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Are the UK/US or other western democracy's any better than North Korea?

RVonse

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You won't find anything at all on main stream media but it appears Julian Assange is being physically mistreated in the UK right now. Honestly, I am wondering how soon it will be he goes the same route as Epstein:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...ng-hmp-belmarsh-wikileaks-trial-a8936136.html


IMO, Assange should be viewed as nothing more than a real whistleblower simply telling the truth as awful as that may be. So how do you get into such trouble just telling the truth? It does not take much I guess if the truth is something that certain people do not want told.

But regardless of how you may feel about Assange and what he has done, should he be treated like a North Korean prisoner? I think not.
 

laughing dog

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You won't find anything at all on main stream media but it appears Julian Assange is being physically mistreated in the UK right now. Honestly, I am wondering how soon it will be he goes the same route as Epstein:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...ng-hmp-belmarsh-wikileaks-trial-a8936136.html


IMO, Assange should be viewed as nothing more than a real whistleblower simply telling the truth as awful as that may be. So how do you get into such trouble just telling the truth? It does not take much I guess if the truth is something that certain people do not want told.

But regardless of how you may feel about Assange and what he has done, should he be treated like a North Korean prisoner? I think not.
How is medically treating a prisoner somehow on par with how North Korean treats their prisoners? Or is your complaint that people who violate bail conditions in North Korea are not imprisoned?
 

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You won't find anything at all on main stream media but it appears Julian Assange is being physically mistreated in the UK right now. Honestly, I am wondering how soon it will be he goes the same route as Epstein:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...ng-hmp-belmarsh-wikileaks-trial-a8936136.html
According to the article, Wikileaks noted:

article said:
He had “already significantly deteriorated after seven years” inside the embassy, it added in a statement posted to Twitter.
So the Embassy mistreated him too?


IMO, Assange should be viewed as nothing more than a real whistleblower simply telling the truth as awful as that may be. So how do you get into such trouble just telling the truth? It does not take much I guess if the truth is something that certain people do not want told.

But regardless of how you may feel about Assange and what he has done, should he be treated like a North Korean prisoner? I think not.
Assange is a puppet who is little interested in truth, otherwise, the documents he'd leak wouldn't be quite as 'selective' in the targets. Snowden is a hero / patriot. Assange isn't.
 

KeepTalking

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You won't find anything at all on main stream media but it appears Julian Assange is being physically mistreated in the UK right now. Honestly, I am wondering how soon it will be he goes the same route as Epstein:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...ng-hmp-belmarsh-wikileaks-trial-a8936136.html

You won't find anything about him being physically mistreated in the article you linked, either. It only indicates that he has been transferred to a medical wing due to physical deterioration and weight loss. There is absolutely no indication that he is being mistreated.

Also, to answer the question in the title of the post: "Yes".
 

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Assange sought political asylum in the Ecuadorian embassy in 2012 to avoid sex offences charges in Sweden.

To. me, he appears to be a chicken shit that chose to hide out in the Ecuadorian embassy instead of going back to Sweden to be tried for sexual assault. No Western country is perfect, and the US often treats its prisoners in inhumane ways, but I wouldn't compare what goes on in Western countries to what goes on in North Korea. I have no idea where you are coming from based on. your link. It just says that the man's health is deteriorating and he's been transferred so he can receive medical care.

Now if you'd like to start a thread about the injustices in the American prison and justice system, I'm listening.
 

Jolly_Penguin

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I agree that Snowden is a hero and Assange is not. Assange's reveals were very selective in nature. But I do appreciate truth being told to the people, even if it is selected truths. I can't see Assange as a villain for it.
 

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I agree that Snowden is a hero and Assange is not. Assange's reveals were very selective in nature. But I do appreciate truth being told to the people, even if it is selected truths. I can't see Assange as a villain for it.
But if he's only telling SOME true, he's omitting other truths.
If i tell the people about all the evil committed by the Elves, but not a word about any evil done by the Dwarves, am i telling Hobbits the truth or lies?
 

