For those who think the IDF kills too many civilians

[Loren Pechtel]

https://www.commentarymagazine.com/foreign-policy/middle-east/raqqa-says-gazas-death-toll/

We have yet another example of how western forces fare against dug-in Islamists.

 

[beero1000]

So the rebuttal is "they kill more per capita, after fiddling with the statistics"?

 

[untermensche]

What?

Israel invaded Gaza merely because it wanted to.

It could negotiate a settlement and end this any time it wanted to.

But it wants to kill and torture.

Many Israelis are insane racists.

 

[laughing dog]

How many dead civilians is "just right"?

 

[Frikki]

How many dead civilians is "just right"?

Well if they are brow then Loren will probably want more. His motto is of "If it´s brown then gun it down."

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

So the rebuttal is "they kill more per capita, after fiddling with the statistics"?

Seems like it. It's something like, "when we count dead guys this way, this way and this after accounting for that, then so-and-so isn't as bad as something else." By the same logic, 9/11 wasn't tragic and Israel has no reason to be upset when an army kidnaps a single soldier.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

https://www.commentarymagazine.com/foreign-policy/middle-east/raqqa-says-gazas-death-toll/

We have yet another example of how western forces fare against dug-in Islamists.

People have died needlessly on both sides. And while the Palestinians are most likely to be the cause of needless suffering from a militia end, Palestinians are most likely to be the source of needless suffering via Governmental policies of the Israelis. It is a mess there and one of the bigger problems is that many are too busy pointing fingers instead of trying to even care about wanting to solve the problem.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

What?

Israel invaded Gaza merely because it wanted to.

It could negotiate a settlement and end this any time it wanted to.

But it wants to kill and torture.

Many Israelis are insane racists.

The only terms acceptable to Hamas is the destruction of Israel. How is Israel supposed to negotiate a reasonable solution?

As for those of you who object about the statistics--what they are doing is quite valid. Civilian deaths are a function of weapon accuracy and the number of civilians present. When the vast majority of civilians have left the area of course this reduces the civilian death toll. Since Hamas keeps people at ground zero at gunpoint there's no issue of leaving the area in Gaza.

 

[Arctish]

What?

Israel invaded Gaza merely because it wanted to.

It could negotiate a settlement and end this any time it wanted to.

But it wants to kill and torture.

Many Israelis are insane racists.

The only terms acceptable to Hamas is the destruction of Israel. How is Israel supposed to negotiate a reasonable solution?

As for those of you who object about the statistics--what they are doing is quite valid. Civilian deaths are a function of weapon accuracy and the number of civilians present. When the vast majority of civilians have left the area of course this reduces the civilian death toll. Since Hamas keeps people at ground zero at gunpoint there's no issue of leaving the area in Gaza.

That sounds like an argument for Israel to open up the crossings and allow Gazan civilians to leave the Strip when hostilities break out.

 

[untermensche]

What?

Israel invaded Gaza merely because it wanted to.

It could negotiate a settlement and end this any time it wanted to.

But it wants to kill and torture.

Many Israelis are insane racists.

The only terms acceptable to Hamas is the destruction of Israel. How is Israel supposed to negotiate a reasonable solution?

As for those of you who object about the statistics--what they are doing is quite valid. Civilian deaths are a function of weapon accuracy and the number of civilians present. When the vast majority of civilians have left the area of course this reduces the civilian death toll. Since Hamas keeps people at ground zero at gunpoint there's no issue of leaving the area in Gaza.

Hamas is what you get when you fail to negotiate.

You get a normal government when you negotiate and give people their normal rights.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

The only terms acceptable to Hamas is the destruction of Israel. How is Israel supposed to negotiate a reasonable solution?

As for those of you who object about the statistics--what they are doing is quite valid. Civilian deaths are a function of weapon accuracy and the number of civilians present. When the vast majority of civilians have left the area of course this reduces the civilian death toll. Since Hamas keeps people at ground zero at gunpoint there's no issue of leaving the area in Gaza.

That sounds like an argument for Israel to open up the crossings and allow Gazan civilians to leave the Strip when hostilities break out.

Please note the last sentence of what you quoted.

When Israel sends warning of hitting a weapons depot Hamas is known to force the people to stay at ground zero and get killed. The only people Hamas would allow to use the crossings would be terrorists.

