to flirt, this emoji is also a useful way to playfully joke or to silently let the reader in on a secret.

Learner was not flirting with anyone and claims he was engaging in ironic humor, which is defined as
The humorous and mildly sarcastic use of words to convey something opposite from or different to the words' literal meaning.
This is according to the online humor scrapbook.

So the jury is still out as to what exactly Learner was attempting to convey.
Because the scientific method works, and doctors use modern medicine to bring people back from "the dead" all the fucking time.
You can consider this action having already happened with the invention of CPR and the defribulator. Humans flatline - the heart stops, the lungs stop. By ancient rules, they are DEAD. Then CPR is applied, or a defib (tools of science created through physical understanding of the natural world) and the person is “resurrected.”

Looking for angles, an example from some of the posts - and why I say atheists make particulary "good" lawyers (of a kind). Looking for angles - you could find a tecnicality somewhere to get a crook of the hook, or get an innocent person guilty, so to speak.

Creating from Nothing is true, when regarding the above.:D
yes, there are different types of people. But I talking about comparing claims to see what ones are more reliable. For people just seeking. You and I understand there are overlaps. There are atheist that deploy avoidance, diversion, and special pleading. Lets assume you and I are not.

For me leaner, the belief itself is far less important than how we get there. The number one thing, for me, is I ask people to use what they know and what they experience. I also say to them, please go prove me wrong, how cool would that be you taught something I didn't know.

Vs

How religion teaching to a deity go about teaching to their beliefs.

We are using "rose from the dead" as our example.
 
So the jury is still out as to what exactly Learner was attempting to convey.
That sounds fairly smugly passive-aggressive. If Learner only vaguely hints at something without actually stating it, then no one can challenge it.
One is always free to make clear statements.
I don't really think they are. Someone who doesn't really know what they believe or why they believe it is not free to clearly state any of that.
 
I have one reason.

In our life time we will see billions of people die and not one come back. There is no reason for me to go any further.

What scares me is when we raise a dead person, and I believe we will, people will soon forget that we couldn't do it and will use it as proof that it could have happened.
We've raised the dead often. See it in cop shows from time to time too. ;)
 
I have one reason.

In our life time we will see billions of people die and not one come back. There is no reason for me to go any further.

What scares me is when we raise a dead person, and I believe we will, people will soon forget that we couldn't do it and will use it as proof that it could have happened.
We've raised the dead often. See it in cop shows from time to time too. ;)
Yeah, and if you really want to get serious about folks resurrecting, Daniel Jackson got resurrected how many times, now? 5? 6? I stopped counting at some point. Probably at least once per season.

Edit: and let's not forget how many times THAT fucker ascended to godhood~
 
So the jury is still out as to what exactly Learner was attempting to convey.
That sounds fairly smugly passive-aggressive. If Learner only vaguely hints at something without actually stating it, then no one can challenge it.
One is always free to make clear statements.
IIDB wouldn't be worth much without snark, double entendre, sarcasm, and all the other great things about internet forums.
Tom
 
So the jury is still out as to what exactly Learner was attempting to convey.
That sounds fairly smugly passive-aggressive. If Learner only vaguely hints at something without actually stating it, then no one can challenge it.
One is always free to make clear statements.
IIDB wouldn't be worth much without snark, double entendre, sarcasm, and all the other great things about internet forums.
Tom
You and I will just have to disagree on that one.
 
So the jury is still out as to what exactly Learner was attempting to convey.
That sounds fairly smugly passive-aggressive. If Learner only vaguely hints at something without actually stating it, then no one can challenge it.
One is always free to make clear statements.
IIDB wouldn't be worth much without snark, double entendre, sarcasm, and all the other great things about internet forums.
Tom
You and I will just have to disagree on that one.
Not the first disagreement I've had on IIDB.

Frankly, it's the least important one I've had in the last 30 minutes.
Tom
 
1. It's dumb.
2. It's dumb.
3. It's dumb.
4. It's dumb.
5. It's dumb.
6. It's dumb.
7. It's dumb.
8. It's dumb.
9. It's dumb.
10. It's dumb.
 
