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How Could All the Prophets be Wrong About Trump?

Learner

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Or they were listening to a 'lying spirit' ;)


[YOUTUBE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mBPe8Zc6IwY[/YOUTUBE]
 

steve_bank

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I forget the name for it.

Christians constantly invent prophesy from scriptura interpretation in terms of current events.

Trump as an agent of god is just one example.
 

funinspace

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Alas, just some more 'Not a True Christian' fakers to add to the pile...so many fakers, so little time....
 

Keith&Co.

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Alas, just some more 'Not a True Christian' fakers to add to the pile...so many fakers, so little time....

Inot necessarily. God does say in scripture that if a prophet says something untrue, God's th e one that told them that.
Which is nice a guy sticking up for his minions, but it does mean we cannot actually trust prophets.
They might be telling us god's truth, they might be telling god's lies, so they are indistinguishable from false prophets.
 

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Haven't looked into it, but I got the impression that Trump is not a believer...that he gives lip service for the sake of image.
 

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“I was as entrenched as anyone was,” Johnson told CT in one of his first media interviews since he publicly repented in January and shut down his namesake ministry in March. “I tell people I feel like I’ve been rescued..."


Reminds me of that old joke about a drowning priest, god, two boats, and a helicopter.


When it comes to Trump's election loss, it's like (non-existent) god has sent two boats, a helicopter, a private jet with sexy flight attendants and bottle service, yet his followers are still like "yeah, I dunno...I think he's still president somehow and Joe Biden is the real sexual predator."
 

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Haven't looked into it, but I got the impression that Trump is not a believer...that he gives lip service for the sake of image.
C’mon, would a nonbeliever tear gas his way through a crowd just to hold his dear Bible in front of a church?? Really??
 

steve_bank

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Is it really news that politicians pander to Christians?
 

James Brown

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I forget the name for it.

Christians constantly invent prophesy from scriptura interpretation in terms of current events.

Trump as an agent of god is just one example.

False prophets? It's all in the bible for you to see.

And what is the Biblical remedy when someone is revealed to be a false prophet?

(Deuteronomy 18:20)
 

Learner

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I forget the name for it.

Christians constantly invent prophesy from scriptura interpretation in terms of current events.

Trump as an agent of god is just one example.

False prophets? It's all in the bible for you to see.

And what is the Biblical remedy when someone is revealed to be a false prophet?

(Deuteronomy 18:20)

A deterrent, being given a warning first, to be aware of ... otherwise, Judgement?

I certainly wouldn't want to be false-propheting after hearing that. :eek:
 

funinspace

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Alas, just some more 'Not a True Christian' fakers to add to the pile...so many fakers, so little time....

Inot necessarily. God does say in scripture that if a prophet says something untrue, God's th e one that told them that.
Which is nice a guy sticking up for his minions, but it does mean we cannot actually trust prophets.
They might be telling us god's truth, they might be telling god's lies, so they are indistinguishable from false prophets.

Well, I've heard that Loki goes by several pseudonyms...
 

Keith&Co.

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Alas, just some more 'Not a True Christian' fakers to add to the pile...so many fakers, so little time....

Inot necessarily. God does say in scripture that if a prophet says something untrue, God's th e one that told them that.
Which is nice a guy sticking up for his minions, but it does mean we cannot actually trust prophets.
They might be telling us god's truth, they might be telling god's lies, so they are indistinguishable from false prophets.

Well, I've heard that Loki goes by several pseudonyms...

Loki? Nah, he cannot go by anything with a pulse...
 

steve_bank

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Working fusion reactors and judgment day has always been just around the corner.
 

steve_bank

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If ypu go by the gospels the apostles thought it would be in the near term. The spin and interpretation and rationalizations began quickly to explain way things went as they did despite the gospels.
 

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It was meant to happen within a generation. That some alive at the time would see Jesus return in the clouds with the host of heaven.
 

Learner

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Revelation seems to put that line "some alive at the time..." into a different perspective, in context. As in Luke, Every eye will see Christ's return!

Matthew 24:14
And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.
 

DBT

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Revelation seems to put that line "some alive at the time..." into a different perspective, in context. As in Luke, Every eye will see Christ's return!

Matthew 24:14
And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

Which doesn't alter the words, the promise and the expectation that the event would happen within their lifetime, not thousands of years in the future....and still waiting.
 

steve_bank

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When all else fails, quote scripture and declare victory.
 

