Black Woman calling a White Woman a "Karen"

[starwater]

Chicago mayor Lori Lightfoot, called Keighliegh McCanney (white house press secretary) a "Karen" .

https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/17/us/lori-lightfoot-chicago-karen-mcenany-trnd/index.html

Karen is most commonly referring to the Amy Cooper who called out a black man bird watching as threatening and referring to white woman as privileged.

I have heard that white people are saying that calling someone a "Karen", is a racial slur. I didn't know it had progressed this far in a few short months.

Personally I would think calling any female a Karen (whatever skin color), is not a racial slur but more as in a whiny Beeotch.

Thoughts?

 

[prideandfall]

Thoughts?

it's another sad desperate attempt by white people to make themselves the victim.

karen is used derogatorily towards entitled women of all races who are freaking the fuck out over something stupid, the memes are references to 'karen' that spawned this colloquialism are race-neutral and target a behavior, not an ethnic group.

 

[KeepTalking]

Chicago mayor Lori Lightfoot, called Keighliegh McCanney (white house press secretary) a "Karen" .

https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/17/us/lori-lightfoot-chicago-karen-mcenany-trnd/index.html

Karen is most commonly referring to the Amy Cooper who called out a black man bird watching as threatening and referring to white woman as privileged.

I have heard that white people are saying that calling someone a "Karen", is a racial slur. I didn't know it had progressed this far in a few short months.

Personally I would think calling any female a Karen (whatever skin color), is not a racial slur but more as in a whiny Beeotch.

Thoughts?

It's not a racial slur. It's not even sexist. You hit it on the head, it is about whiney bitches. The difference in this situation is that a Karen is normally calling the authorities while being a whiney bitch, and the press secretary is not doing that. Given that, I don't think it was appropriate to call her a Karen, but I suppose meaning can shift rapidly with this kind of thing, so whatever...

 

[repoman]

On black twitter it is not used race neutrally.

It may be a delayed reaction to the sassy black woman trope that used in a light hearted and racist manner all the way from 1970's to 2000's. Turnabout is partially fair play if you don't overextend your hand.

Times when you can tell it is being used like on black twitter as a racial dogwhistle (if you are being honest) does not mean that people will only use it as a racial shorthand. And people using it just to describe a whiner regardless of race does not mean the converse.

Both of these are true at the same time.

 

[laughing dog]

So does one call Karen Gillian or Karen Allen ?

 

[starwater]

It's the same as calling someone a "soccer mom" in my opinion.

 

[ruby sparks]

Thoughts?

I think it is mainly used as a pejorative for objectionable, entitled white women.

From the OP article:

"On the internet, a "Karen" is a moniker for a stereotypically rude, middle aged White woman -- the type who demand to "speak to the manager" or call the police on Black people in innocent situations."

So yes, there is a racist aspect to using it, I believe.

 

[repoman]

I think it is deflection from a higher percentage of blacks being assholes to retail employees. HOWEVER, the vast majority of all people, black and white are reasonably nice to retail workers.

So, by the law of large numbers you can find enough psycho customers to fill hard drives full of video and also an outsized fraction of them are black

 

[ruby sparks]

I think it is deflection from a higher percentage of blacks being assholes to retail employees. HOWEVER, the vast majority of all people, black and white are reasonably nice to retail workers.

So, by the law of large numbers you can find enough psycho customers to fill hard drives full of video and also an outsized fraction of them are black

Shouldn't this (I admit I only watched the first one) be in the 'First World Problems' thread?

 

[repoman]

So back when Opie and Anthony used Tyrone and maybe Shaniqua as a shorthand for any black person it was similar to this now.

 

[Patooka]

HOWEVER, the vast majority of all people, black and white are reasonably nice to retail workers.

Anyone who's worked in retail for more than six months would disagree with you. Strongly.

(partially tongue in cheek)

 

[repoman]

HOWEVER, the vast majority of all people, black and white are reasonably nice to retail workers.

Anyone who's worked in retail for more than six months would disagree with you. Strongly.

(partially tongue in cheek)

Well if 1% of people are normally a bit rude that is a large burden to bear by the workers.

Also if the 99% of the other people who are normally nice are rude 1% of the time, because are having a really bad day and are lashing out, that is also another burden.

If a person is judged to be wealthy or at least not dirt poor then naturally their rudeness will be judged more harshly then a poorer person. Not unfairly, I would say.

 

[J842P]

Thoughts?

it's another sad desperate attempt by white people to make themselves the victim.

karen is used derogatorily towards entitled women of all races who are freaking the fuck out over something stupid, the memes are references to 'karen' that spawned this colloquialism are race-neutral and target a behavior, not an ethnic group.

Bullshit they are race neutral. Haha. Incredible how people try to claim this.

 

[J842P]

Chicago mayor Lori Lightfoot, called Keighliegh McCanney (white house press secretary) a "Karen" .

https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/17/us/lori-lightfoot-chicago-karen-mcenany-trnd/index.html

Karen is most commonly referring to the Amy Cooper who called out a black man bird watching as threatening and referring to white woman as privileged.

I have heard that white people are saying that calling someone a "Karen", is a racial slur. I didn't know it had progressed this far in a few short months.

Personally I would think calling any female a Karen (whatever skin color), is not a racial slur but more as in a whiny Beeotch.

