History shows that atheism is as natural to humans as religion

[Potoooooooo]

http://www.pasthorizonspr.com/index...t-atheism-is-as-natural-to-humans-as-religion

Despite being written out of large parts of history, atheists thrived in the polytheistic societies of the ancient world – raising considerable doubts about whether humans really are “wired” for religion – a new study suggests.

The claim is the central proposition of a new book by Tim Whitmarsh, Professor of Greek Culture and a Fellow of St John’s College, University of Cambridge. In it, he suggests that atheism – which is typically seen as a modern phenomenon – was not just common in ancient Greece and pre-Christian Rome, but probably flourished more in those societies than in most civilisations since.

As a result, the study challenges two assumptions that prop up current debates between atheists and believers: Firstly, the idea that atheism is a modern point of view, and second, the idea of “religious universalism” – that humans are naturally predisposed, or “wired”, to believe in gods.

 

[Atheos]

I've never felt like the "wired for belief" thing was a compelling argument in favor of theism anyway. My lay observation is that many of the traits that helped our ancestors survive long enough to produce offspring are the very same ones that make us predisposed to religion. We evolved to favor religion. Religion wasn't programmed into us by intentional design.

I think this is evidenced by a couple of basic traits commonly found in humans: Superstition and Respect for Authority Figures

Superstition is little else besides the misfiring of a trait that helped us find food or avoid predators in harsher times: Abstract association. Most animal life forms have this ability and can learn to associate a sound with food (Pavlov's dog) or a certain cloud pattern with bad weather, etc. Someone once observed a black cat not long before some disaster struck and thus was borne a superstition. Confirmation bias takes over and the superstition becomes the foundation of a religion.

Respect for authority figures was critical during times in environments where we weren't at the top of the food chain. Children who didn't listen to their parents got eaten. The "listen to grownups" trait was definitely selected for. But grownups don't always tell the truth. Sometimes this is intentional, sometimes it's because they, themselves are deceived or ignorant. This trait can misfire into causing the individual to expect there to always be an authority to appeal to (and imagine an ultimate authority).

There are certainly other traits that probably could be enumerated as well. These two are the ones that seem most applicable to me.

 

[Keith&Co.]

I've never felt like the "wired for belief" thing was a compelling argument in favor of theism anyway.

I did.
Until Syed used it...

 

[fromderinside]

My lay observation is that many of the traits that helped our ancestors survive long enough to produce offspring are the very same ones that make us predisposed to religion. We evolved to favor religion. Religion wasn't programmed into us by intentional design.

Surely those elements you mention are programmed in to us. No one needs intention to see how those came to be by happenstance. So unless your construction is that religion must be intentionally programmed in to us religion is programmed in to us. We jump to conclusions based on little or no information that we keep as guides, in other words religion. Its just not by design its a natural consequence of systems with insufficient information making judgments based on that and horseshit, religion. Now if one can find an intentional religion I'll examine that. Until then we operate as (common term) religious beings.

As for atheism being an intentional design well you where the sun doesn't shine for that one. There is little evidence we are slot machines, we always look outside our selves for explanation.

 

[4321lynx]

http://www.pasthorizonspr.com/index...t-atheism-is-as-natural-to-humans-as-religion

Despite being written out of large parts of history, atheists thrived in the polytheistic societies of the ancient world – raising considerable doubts about whether humans really are “wired” for religion – a new study suggests.

The study covers only two advanced, voyaging, colonising, conquering, war waging, philosophising civilisations, not the beginnings of the human race, not even the tribal group's religions or beliefs. No general remarks about religion antedating these two civilisations studied are valid.

 

[Atheos]

I've never felt like the "wired for belief" thing was a compelling argument in favor of theism anyway.

I did.
Until Syed used it...

It's about as well supported a position as claiming that the U.S. Constitution was based on the Buybull.

 

[Lion IRC]

Atheism has always been an available menu option.

The enigma is why, after ~50,000 years, atheism still hasn't made it into the big league.
After all, atheists are so much smarter than everyone else, so why can't they persuade the rest of us that no God/gods exist?

 

[skepticalbip]

Atheism has always been an available menu option.

The enigma is why, after ~50,000 years, atheism still hasn't made it into the big league.
After all, atheists are so much smarter than everyone else, so why can't they persuade the rest of us that no God/gods exist?

Probably because there are a hell of a lot of people who find it difficult to question authority and think for themselves. Christians in the US would be devout Hindus if they had been born in Delhi or devout Muslims if they were born in Libya because that would be the faith of their authority figures when they were growing up.

 

[couch_sloth]

Atheism has always been an available menu option.

The enigma is why, after ~50,000 years, atheism still hasn't made it into the big league.
After all, atheists are so much smarter than everyone else, so why can't they persuade the rest of us that no God/gods exist?

Probably because there are a hell of a lot of people who find it difficult to question authority and think for themselves. Christians in the US would be devout Hindus if they had been born in Delhi or devout Muslims if they were born in Libya because that would be the faith of their authority figures when they were growing up.

In a lot of cases, non-belief is seen as a rejection of your culture. And unbelief is punishable by eternal damnation and torture (Not believing is always your fault).
It's no wonder why people avoid going down this path of inquiry.