- - - Updated - - -

The only terms acceptable to Hamas is the destruction of Israel. How is Israel supposed to negotiate a reasonable solution?

As for those of you who object about the statistics--what they are doing is quite valid. Civilian deaths are a function of weapon accuracy and the number of civilians present. When the vast majority of civilians have left the area of course this reduces the civilian death toll. Since Hamas keeps people at ground zero at gunpoint there's no issue of leaving the area in Gaza.

Hamas is what you get when you fail to negotiate.

You get a normal government when you negotiate and give people their normal rights.

Hamas is what you get when the Islamists are looking for someone who won't negotiate to fund.

 

[Arctish]

That sounds like an argument for Israel to open up the crossings and allow Gazan civilians to leave the Strip when hostilities break out.

Please note the last sentence of what you quoted.

When Israel sends warning of hitting a weapons depot Hamas is known to force the people to stay at ground zero and get killed. The only people Hamas would allow to use the crossings would be terrorists.

Bullshit.

But let's suppose that it's true. It would be an even better reason to open up the crossings. If everyone coming through is a terrorist or working for terrorists, that makes it super easy to identify, surveil, and arrest them. Israel could absolutely cripple Hamas using your technique.

By Jove, I think you've got it!

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Please note the last sentence of what you quoted.

When Israel sends warning of hitting a weapons depot Hamas is known to force the people to stay at ground zero and get killed. The only people Hamas would allow to use the crossings would be terrorists.

Bullshit.

But let's suppose that it's true. It would be an even better reason to open up the crossings. If everyone coming through is a terrorist or working for terrorists, that makes it super easy to identify, surveil, and arrest them. Israel could absolutely cripple Hamas using your technique.

By Jove, I think you've got it!

If Israel lets them through and then captures them that's not really letting them through.

 

[Arctish]

Bullshit.

But let's suppose that it's true. It would be an even better reason to open up the crossings. If everyone coming through is a terrorist or working for terrorists, that makes it super easy to identify, surveil, and arrest them. Israel could absolutely cripple Hamas using your technique.

By Jove, I think you've got it!

If Israel lets them through and then captures them that's not really letting them through.

Don't tell me you're getting all squeamish about capturing terrorists.

 

[untermensche]

Hamas is what you get when you fail to negotiate.

You get a normal government when you negotiate and give people their normal rights.

Hamas is what you get when the Islamists are looking for someone who won't negotiate to fund.

Hamas arose after decades of Israeli oppression and murder.

It is a response to decades of oppression and murder and torture.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

If Israel lets them through and then captures them that's not really letting them through.

Don't tell me you're getting all squeamish about capturing terrorists.

The point is if they were let through and then captured they wouldn't come in the first place.

- - - Updated - - -

Hamas is what you get when the Islamists are looking for someone who won't negotiate to fund.

Hamas arose after decades of Israeli oppression and murder.

It is a response to decades of oppression and murder and torture.

Hamas arose because the PLO was growing old and not violent enough for those who pour the money into war.

 

[laughing dog]

Don't tell me you're getting all squeamish about capturing terrorists.

The point is if they were let through and then captured they wouldn't come in the first place.

You need to explain your thought process because that remark appears to be so incredibly stupid, it is hard to believe you meant what you wrote.

 

[untermensche]

Hamas arose after decades of Israeli oppression and murder.

It is a response to decades of oppression and murder and torture.

Hamas arose because the PLO was growing old and not violent enough for those who pour the money into war.

It arose IN THE MIDST of decades of Israeli oppression and murder.

It is what you get when you carry out decades of oppression and murder.

Hamas is what oppression produces.

And then the oppressor uses it to justify further oppression.

As old a trick as oppression itself.

To not see it takes a special kind of blindness.

 

[Derec]

Hamas is what oppression produces.

Hamas is what Islamism produces. It is just the local version of Al Qaeda, Taliban, Hezbollah, Arakan Rohingya Salvation Army, Islamic State and many others.

 

[untermensche]

Hamas is what oppression produces.

Hamas is what Islamism produces. It is just the local version of Al Qaeda, Taliban, Hezbollah, Arakan Rohingya Salvation Army, Islamic State and many others.

What happened first?

Israeli oppression or Hamas?

Islamism is also what oppression produces.