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Well, then, bomb, you fail to understand what is meant by the words
Duh. Why the devil do you think I wrote

All of those are examples of what you use "natural" and "nature" to refer to. None of them are explanations of what you mean by those terms. None of them are definitions. Do you understand the distinction between sense and reference?​

and

What is it you mean by "natural" and "nature"?​

Did you not understand the question or are you refusing to answer it? Instead of snottily telling me I fail to understand what I already indicated I didn't understand, how about you just go ahead and tell us what you mean by those words?

when they are used by someone outside of [negative value judgment] fiction.
Buffy is marvelous fiction; but that's beside the point. I get that you're Humpty Dumpty, the master of making words mean whatever you want them to mean -- the "homicide" discussion elsewhere established that. But the way "natural" and "supernatural" are used in Buffy and in most fiction of that genre is consistent with common usage among normal people; the way you have been using them is not. You say "I am supernatural with respect to the nature observed from within the simulation"; i.e., you are using those words as relational terms rather than as absolute properties. If you think normal people typically use them as relational terms, you are delusional.

You're just not going to even possibly reach someone if you don't know what people actually mean when they use the term outside your prejudicial interpretation.
When you ask normal people who use "supernatural" what they mean, you typically get something along the lines of the Wikipedia definition, "The supernatural is phenomena or entities that are not subject to the laws of nature." And that's a concept that makes perfect sense in fiction but is mushheaded when applied to the real world. I didn't ask you what people actually mean. I asked you what you actually mean.
 
Bomb, you can't use a definition of something used in fiction as fiction as the basis of definition for some thing being discussed of reality.

It makes no more sense than proclaiming that BONES is a show about anthropology.

Sure, they do something vaguely anthropology shaped, but if you walk up to an anthropologist saying "I know what anthropology is, I've watched Bones!" The anthropologists will laugh at you and tell you to go home.

Similarly, you can't do it with "magic", or "the supernatural" nor anything else either.

When discussing it OUTSIDE the context of shitty fiction, you can't bring in your shitty fantasies.

I understand you have a hard time coming to terms with that. Most people do. It's why Emily Lake for so exacerbated when I proved I met her definition of "magic" as something that actually exists in the world (bringing the pure creation of imagination into reality).

Look up the ideas of "supersystem" and "subsystem" or "superstructure" and "substructure" and extend those concept to "supernatural" and "sub-natural", or "super-set" and "subset"

My definitions that I gave you are operational definitions, because we both know the definition of "super-" and the base word "natural", and how to extend root words.

Now, if you look at the concept of nature not as a single, unified thing, but as a type of thing, of which our nature is one of many, then you can get it through your head that as vast as all this is, it still is logically possible to contain and implement it in some concept of a "larger universe". We have even in several occasions described such "Cosmologies".

All discussions of testable cosmology are searching for something bigger than, outside of, our conceptualization of reality. It is just abjectly observably possible that simulation mechanics and thus "supernatural" entities may exist with respect to us, just the same way I am observably supernatural with respect to my simulation's systemic nature.

Now, personally I would like to go outside, if possible, and cease being sub-natural to that greater (superior) nature, if it exists.
 
It's important that we don't take sounds and scribbles that humans make and objectify them. The process works in reverse of that behavior. We can use all the words and scribbles we want to talk about a toad but it does not change anything about the toad. There is some neurochemistry happening upstairs that is pretty awesome and real in itself but it doesn't matter to the toad and changes nothing about the toad.

And obviously the toad has some neurochemistry happening as well.
 
Well I don't think the context was regarding 'short time death; or immediate flatlining, when the brain is still alive. Nice try posters!

The line from SIB's post , " when we raise a dead person, and I believe we will.." seems to me the implication means, that it's at some point in the future, we'll have the means. Literally raising the long deceased, brain dead - just as those who beleive in the same for the future in Cryonics, cryopreserving their bodies in the belief that ,the future advancement in science will to bring them back.

You are in great error to think this would be in the theists "favour", that this would be used as proof for Religion. It's odd, simply because the belief is: ONLY God can bring people back to life, not even satan could etc...