Jimmy Higgins

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That depends on who you are and what role you are serving and how you present yourself.
So when Assange puts out Russian emails stolen from Democrats and spills them at particularly important moments in the election process that only benefited Trump (like when a dump came immediately after the 'grab them by the pussy' thing), what does that tell us about the motives of Assange?
 

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Everyone blooms in prison; so it's obviously malfeasance by either the Deep State, the Democrats, or both.
 

Jolly_Penguin

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It always strikes me funny when people speak so loudly against the release of truths like these but avoid actually addressing the truths themselves. Same happened with Snowden. That truth is getting to the people is presented as the bigger problem, obscuring the truth itself that has been revealed.
 

Jimmy Higgins

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It always strikes me funny when people speak so loudly against the release of truths like these but avoid actually addressing the truths themselves. Same happened with Snowden. That truth is getting to the people is presented as the bigger problem, obscuring the truth itself that has been revealed.
So it looks like you are walking back your comment about things depending "on who you are and what role you are serving and how you present yourself."

Snowden released information because he discovered a grossly unconstitutional surveillance program. Assange released information to embarrass the US (Iraq War) and influence an American election (2016). Assange's goal is to propel the agenda of another nation.
 

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It always strikes me funny when people speak so loudly against the release of truths like these but avoid actually addressing the truths themselves. Same happened with Snowden. That truth is getting to the people is presented as the bigger problem, obscuring the truth itself that has been revealed.
So it looks like you are walking back your comment about things depending "on who you are and what role you are serving and how you present yourself."

Snowden released information because he discovered a grossly unconstitutional surveillance program. Assange released information to embarrass the US (Iraq War) and influence an American election (2016). Assange's goal is to propel the agenda of another nation.

Shouldn't the agenda of being embarrassed about the Iraq war and ashamed at the lack of transparency in our democratic process be our agenda too, or is it off-limits because Russia likes it?
 

Jolly_Penguin

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Don't the American people deserve to know the truth about the Iraq war? So what if it embarasses the administration?
 

Jolly_Penguin

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Apparently you ought not have good things if Russia wants you to have them. Being anti-russia is more important than being for yourselves.
 

Jimmy Higgins

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It always strikes me funny when people speak so loudly against the release of truths like these but avoid actually addressing the truths themselves. Same happened with Snowden. That truth is getting to the people is presented as the bigger problem, obscuring the truth itself that has been revealed.
So it looks like you are walking back your comment about things depending "on who you are and what role you are serving and how you present yourself."

Snowden released information because he discovered a grossly unconstitutional surveillance program. Assange released information to embarrass the US (Iraq War) and influence an American election (2016). Assange's goal is to propel the agenda of another nation.

Shouldn't the agenda of being embarrassed about the Iraq war and ashamed at the lack of transparency in our democratic process be our agenda too, or is it off-limits because Russia likes it?
Jolly Penguin said the agenda of the leaker mattered. If they want to walk it back, by all means. But it was their statement which they are walking away from that I'm talking about.
 

Jolly_Penguin

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Who said the agenda matters? Maybe I missed that. I said his role and how he presents himself matters. Is he a government official responsible and accountable to the people? Does he present himself as leaking a complete and balanced picture? Or is he just a leaker trying to get a particular truth out? Snowden and Assange were both the latter as far as I am aware. That you so quickly attribute partisan motives to Assange makes me think he is very much the latter.
 

RVonse

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Assange sought political asylum in the Ecuadorian embassy in 2012 to avoid sex offences charges in Sweden.

To. me, he appears to be a chicken shit that chose to hide out in the Ecuadorian embassy instead of going back to Sweden to be tried for sexual assault. No Western country is perfect, and the US often treats its prisoners in inhumane ways, but I wouldn't compare what goes on in Western countries to what goes on in North Korea. I have no idea where you are coming from based on. your link. It just says that the man's health is deteriorating and he's been transferred so he can receive medical care.