Learner

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Which doesn't alter the words, the promise and the expectation that the event would happen within their lifetime, not thousands of years in the future....and still waiting.

Every eye will see Christ's return.
 

DBT

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Which doesn't alter the words, the promise and the expectation that the event would happen within their lifetime, not thousands of years in the future....and still waiting.

Every eye will see Christ's return.

Correct....within the lifetime of those standing there listening to the words and their promise, as described, for 'all the tribes on Earth to see.'
 

Learner

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Which doesn't alter the words, the promise and the expectation that the event would happen within their lifetime, not thousands of years in the future....and still waiting.

Every eye will see Christ's return.

Correct....within the lifetime of those standing there listening to the words and their promise, as described, for 'all the tribes on Earth to see.'

And, that would be before the sequence of events in Revelation, i.e. the anti-christ who, as it's written appears first which would be by then a one world system of unified nations and armies, fighting against his return?
 

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Correct....within the lifetime of those standing there listening to the words and their promise, as described, for 'all the tribes on Earth to see.'

And, that would be before the sequence of events in Revelation, i.e. the anti-christ who appears first which would be a one world system, a unified world of nations and armies, fighting against his return?

All that is described was expected to occur within a generation or so, as expressed by the first generation of Christians.
 

Learner

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Correct....within the lifetime of those standing there listening to the words and their promise, as described, for 'all the tribes on Earth to see.'

And, that would be before the sequence of events in Revelation, i.e. the anti-christ who appears first which would be a one world system, a unified world of nations and armies, fighting against his return?

All that is described was expected to occur within a generation or so, as expressed by the first generation of Christians.

You are relying on just a single verse or line for the whole context.
 

DBT

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All that is described was expected to occur within a generation or so, as expressed by the first generation of Christians.

You are relying on just a single verse or line for the whole context.

Far from it. Luke, Mark, Matt, Paul...I'd quote but I'm posting on my phone.
 

steve_bank

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When all else fails, quote scripture and declare victory.

You can only but quote scripture when debating or discussing prophets and prophesy. The victory is all God's, I would say of course.


And that my friend is THE issue. Christians always try ti show horn everything into an ancient text of unknown authorship.

If oinething des not directly fit, interpret. Justfy today by interpretation, for example Trump being an agent of god.


Christians constantly spin interanion to match current events to fill an end time narrative. During the peak of the Cold War and Russian/Chinese communism there was Christian eschatology turning some OTreference to a battle between and a bear, eagle, and dragoon or some creature into an end time conflict between USA, Russia, and China.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eschatology

Eschatology /ˌɛskəˈtɒlədʒi/ (About this soundlisten) is a part of theology concerned with the final events of history, or the ultimate destiny of humanity. This concept is commonly referred to as "the end of the world" or "end times".[1]

The word arises from the Greek ἔσχατος éschatos meaning "last" and -logy meaning "the study of", and first appeared in English around 1844.[2] The Oxford English Dictionary defines eschatology as "the part of theology concerned with death, judgment, and the final destiny of the soul and of humankind".[3]

In the context of mysticism, the term refers metaphorically to the end of ordinary reality and to reunion with the divine. Many[quantify] religions treat eschatology as a future event prophesied in sacred texts or in folklore.

Eschatologies vary as to their degree of optimism or pessimism about the future. In some eschatologies, conditions are better for some and worse for others, e.g. "heaven and hell". They also vary as to time frames. Groups claiming the end of times to be imminent are also referred to as doomsday cults.
 

Learner

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And that my friend is THE issue. Christians always try ti show horn everything into an ancient text of unknown authorship.

If oinething des not directly fit, interpret. Justfy today by interpretation, for example Trump being an agent of god.

Christians constantly spin interanion to match current events to fill an end time narrative. During the peak of the Cold War and Russian/Chinese communism there was Christian eschatology turning some OTreference to a battle between and a bear, eagle, and dragoon or some creature into an end time conflict between USA, Russia, and China.

