Is there a God of atheism?

[ideologyhunter]

Greg Giraldo (2006):
"The last Pope, everybody said, was a saint...They have evidence that he performed miracles. You think the Pope performed miracles? He died of a urinary tract infection. He had less magic powers than cranberry juice. Somehow I'm supposed to believe he had quite a bag of tricks up his sleeve."

 

[DBT]

Hope is the god of theism.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

Hope is the god of theism.

Maybe. But based on my personal experience the god of theism is woo. No, it's Woo. I honestly see no difference between the two. We worshipped woo as kids and as young adults. Some people continue to worship woo all the way to the grave.

 

[southernhybrid]

Woah woah woah, I thought the RCC's product was rituals. FFS sacraments, the communion of saints, and the Mass, which is their central liturgical ritual. The community is just a bunch of gullibly loyal customers like those who only purchase Apple products.

Nope.

I'm guessing you aren't a Catholic, and only know about it from protestant sources? Like US? Maybe you're just being snarky?

I dunno.

Being a cradle Catholic, I've got no problem criticizing Mother Church. She can be a royal bitch. But I get touchy when idiots do it.
Tom

Name something the catholic church has that no other Hebrew scripture based church has and the word rituals will flow from your lips.

RCC's product is community

Woah woah woah, I thought the RCC's product was rituals. FFS sacraments, the communion of saints, and the Mass, which is their central liturgical ritual. The community is just a bunch of gullibly loyal customers like those who only purchase Apple products.

Nope.

I'm guessing you aren't a Catholic, and only know about it from protestant sources? Like US? Maybe you're just being snarky?

I dunno.

Being a cradle Catholic, I've got no problem criticizing Mother Church. She can be a royal bitch. But I get touchy when idiots do it.
Tom

Name something the catholic church has that no other Hebrew scripture based church has and the word rituals will flow from your lips.

Catholics have a pope who presumes to be the word of god on religious matters.

I thought the answer would be purgatory. I don't know of any other Christian religion that has purgatory. Evangelicals only have heaven and eternal hell fire and damnation. At least Catholics give one a chance of getting out of purgatory. I wan't raised Catholic most of my childhood friends were Catholics and Mr. Sohy was raised Catholic.

Being married to my first husband was like purgatory, sort of like hell, but only temporary.

 

[DBT]

Hope is the god of theism.

Maybe. But based on my personal experience the god of theism is woo. No, it's Woo. I honestly see no difference between the two. We worshipped woo as kids and as young adults. Some people continue to worship woo all the way to the grave.

Woo as the means to Hope. Big promises on offer, eternal life in paradise, an end to pain and suffering.....

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

Hope is the god of theism.

Maybe. But based on my personal experience the god of theism is woo. No, it's Woo. I honestly see no difference between the two. We worshipped woo as kids and as young adults. Some people continue to worship woo all the way to the grave.

Woo as the means to Hope. Big promises on offer, eternal life in paradise, an end to pain and suffering.....

Is it really paradise, though? I mean, it's an eternity playing Monopoly with a bunch of Mormons....

 

[DBT]

Hope is the god of theism.

Maybe. But based on my personal experience the god of theism is woo. No, it's Woo. I honestly see no difference between the two. We worshipped woo as kids and as young adults. Some people continue to worship woo all the way to the grave.

Woo as the means to Hope. Big promises on offer, eternal life in paradise, an end to pain and suffering.....

Is it really paradise, though? I mean, it's an eternity playing Monopoly with a bunch of Mormons....

Well, we are told that there was a revolt in heaven, a third of the host of heaven led by brightest and best...so conditions may not be so perfect or heavenly in paradise.

 

[Gospel]

I find myself pondering the extraordinary circumstances that could have incited a rebellion in heaven, especially given the undeniable fact that God's power is invincible. What could have been so egregiously wrong or intolerable that it made individuals prefer a seemingly doomed uprising over acquiescence?