The sex stuff was all found out to be bull shit. And everyone knew that at the time including the women. It was simply the method used in order to entrap Assange who was smart enough to know better.

The fact that the sex charges have been since dismissed without a trial supports this as well.
 

RVonse

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You won't find anything at all on main stream media but it appears Julian Assange is being physically mistreated in the UK right now. Honestly, I am wondering how soon it will be he goes the same route as Epstein:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...ng-hmp-belmarsh-wikileaks-trial-a8936136.html

You won't find anything about him being physically mistreated in the article you linked, either. It only indicates that he has been transferred to a medical wing due to physical deterioration and weight loss. There is absolutely no indication that he is being mistreated.

Also, to answer the question in the title of the post: "Yes".
The article I posted is a main steam article.

I could have posted other articles that show him in a near death state. But had I posted from those other sources you would be attacking the credibility of those sources. And then placing your hands on your ears and shouting "la, la, la la, I dont hear anything" .

So I posted a main stream article. And it should be telling what they even can admit.
 

RVonse

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Shouldn't the agenda of being embarrassed about the Iraq war and ashamed at the lack of transparency in our democratic process be our agenda too, or is it off-limits because Russia likes it?

No truer words ever spoken.
 

Jimmy Higgins

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Who said the agenda matters? Maybe I missed that. I said his role and how he presents himself matters. Is he a government official responsible and accountable to the people? Does he present himself as leaking a complete and balanced picture? Or is he just a leaker trying to get a particular truth out? Snowden and Assange were both the latter as far as I am aware. That you so quickly attribute partisan motives to Assange makes me think he is very much the latter.
Except I was raising this issue during the George W. Bush Administration.
 

laughing dog

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You won't find anything at all on main stream media but it appears Julian Assange is being physically mistreated in the UK right now. Honestly, I am wondering how soon it will be he goes the same route as Epstein:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...ng-hmp-belmarsh-wikileaks-trial-a8936136.html

You won't find anything about him being physically mistreated in the article you linked, either. It only indicates that he has been transferred to a medical wing due to physical deterioration and weight loss. There is absolutely no indication that he is being mistreated.

Also, to answer the question in the title of the post: "Yes".
The article I posted is a main steam article.

I could have posted other articles that show him in a near death state. But had I posted from those other sources you would be attacking the credibility of those sources. And then placing your hands on your ears and shouting "la, la, la la, I dont hear anything" .

So I posted a main stream article. And it should be telling what they even can admit.
There is no evidence in anything you have posted that Mr. Assange is being mistreated. None. Nor is there anything in your OP or posts that provide any reason why any rational person would compare Mr. Assange being medically treated in prison with how people are treated in North Korea.

The lack of a cogent and coherent train of thought in the OP and responses make your position appear to be driven by delusion rather than reality.
 

Jimmy Higgins

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You won't find anything at all on main stream media but it appears Julian Assange is being physically mistreated in the UK right now. Honestly, I am wondering how soon it will be he goes the same route as Epstein:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...ng-hmp-belmarsh-wikileaks-trial-a8936136.html

You won't find anything about him being physically mistreated in the article you linked, either. It only indicates that he has been transferred to a medical wing due to physical deterioration and weight loss. There is absolutely no indication that he is being mistreated.

Also, to answer the question in the title of the post: "Yes".
The article I posted is a main steam article.

I could have posted other articles that show him in a near death state. But had I posted from those other sources you would be attacking the credibility of those sources. And then placing your hands on your ears and shouting "la, la, la la, I dont hear anything" .

So I posted a main stream article. And it should be telling what they even can admit.
:thinking:
 

laughing dog

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Assange sought political asylum in the Ecuadorian embassy in 2012 to avoid sex offences charges in Sweden.