What you misunderstand - IF humans were able to be brought back to life, by humans. THEN Christianity will have a serious problem, there's no doubt about that. So why would that be a good idea to use that as proof?

Sorry, I am figuring out this site.

I would hope they would see your logic before then.

To me, Christians can have "a god" and even keep calling it Jesus if they would just move to using it as a "focal point" for a set of memes. Moving jesus from the "literal flesh" and moving him to more of a meme ... poof, one can have him rise as often as one would like.
Interesting... "poof, one can have him rise as often as one would like." would that actually be advantageous to the theist, if he or she used that line of method?

In keeping with the religion, I think of a meme like I do a fish or a bird. A school of memes acting as a unit looks like life's journey through the here and now. Or is that a bait ball?

Even a bait ball is offering life.
Would religion be the only sector of society to possess a school of memes, as you're putting it? 'A school of memes... like life's journey' would be the same for all sectors of the society would it not?

Perhaps I haven't understood correctly, but I DO get bait-ball invitations, and all types of offers, through the post all the time - usually products or deals from various companies. I will say though, there have been some invitations from some of the local churches, offering life, as it's usually preached from those faiths.

It seems bait-balling (if I'm using the right context as you) is neccessary in todays world, to be successful and competitively marketable. Admittedly, and yes of course... some of the churches (prosperity organizations) you see on TV are doing just that.
 
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I have one reason.

In our life time we will see billions of people die and not one come back. There is no reason for me to go any further.

What scares me is when we raise a dead person, and I believe we will, people will soon forget that we couldn't do it and will use it as proof that it could have happened.
We've raised the dead often. See it in cop shows from time to time too. ;)
You do know that these cops shows aren't real, right? Those cops are actors! Has it not occurred to you, that there always happens to be a camera, right at the moment there's a ressurection?

Did you also not notice the... the erm,...Oh... ah...

... Moogly, it 's ok.. false alarm. Mr. Higgins was jesting. :)
 
So the jury is still out as to what exactly Learner was attempting to convey.
That sounds fairly smugly passive-aggressive. If Learner only vaguely hints at something without actually stating it, then no one can challenge it.
One is always free to make clear statements.
IIDB wouldn't be worth much without snark, double entendre, sarcasm, and all the other great things about internet forums.
Tom
Those are the only reasons I frequent these fora.
Oh and to feel the atheist love.
 
I have one reason.

In our life time we will see billions of people die and not one come back. There is no reason for me to go any further.

What scares me is when we raise a dead person, and I believe we will, people will soon forget that we couldn't do it and will use it as proof that it could have happened.
We've raised the dead often. See it in cop shows from time to time too. ;)
But, if they were dead, there is nothing you can do, except go through their pockets for some loose change. What they were is mostly dead.
 
Bomb, you can't use a definition of something used in fiction as fiction as the basis of definition for some thing being discussed of reality.
Jarhyn, the reason examples from fiction are useful is because fiction writers base their characters on their experience with real people. Holding up a mirror to mankind is kind of the point of their artwork. I already quoted you a definition straight out of Wikipedia that was based on how real people talk, so any more of your belly-aching about my having used a fiction example is just a red-herring.

BONES ... <expletives deleted> fiction ...
That would be red-herring belly-aching.

I understand you have a hard time coming to terms with that.
If you're on the autism spectrum then you have an excuse for being so bad at understanding those you claim to understand. Otherwise not.

Look up the ideas of "supersystem" and "subsystem" or "superstructure" and "substructure" and extend those concept to "supernatural" and "sub-natural", or "super-set" and "subset"

My definitions that I gave you are operational definitions, because we both know the definition of "super-" and the base word "natural", and how to extend root words.
:rolleyes:

I already asked you what you meant by "nature", and you already told me I fail to understand what is meant by "nature", so for you to now insist that you've given me an operational definition because "we both know" the definition of "nature" is kind of pathetic. You have given me nothing usable. Why are you refusing over and over to say what you mean by "nature"? It's because you don't know what you mean, isn't it?
 
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