Well there's 'shoe horning' and there's genuine investigation and research for truth... i.e. 'comparing' similarities of prophesied events to events that may happen, otherwise it just defeats the purpose as being a 'believer' in every sense of the word, when being dishonest and delusional. Of course you may say all theists are "never" honest about such things, to which I say, that's your issue coz those honestly seeking the truth as they see it, exist.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eschatology

Eschatology /ˌɛskəˈtɒlədʒi/ (About this soundlisten) is a part of theology concerned with the final events of history, or the ultimate destiny of humanity. This concept is commonly referred to as "the end of the world" or "end times".[1]

The word arises from the Greek ἔσχατος éschatos meaning "last" and -logy meaning "the study of", and first appeared in English around 1844.[2] The Oxford English Dictionary defines eschatology as "the part of theology concerned with death, judgment, and the final destiny of the soul and of humankind".[3]

In the context of mysticism, the term refers metaphorically to the end of ordinary reality and to reunion with the divine. Many[quantify] religions treat eschatology as a future event prophesied in sacred texts or in folklore.

Eschatologies vary as to their degree of optimism or pessimism about the future. In some eschatologies, conditions are better for some and worse for others, e.g. "heaven and hell". They also vary as to time frames. Groups claiming the end of times to be imminent are also referred to as doomsday cults.

There's a whole variety of people under the banner of religion. I gather you never thought Christians can scrutinize, study and be critical of a lot of religious doomsday notions (including within the faith) too.
 

DBT

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Matt, Mark, Luke, describe an event and give a time frame for that event to happen: the return of Jesus in power and glory for all the tribes on Earth to see. When? Within the lifetime of those who standing there listening to the words and their promise.
 

steve_bank

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And that my friend is THE issue. Christians always try ti show horn everything into an ancient text of unknown authorship.

If oinething des not directly fit, interpret. Justfy today by interpretation, for example Trump being an agent of god.

Christians constantly spin interanion to match current events to fill an end time narrative. During the peak of the Cold War and Russian/Chinese communism there was Christian eschatology turning some OTreference to a battle between and a bear, eagle, and dragoon or some creature into an end time conflict between USA, Russia, and China.

Well there's 'shoe horning' and there's genuine investigation and research for truth... i.e. 'comparing' similarities of prophesied events to events that may happen, otherwise it just defeats the purpose as being a 'believer' in every sense of the word, when being dishonest and delusional. Of course you may say all theists are "never" honest about such things, to which I say, that's your issue coz those honestly seeking the truth as they see it, exist.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eschatology

Eschatology /ˌɛskəˈtɒlədʒi/ (About this soundlisten) is a part of theology concerned with the final events of history, or the ultimate destiny of humanity. This concept is commonly referred to as "the end of the world" or "end times".[1]

The word arises from the Greek ἔσχατος éschatos meaning "last" and -logy meaning "the study of", and first appeared in English around 1844.[2] The Oxford English Dictionary defines eschatology as "the part of theology concerned with death, judgment, and the final destiny of the soul and of humankind".[3]

In the context of mysticism, the term refers metaphorically to the end of ordinary reality and to reunion with the divine. Many[quantify] religions treat eschatology as a future event prophesied in sacred texts or in folklore.

Eschatologies vary as to their degree of optimism or pessimism about the future. In some eschatologies, conditions are better for some and worse for others, e.g. "heaven and hell". They also vary as to time frames. Groups claiming the end of times to be imminent are also referred to as doomsday cults.

There's a whole variety of people under the banner of religion. I gather you never thought Christians can scrutinize, study and be critical of a lot of religious doomsday notions (including within the faith) too.

Some yes, in general no.

For Christians to question is to deny fundamental beliefs. As yo said, what else is there but scripture to quote.

In my view Christianityi s no different than any other belief system. As in the links, form and cultural context change but the underlying psychology is always the same.

A few changes in the path of history and Islam would have dominated Europe.

All religions range form the liberal to the extreme zealots. American religion range from accepting gays, pro abortion rights, and female ministers to extreme conservative patriarchal and nysogynist.

In the 90s the American Anglican church went through an acrimonious split over gay rights. The anti gay faction aligned with a virulent anti gay congregation in Uganda.

The common thread is how one interprets scripture. The OT and NT were not written as an authorities guide to morality abd is not consistent. They are disjointed writings that survived. That leaves it open to wide interpretation.


In the gospels I se Jesus as a pacifist. Suffer your situation and you will be in heven with him. He was not a Spartacus, Gahndi, or MLK at least from the gospels.

All are welcome to beliefs, it is what our western systems are about. self determination. That being said there is a saying, your
right to extend your elbow ends at my nose. American Christians are intrusive. They try to put prayers and religion in public schools and force the Pledge Of Allegiance which invokes god.

The intrusiveness is based on an interpretaion of scripture that they have a a mandate from a god to preach to and convert the world.
 
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