To. me, he appears to be a chicken shit that chose to hide out in the Ecuadorian embassy instead of going back to Sweden to be tried for sexual assault. No Western country is perfect, and the US often treats its prisoners in inhumane ways, but I wouldn't compare what goes on in Western countries to what goes on in North Korea. I have no idea where you are coming from based on. your link. It just says that the man's health is deteriorating and he's been transferred so he can receive medical care.

The sex stuff was all found out to be bull shit. And everyone knew that at the time including the women. It was simply the method used in order to entrap Assange who was smart enough to know better.

The fact that the sex charges have been since dismissed without a trial supports this as well.
No, it does not. Some of the charges were dropped due to the statute of limitations on them.
 

laughing dog

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Who said the agenda matters? Maybe I missed that. I said his role and how he presents himself matters. Is he a government official responsible and accountable to the people? Does he present himself as leaking a complete and balanced picture? Or is he just a leaker trying to get a particular truth out? Snowden and Assange were both the latter as far as I am aware. That you so quickly attribute partisan motives to Assange makes me think he is very much the latter.
Given the timing of the Democrat documents release, it is easy to conclude Assange was interested in more than a "complete and balanced picture".
 

Jolly_Penguin

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Given the timing of the Democrat documents release, it is easy to conclude Assange was interested in more than a "complete and balanced picture".

Exactly. So there's little to complain about regarding him revealing what he did. If the administration wanted to come clean with the whole truth to the American people they could. He exposed them for not doing so and revealed some of the truths they were hiding. I call that a good thing.

To then make the narrative about him instead of about what the government is hiding from you is a disservice to the American people.
 

Jimmy Higgins

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Given the timing of the Democrat documents release, it is easy to conclude Assange was interested in more than a "complete and balanced picture".

Exactly. So there's little to complain about regarding him revealing what he did.
He didn't release the Hollywood Access tape, nor Trump's taxes. So the "balance" comment is a bit BS on your part as his release clearly had a partisan agenda.
If the administration wanted to come clean with the whole truth to the American people they could.
Obama =/ DNC
 

laughing dog

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Given the timing of the Democrat documents release, it is easy to conclude Assange was interested in more than a "complete and balanced picture".

Exactly. So there's little to complain about regarding him revealing what he did. If the administration wanted to come clean with the whole truth to the American people they could. He exposed them for not doing so and revealed some of the truths they were hiding. I call that a good thing.

To then make the narrative about him instead of about what the government is hiding from you is a disservice to the American people.
Assange's release of Democratic emails about the 2016 election had nothing whatsoever to do with the gov't administration or the Iraqi war. His timing of the release of those documents does raise questions about his motives.
 

Loren Pechtel

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Assange is a puppet who is little interested in truth, otherwise, the documents he'd leak wouldn't be quite as 'selective' in the targets. Snowden is a hero / patriot. Assange isn't.

Seconded. Snowden leaked the minimum he needed to to make his point.

Assange is simply out to hurt the west. Personally, I suspect Wikileaks was subverted by the Russians (or possibly the Chinese) long ago. It would have been a major intel coup for either of them, I find it hard to believe they wouldn't have made the attempt and when you pit amateurs against pros what do you expect the outcome to be?
 

Loren Pechtel

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Assange sought political asylum in the Ecuadorian embassy in 2012 to avoid sex offences charges in Sweden.

To. me, he appears to be a chicken shit that chose to hide out in the Ecuadorian embassy instead of going back to Sweden to be tried for sexual assault. No Western country is perfect, and the US often treats its prisoners in inhumane ways, but I wouldn't compare what goes on in Western countries to what goes on in North Korea. I have no idea where you are coming from based on. your link. It just says that the man's health is deteriorating and he's been transferred so he can receive medical care.

The sex stuff was all found out to be bull shit. And everyone knew that at the time including the women. It was simply the method used in order to entrap Assange who was smart enough to know better.