 

[James Brown]

Yes, Free will in Paradise is apparently not the ideal scenario that certain believers who are Desperately Seeking Heaven seem to think it is.

God has created two environments that are supposedly perfect and populated them with sinless free-willed beings, and in both cases things fell apart. But for some reason, my Christian friends tell me that when we all get to Heaven what a day of rejoicing that will be.

Third time's the charm, I suppose.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Indeed, it is amazing how petty the heavenly beings are.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

Hope is the god of theism.

Maybe. But based on my personal experience the god of theism is woo. No, it's Woo. I honestly see no difference between the two. We worshipped woo as kids and as young adults. Some people continue to worship woo all the way to the grave.

Woo as the means to Hope. Big promises on offer, eternal life in paradise, an end to pain and suffering.....

Is it really paradise, though? I mean, it's an eternity playing Monopoly with a bunch of Mormons....

Well, we are told that there was a revolt in heaven, a third of the host of heaven led by brightest and best...so conditions may not be so perfect or heavenly in paradise.

Yes. And at some point in a person's intellectual journey they begin to make these observations, or hopefully begin to make these observations. But some people don't. As a result the fascination with and attraction to woo remains strong their entire lives. This doesn't mean they are stupid or there is something "wrong" with them. It's just a different neurological inheritance in the upstairs, no different than a set physical inheritance in the downstairs. Of course it is affected by the external environment as well.

If churches were communities first and woo second they would be healthier communities. It's rather having to continue with your kindergarten classes your entire life because it's perceived as unlucky and therefore dangerous to not keep repeating kindergarten behavior.

 

[Gospel]

Yes, Free will in Paradise is apparently not the ideal scenario that certain believers who are Desperately Seeking Heaven seem to think it is.

God has created two environments that are supposedly perfect and populated them with sinless free-willed beings, and in both cases things fell apart. But for some reason, my Christian friends tell me that when we all get to Heaven what a day of rejoicing that will be.

Third time's the charm, I suppose.

Unfortunately, the third attempt did not yield the desired success either. Consider great flood for further context.

 

[Gospel]

In my opinion, for atheism, the closest thing to a deity is evidence.

 

[southernhybrid]

"When we've been there 10,000 years, bright shining as the sun. We've no less days to sing god's praise then when we first begun".

That sounds like hell to me.

That's one of the lines from that awful hymn, "Amazing Grace", not to mention I don't think I'm a wretch who needs to be saved. The Christian religion does a good job of making people feel guilty.

Does anyone, who watched all of the early episodes, of "The Twilight Zone" remember an episode where the afterlife was the same place for everyone. In the episode a bad ass biker ends up with a boring farmer couple that he has nothing in common with and while the couple seem perfectly content, the biker is miserable. One person's heaven is another person's hell.

 

[EricH]

What do you want me to change into? It sounds like a conversion of some sort.

I reckon he’s talking about you changing into someone who hears the self describing statements of others and respects that they know more about themselves than you know about them.

But you don’t seem to be there at respecting our self-identifications yet.

We repsect yours. We believe you. You consider yourself an atheist but you still have some god belief that you can’t let go of. An uncertain atheist. Got it. That’s you. We believe you.

You respect what I post? I can easily falsify that!
From Post #175

I think people are losing sight of the big picture and allowing themselves to be distracted by whatever tangent this fool throws in front of us. There is no God of atheism. If someone wants to argue there is, hold their feet to the fire and make them show their work.

How is it disrespectful to ask people to show their work, the evidence that supports their claims? It isn't.

[deleted]

 

[DrZoidberg]

I've often heard the religious, Christians in particular, refer to a "God of atheism." Depending on where you get your definitions, "God of atheism" appears to be an oxymoron. Many atheists define themselves as people without belief in God(s). Other atheists might see themselves as those who deny and argue against the objective existence of God(s). For them, God is just a figment of the imagination. They can't have a God if God is merely what other people cook up.