Thoughts?

It's not a racial slur. It's not even sexist. You hit it on the head, it is about whiney bitches. The difference in this situation is that a Karen is normally calling the authorities while being a whiney bitch, and the press secretary is not doing that. Given that, I don't think it was appropriate to call her a Karen, but I suppose meaning can shift rapidly with this kind of thing, so whatever...

Bullshit that it isn't a gendered pejorative. Of course it's gendered, and yes, it has a racial implication. This is easy to see if there were a similar pejorative that used a stereotypically black, female name, e.g. Shaniqua, to mean something unsavory.


I don't think it is a big deal, but then again, I'm pretty consistent that many slurs, be they gendered or even slightly racially tinged, aren't a big deal. At least, in certain contexts (and can become big deals in other contexts, say, an employer saying them to an employee).

 

[repoman]

Thoughts?

it's another sad desperate attempt by white people to make themselves the victim.

karen is used derogatorily towards entitled women of all races who are freaking the fuck out over something stupid, the memes are references to 'karen' that spawned this colloquialism are race-neutral and target a behavior, not an ethnic group.

Bullshit they are race neutral. Haha. Incredible how people try to claim this.

Tyrone is also race neutral /s

 

[ruby sparks]

Back in the day when I was at school here, it used to be Rastas and Lullabelle as names for typical black people. There were a set of Rastas and Lullabelle jokes. One was:

Lullabelle is lying naked on her back on the bed, with her eyes closed. She is talking with her lover, Rastas.

Rastas: ok Lullabelle, I'm putting my c**k in now. Can you feel it?
Lullabelle: yes Rastas I feel it and it sure feels gooood.
Rastas: ok Lullabelle, I'm a-gonna put some more of it in. Would you like more?
Lulabelle: Oh yes Rastas, more, more.

(joke continues in this vein for a few more rounds)

Finally, eventually....

Rastas: Ok Lullabelle, I'm a-comin' up the stairs now!

As you can see, no racial stereotypes of any kind were involved at all.

 

[starwater]

HOWEVER, the vast majority of all people, black and white are reasonably nice to retail workers.

Anyone who's worked in retail for more than six months would disagree with you. Strongly.

(partially tongue in cheek)

My friend ran a fast casual restaurant that catered to the work out set - with specifically prepared food for the weight training type. She would run in hide if the hangery white man on roids walked in.

 

[KeepTalking]

Chicago mayor Lori Lightfoot, called Keighliegh McCanney (white house press secretary) a "Karen" .

https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/17/us/lori-lightfoot-chicago-karen-mcenany-trnd/index.html

Karen is most commonly referring to the Amy Cooper who called out a black man bird watching as threatening and referring to white woman as privileged.

I have heard that white people are saying that calling someone a "Karen", is a racial slur. I didn't know it had progressed this far in a few short months.

Personally I would think calling any female a Karen (whatever skin color), is not a racial slur but more as in a whiny Beeotch.

Thoughts?

It's not a racial slur. It's not even sexist. You hit it on the head, it is about whiney bitches. The difference in this situation is that a Karen is normally calling the authorities while being a whiney bitch, and the press secretary is not doing that. Given that, I don't think it was appropriate to call her a Karen, but I suppose meaning can shift rapidly with this kind of thing, so whatever...

Bullshit that it isn't a gendered pejorative. Of course it's gendered, and yes, it has a racial implication. This is easy to see if there were a similar pejorative that used a stereotypically black, female name, e.g. Shaniqua, to mean something unsavory.


I don't think it is a big deal, but then again, I'm pretty consistent that many slurs, be they gendered or even slightly racially tinged, aren't a big deal. At least, in certain contexts (and can become big deals in other contexts, say, an employer saying them to an employee).

I said it wasn't sexist because it isn't about the gender of the person, it is about their attitude and what they are doing. If it were men doing it, they would probably be Darens, but it still wouldn't be about their gender, it would be about what they are doing.

 

[repoman]

It is about bringing white women into scumbag overprivileged status deserving of internet pillory (unless they are genuflecting allies) that white men have been in since forever.

 

[J842P]

Bullshit that it isn't a gendered pejorative. Of course it's gendered, and yes, it has a racial implication. This is easy to see if there were a similar pejorative that used a stereotypically black, female name, e.g. Shaniqua, to mean something unsavory.


I don't think it is a big deal, but then again, I'm pretty consistent that many slurs, be they gendered or even slightly racially tinged, aren't a big deal. At least, in certain contexts (and can become big deals in other contexts, say, an employer saying them to an employee).

I said it wasn't sexist because it isn't about the gender of the person, it is about their attitude and what they are doing. If it were men doing it, they would probably be Darens, but it still wouldn't be about their gender, it would be about what they are doing.

Well, that's a facile analysis. It's amazing to me, you are clearly not a stupid person. But imagine if I called people "Mary" to mean cowardly and afraid, based on the stereotype that Marys are cowardly and afraid. That is clearly sexist in the sense that it is stereotyping based on gender. Karen, similarly, is a stereotype based specifically and explicitly on middle aged white women. For some reason, you imagine this isn't sexist because it isn't specifically about their gender. Fine, if that's the (strange and inconsistent) way you want to define something being sexist. But it is certainly a stereotype about a particular racial and sexual category of people. Go ahead and defend that.