The fact that the sex charges have been since dismissed without a trial supports this as well.

The sex stuff isn't bullshit, that's just a translation problem.

The actual alleged act was stealthing and I've seen nothing to say that's bullshit. The western press reported it as "rape" but that's because of how Swedish law is written--we have several shades of sex crimes short of rape, they call a much wider range of acts "rape" and have degrees to it. She didn't consent to sex without a condom, Swedish law treats that (his performing sex in a fashion he knew she didn't consent to) as a form of rape. No male bovine excrement involved.
 

Loren Pechtel

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The sex stuff was all found out to be bull shit. And everyone knew that at the time including the women. It was simply the method used in order to entrap Assange who was smart enough to know better.

The fact that the sex charges have been since dismissed without a trial supports this as well.
No, it does not. Some of the charges were dropped due to the statute of limitations on them.

Which is stupid in my book.

The reason behind the statute of limitations is sound. However, I don't see that it should apply in a case like this where he was aware of the allegations and capable of mounting a defense. The US handles this in a much more sensible fashion--the clock applies to filing charges, not to trial.
 

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He didn't release the Hollywood Access tape, nor Trump's taxes. So the "balance" comment is a bit BS on your part as his release clearly had a partisan agenda.
If the administration wanted to come clean with the whole truth to the American people they could.
Obama =/ DNC

Re-read what j actually wrote. I didn't say it was balanced. I said he didn't have any obligation for it to be balanced. He can be as partisan as he wants. If it's still true what he gets out, then that's a service. It's on the administration or DNC or whoever if they want to come clean and reveal the whole truth. That's not his role, assigned or claimed.
 

Jolly_Penguin

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Given the timing of the Democrat documents release, it is easy to conclude Assange was interested in more than a "complete and balanced picture".

Exactly. So there's little to complain about regarding him revealing what he did. If the administration wanted to come clean with the whole truth to the American people they could. He exposed them for not doing so and revealed some of the truths they were hiding. I call that a good thing.

To then make the narrative about him instead of about what the government is hiding from you is a disservice to the American people.
Assange's release of Democratic emails about the 2016 election had nothing whatsoever to do with the gov't administration or the Iraqi war. His timing of the release of those documents does raise questions about his motives.

His motives are irrelevant. If it's true then that should probably be a story, and one far more important and interesting than how that truth got out. Same with Snowden, who did make more of an effort to be unbiased on what he leaked.
 

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Assange's release of Democratic emails about the 2016 election had nothing whatsoever to do with the gov't administration or the Iraqi war. His timing of the release of those documents does raise questions about his motives.

His motives are irrelevant.
No, they are not. We do not know if everything he leaked is true or if it left out exculpatory information.
 

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It is very well known that what Assange was avoiding wasn't facing rape charges in Sweden, he was avoiding being extradited from Sweden to the US.

His treatment in the UK jail is a small sample of what he was worried about. Yes, I am sure he is getting medical "treatment".
 

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Don't the American people deserve to know the truth about the Iraq war? So what if it embarasses the administration?

Because they only blamed the dems! Assange was bought and paid for by the republicans. Then they abandoned him. I don't feel sorry for him in the least.
 

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Don't the American people deserve to know the truth about the Iraq war? So what if it embarasses the administration?

Because they only blamed the dems! Assange was bought and paid for by the republicans. Then they abandoned him. I don't feel sorry for him in the least.

Are you being sarcastic?
 

RVonse

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The article I posted is a main steam article.

I could have posted other articles that show him in a near death state. But had I posted from those other sources you would be attacking the credibility of those sources. And then placing your hands on your ears and shouting "la, la, la la, I dont hear anything" .

So I posted a main stream article. And it should be telling what they even can admit.
There is no evidence in anything you have posted that Mr. Assange is being mistreated. None. Nor is there anything in your OP or posts that provide any reason why any rational person would compare Mr. Assange being medically treated in prison with how people are treated in North Korea.