So although a God of atheism appears to be a very implausible idea, I don't see it as completely wrong-headed. Atheists can defend their faith with tenacity at least as fierce as theists defend their beliefs. Atheists have some unproved ideas that are upheld not with valid reason or strong evidence but with anger, abuse, and if possible, forced silence. That kind of behavior appears indicative of theistic belief--you must help God if he is to help you. Now, I'm not saying that atheists actually worship an all-mighty, anthropomorphic God sitting on a throne in the sky. But there does seem to be a counterpart there. Some central figure of existence who is truth itself who is to be served and pleased.

I don't think there's a God of Atheism. But I think atheists have gods. Just like you pointed out, God is a metaphor. When Dawkins style New Atheists attack the God concept they invariably argue against the dumbest definition of God.

I like Habermasses definition. "God is the metaphor for our hopes and dreams". It's just a handy short form for it. So when people tell their loved one's that a dearly departed will meet them again in Heaven, it's just a childish hope that they will. Since it has zero impact on how (sensible) people live their lives, it's a harmless belief to cling to and spread.

Lacan has another definition which I like. "God is an empty projection space upon which we project ourselves onto". So it's a way to honestly talk about ourselves in a roundabout way without making ourselves feel vulnerable. And this acts as a totem that holds our communities together. A bit like how us talking about gods and atheism brings this online community together. For various reasons religions in various ways trigger insecurities in us. Real or imagined. And that brings us together here.

I personally think that we need to get away from God ONLY being a supernatural being. It's certainly a definition. But it's such a rediculous definition that I don't think religions would have survived, if that's the only definition. Or as I have said many times, "It's gods is the least interesting part of any religion".

 

[Unknown Soldier]

When Dawkins style New Atheists attack the God concept they invariably argue against the dumbest definition of God.

That's saying a lot because there are some really dumb definitions of God. I like Dawkins' The God Delusion. Some people criticize it for not being sophisticated, but that's the fault of theology. They created a goofy God.

Lacan has another definition which I like. "God is an empty projection space upon which we project ourselves onto". So it's a way to honestly talk about ourselves in a roundabout way without making ourselves feel vulnerable. And this acts as a totem that holds our communities together. A bit like how us talking about gods and atheism brings this online community together. For various reasons religions in various ways trigger insecurities in us. Real or imagined. And that brings us together here.

I've noticed that people's Gods tend to share the opinions of the people who believe in them. For example, I used to know a Christian woman who was racist and objected to racially mixed couples. She said that God objected too.

I personally think that we need to get away from God ONLY being a supernatural being. It's certainly a definition. But it's such a rediculous definition that I don't think religions would have survived, if that's the only definition. Or as I have said many times, "It's gods is the least interesting part of any religion".

Even people who can't buy an anthropomorphic God still want a God. I suppose for them a "higher power" is better than no God at all, and even atheists need a God from time to time as long as that God isn't too obviously a God.

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

I don't think there's a God of Atheism. But I think atheists have gods. Just like you pointed out, God is a metaphor.

Not only is God a metaphor, but so are atheists. And have. And Do.

So, basically:
"Atheists" "Do" "Have" Gods."

 

[steve_bank]

The nature of theology.

Whether the bible god exists or not is not the issue. Christian theology in part is debating aspects of god ad nauseam for thousands of years.

Soldier has extended it to gods of atheism. An example of how theology evolves over time.

 

[bilby]

Even people who can't buy an anthropomorphic God still want a God. I suppose for them a "higher power" is better than no God at all, and even atheists need a God from time to time as long as that God isn't too obviously a God.

Your beliefs about my beliefs don't become magically true just because you really like to believe them.

I have no gods; I want no gods; I understand that there's not even anything coherent (much less real) about a "higher power"; And I have never needed a god in fifty three years of ups and downs in life.

The entire idea is absurd to me. The beliefs of believers changes that fact not one iota.