 

[Lion IRC]

...Christians in the US would be devout Hindus if they had been born in Delhi or devout Muslims if they were born in Libya because that would be the faith of their authority figures when they were growing up.

I was born and raised in a hedonistic, materialistic, secular country thousands of miles away and thousands of years apart from the birth place of Christianity.

I should be smoking weed and worshipping Mamon and going to sex orgies in honor of Aphrodite/Eros.

 

[Keith&Co.]

I was born and raised in a hedonistic, materialistic, secular country thousands of miles away and thousands of years apart from the birth place of Christianity.

You're saying that NONE of the founders of your society imported their religion along with their language?

How did you come to be Christain, then?

 

[skepticalbip]

...Christians in the US would be devout Hindus if they had been born in Delhi or devout Muslims if they were born in Libya because that would be the faith of their authority figures when they were growing up.

I was born and raised in a hedonistic, materialistic, secular country thousands of miles away and thousands of years apart from the birth place of Christianity.

I should be smoking weed and worshipping Mamon and going to sex orgies in honor of Aphrodite/Eros.

Are you saying that your parents, their relatives, and their friends were hedonistic, materialistic, secular, pot smoking worshipers of Mamon who frequented sex orgies in honor of Eros?

They sound interesting. So where was it that you heard about Jesus?

 

[Keith&Co.]

Are you saying that your parents, their relatives, and their friends were hedonistic, materialistic, secular, pot smoking worshipers of Mamon who frequented sex orgies in honor of Eros?

Must be. Atheism is certainly much more boring...

I've been an atheist for about 40 years, don't even smoke tobacco, never hired a prostitute, don't worship anything, and the only woman i've ever slept with is Mrs. &Co. She's upstairs, right now, getting ready for our 10:00 bedtime.

Oh! But we do have a waterbed! Is that hedonistic? We just really like the heat coming off the thing in the winter.

 

[Colonel Sanders]

It's also usually part of family. Growing up my family was quite religious, and we all loved each other very much. Looking back, I know that as a kid, I associated a lot of that with our Baptist upbringing.

Still though, it takes fear to maintain belief. Fear of death, fear of what, if anything that comes with it. And to entertain "love of God" or anything similarly absurd is just that--absurd. The same goes for morals and values and whatever else that faith loves to claim as its domain. But that it appeals to people. Consciousness of your own mortality can make you believe crazy shit.

As for atheists in history, of course there have always been non-believers, just as there have always been gay people. The punishment and ostracizing for either would have been enough to get almost everyone to church on time and in the closet.

 

[Lion IRC]

I was born and raised in a hedonistic, materialistic, secular country thousands of miles away and thousands of years apart from the birth place of Christianity.

I should be smoking weed and worshipping Mamon and going to sex orgies in honor of Aphrodite/Eros.

Are you saying that your parents, their relatives, and their friends were hedonistic, materialistic, secular, pot smoking worshipers of Mamon who frequented sex orgies in honor of Eros?

They sound interesting. So where was it that you heard about Jesus?

From the bible.

 

[Juma]

Are you saying that your parents, their relatives, and their friends were hedonistic, materialistic, secular, pot smoking worshipers of Mamon who frequented sex orgies in honor of Eros?

They sound interesting. So where was it that you heard about Jesus?

From the bible.

Who showed you the bible?

 

[skepticalbip]

Are you saying that your parents, their relatives, and their friends were hedonistic, materialistic, secular, pot smoking worshipers of Mamon who frequented sex orgies in honor of Eros?

They sound interesting. So where was it that you heard about Jesus?

From the bible.

Are you saying that you just happened to find a bible in a hotel night stand and was curious about just what the hell it was? That you went to the hotel in an alcohol and pot induced stupor to join a sex orgy with your parents and all their hedonistic friends and just saw it there, opened it, and was instantly reborn?

 

[Lion IRC]

From the bible.

Who showed you the bible?

Well, I would say that God showed me the bible but I know you're gonna argue that theism comes from humans and that they are the 'reason' why I think God exists.

But my point is about the genetic fallacy of presuming that people are only Christian/Atheist because of where they are born. It's clearly not the case because people can and do alter their views about God.

 

[credoconsolans]

Are you saying that your parents, their relatives, and their friends were hedonistic, materialistic, secular, pot smoking worshipers of Mamon who frequented sex orgies in honor of Eros?

Must be. Atheism is certainly much more boring...

I've been an atheist for about 40 years, don't even smoke tobacco, never hired a prostitute, don't worship anything, and the only woman i've ever slept with is Mrs. &Co. She's upstairs, right now, getting ready for our 10:00 bedtime.

Oh! But we do have a waterbed! Is that hedonistic? We just really like the heat coming off the thing in the winter.

Holy - ! That should put the fear of god in you. No leaks? Electrical heat wired to it and it has no leaks, right?

 

[Keith&Co.]

Well, I would say that God showed me the bible but I know you're gonna argue that theism comes from humans and that they are the 'reason' why I think God exists.

Oh, NO! You mean, you anticipate that someone might be showing their bias in the conversation?
Well, we wouldn't want that, would we?

I should be smoking weed and worshipping Mamon and going to sex orgies in honor of Aphrodite/Eros.

No, that would be tragic.