The lack of a cogent and coherent train of thought in the OP and responses make your position appear to be driven by delusion rather than reality.

I hope you are right laughing dog. I really do.

I will say this though. If Assange does show up later committing a so called (Epstien style) suicide, we may look back again to this post and evaluate who is in the state of delusion.
 

KeepTalking

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You won't find anything at all on main stream media but it appears Julian Assange is being physically mistreated in the UK right now. Honestly, I am wondering how soon it will be he goes the same route as Epstein:

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...ng-hmp-belmarsh-wikileaks-trial-a8936136.html

You won't find anything about him being physically mistreated in the article you linked, either. It only indicates that he has been transferred to a medical wing due to physical deterioration and weight loss. There is absolutely no indication that he is being mistreated.

Also, to answer the question in the title of the post: "Yes".
The article I posted is a main steam article.

I could have posted other articles that show him in a near death state. But had I posted from those other sources you would be attacking the credibility of those sources. And then placing your hands on your ears and shouting "la, la, la la, I dont hear anything" .

So I posted a main stream article. And it should be telling what they even can admit.

Your statements seem a bit conflicted, are there main stream articles, or not?

Regardless, it doesn't matter what condition Assange is shown to be in, what matters in this context is how he came to be in that condition. If it can be demonstrated that there is reason to believe that Assange is in that condition because of mistreatment while in a US or UK prison, then it would be a good idea to go ahead and demonstrate it. Of course, if your sources are unreliable in that regard, then I am sure you will be brought to task for it, but why don't you give it your best shot, anyway?
 

Jolly_Penguin

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Assange's release of Democratic emails about the 2016 election had nothing whatsoever to do with the gov't administration or the Iraqi war. His timing of the release of those documents does raise questions about his motives.

His motives are irrelevant.
No, they are not. We do not know if everything he leaked is true or if it left out exculpatory information.

The holders of that information (be it the DNC or the government) can release the entirely of everything. Nothing is stopping them from doing so but themselves. If he got this much out, good for him. He's under attack for getting out what he did. Do you also want him under attack for NOT getting out what he didn't? And again, what he got out should probably be looked into. If its disproved then he's engaged in propaganda. If its verified, then he's let out the truth, and people should be asking why it was hidden from the public in the first place.
 

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No, they are not. We do not know if everything he leaked is true or if it left out exculpatory information.

The holders of that information (be it the DNC or the government) can release the entirely of everything. Nothing is stopping them from doing so but themselves. If he got this much out, good for him. He's under attack for getting out what he did. Do you also want him under attack for NOT getting out what he didn't? And again, what he got out should probably be looked into. If its disproved then he's engaged in propaganda. If its verified, then he's let out the truth, and people should be asking why it was hidden from the public in the first place.
Like the GOP, the DNC is a private institution. Unless there is some evidence that the DNC violated some laws instead of hurting the feelings of Bernie Backers, there is no reason for any investigation. Nor is there any reason for the DNC to reveal more to try and combat any partial picture the leaked emails may present if those revelations are embarrassing in another way.

Mr Assange plotted a course of action that he had to know would help a narcissistic time bomb to get elected. Mr Assange did no investigation - he took stolen information and revealed it. The revelations that the DNC is not 100% squeaky clean nor that it favored a non-Democrat as its candidate would not be news to any person who functions at a minimal level of intelligence. Anyone who actually cared about the outcomes would have weighed the probative value of that non-news with its potential effect on the election. A responsible course of action would have been to wait until after the election. Mr. Assange knew (or should have known) the risks he was taking. In this instance, the ends (revealing the "truth") do not justify the means (using stolen information) especially when the ultimate end is helping Trump get elected.
 

Jolly_Penguin

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No, they are not. We do not know if everything he leaked is true or if it left out exculpatory information.

The holders of that information (be it the DNC or the government) can release the entirely of everything. Nothing is stopping them from doing so but themselves. If he got this much out, good for him. He's under attack for getting out what he did. Do you also want him under attack for NOT getting out what he didn't? And again, what he got out should probably be looked into. If its disproved then he's engaged in propaganda. If its verified, then he's let out the truth, and people should be asking why it was hidden from the public in the first place.

Like the GOP, the DNC is a private institution. Unless there is some evidence that the DNC violated some laws instead of hurting the feelings of Bernie Backers, there is no reason for any investigation. Nor is there any reason for the DNC to reveal more to try and combat any partial picture the leaked emails may present if those revelations are embarrassing in another way.

I didn't say they should be forced to release such information. I said that they can, if they want to. They have that power. As far as I am aware, Assange wasn't bound by any sort of non-disclosure agreemnet. He revealed what he revealed. If they want to rush to damage control and if revealing "the whole picture" isn't as damning (doubtful) then they have it entirely in their power to do that. If they don't, then too bad, so sad.

Anyone who actually cared about the outcomes

He had no obligation to care about the outcomes of him revealing what he knew. The DNC had every opportunity to reveal the "whole truth" if they thought it would help (doubtful that it would have). And why shouldn't the public know what they learned from Assange?

In this instance, the ends (revealing the "truth") do not justify the means (using stolen information) especially when the ultimate end is helping Trump get elected.

Oh I see. So its a partisan sour grapes thing. What if Assange had instead revealed something about Trump during a period leading up to an election? Like something allegations regarding Russia etc?
 

ZiprHead

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Like the GOP, the DNC is a private institution. Unless there is some evidence that the DNC violated some laws instead of hurting the feelings of Bernie Backers, there is no reason for any investigation. Nor is there any reason for the DNC to reveal more to try and combat any partial picture the leaked emails may present if those revelations are embarrassing in another way.

I didn't say they should be forced to release such information. I said that they can, if they want to. They have that power. As far as I am aware, Assange wasn't bound by any sort of non-disclosure agreemnet. He revealed what he revealed. If they want to rush to damage control and if revealing "the whole picture" isn't as damning (doubtful) then they have it entirely in their power to do that. If they don't, then too bad, so sad.

Anyone who actually cared about the outcomes

He had no obligation to care about the outcomes of him revealing what he knew. The DNC had every opportunity to reveal the "whole truth" if they thought it would help (doubtful that it would have). And why shouldn't the public know what they learned from Assange?

In this instance, the ends (revealing the "truth") do not justify the means (using stolen information) especially when the ultimate end is helping Trump get elected.

Oh I see. So its a partisan sour grapes thing. What if Assange had instead revealed something about Trump during a period leading up to an election? Like something allegations regarding Russia etc?

IIRC, the RNC was broken into too. I suspect the data that was found from that break in is now being used to blackmail Republicans into falling in line behind Trump instead of being disseminated to Assange. Playing both ends.
 

laughing dog

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I didn't say they should be forced to release such information.

I said that they can, if they want to......
There is no evidence in your response that you read or understand a single point in my post.

Assange choose to leak stolen information to help one candidate over another. He did not bother to authenticate the emails. I suspect if these leaks had tarnished your idol - Bernie - instead of hated HRC, your tune would be different.

This instance is an example that the ends do not always justify the means.
 

Jolly_Penguin

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I didn't say they should be forced to release such information.

I said that they can, if they want to......
There is no evidence in your response that you read or understand a single point in my post.

I understood just fine.

Assange choose to leak stolen information to help one candidate over another.

So what? Did he steal it?

I suspect if these leaks had tarnished your idol - Bernie - instead of hated HRC, your tune would be different.

This tells me two things. First that you think this information tarnished Hillary. If so then it was newsworthy, but instead the news became about how the information you think tarnished Hillary got out. Second, it tells me you have no clue who my "idols" are. I am not even for Bernie in this primary. Was he better than Hillary? Hell yes. But that's not a high bar at all.

This instance is an example that the ends do not always justify the means.

Again, Assange had no obligation to Hillary or anyone else to sit on information that would show something bad about them.
 

Harry Bosch

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I understood just fine.

Assange choose to leak stolen information to help one candidate over another.

So what? Did he steal it?

I suspect if these leaks had tarnished your idol - Bernie - instead of hated HRC, your tune would be different.

This tells me two things. First that you think this information tarnished Hillary. If so then it was newsworthy, but instead the news became about how the information you think tarnished Hillary got out. Second, it tells me you have no clue who my "idols" are. I am not even for Bernie in this primary. Was he better than Hillary? Hell yes. But that's not a high bar at all.

This instance is an example that the ends do not always justify the means.

Again, Assange had no obligation to Hillary or anyone else to sit on information that would show something bad about them.

Whatever. Dude: why is it hard for you to accept that Assange had a soft spot for the republicans? It's being reported now that Trump's buddy, Roger Stone, was the main contact with Assange.
 

Jolly_Penguin

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Whatever. Dude: why is it hard for you to accept that Assange had a soft spot for the republicans? It's being reported now that Trump's buddy, Roger Stone, was the main contact with Assange.

I didn't say Assange does or doesn't have a soft spot for Republicans. I said it doesn't matter. He had no obligation to sit on any information that would put Democrats or the Republicans in a positive or negative light. He isn't merely accused of having a bias. He has been run out of the country because he revealed information that people should know that power people don't want the people to know. As has Snowden.
 

Harry Bosch

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Whatever. Dude: why is it hard for you to accept that Assange had a soft spot for the republicans? It's being reported now that Trump's buddy, Roger Stone, was the main contact with Assange.

I didn't say Assange does or doesn't have a soft spot for Republicans. I said it doesn't matter. He had no obligation to sit on any information that would put Democrats or the Republicans in a positive or negative light. He isn't merely accused of having a bias. He has been run out of the country because he revealed information that people should know that power people don't want the people to know. As has Snowden.

This is not a complicated issue. Assange leaked damaging information about the democrats. But this bastion of truth and justice never leaks anything about the republicans and/or Trump. Zero. Zippo. Do the math.
 

PyramidHead

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Whatever. Dude: why is it hard for you to accept that Assange had a soft spot for the republicans? It's being reported now that Trump's buddy, Roger Stone, was the main contact with Assange.

I didn't say Assange does or doesn't have a soft spot for Republicans. I said it doesn't matter. He had no obligation to sit on any information that would put Democrats or the Republicans in a positive or negative light. He isn't merely accused of having a bias. He has been run out of the country because he revealed information that people should know that power people don't want the people to know. As has Snowden.

This is not a complicated issue. Assange leaked damaging information about the democrats. But this bastion of truth and justice never leaks anything about the republicans and/or Trump. Zero. Zippo. Do the math.

Should that be illegal? I'm serious, since this is a thread about state actions against Assange. Should it be illegal, in your opinion, to leak information that benefits one political party without giving its little brother a punishment as well so they don't argue all the way home?
 

Harry Bosch

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This is not a complicated issue. Assange leaked damaging information about the democrats. But this bastion of truth and justice never leaks anything about the republicans and/or Trump. Zero. Zippo. Do the math.

Should that be illegal? I'm serious, since this is a thread about state actions against Assange. Should it be illegal, in your opinion, to leak information that benefits one political party without giving its little brother a punishment as well so they don't argue all the way home?

Of course not. But Jolly has been portraying Assange as this Lone Ranger international champion of free information and exposure of the powerful elite. But when it's pointed out that he only exposed the powerful elite on the left, and helps the elites on the right, indignity sets in. I just ask calling it as it is, Assange and Wikileaks only cared about exposing problems on the left.
 
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