• Welcome to the new Internet Infidels Discussion Board, formerly Talk Freethought.

Jews not writing or pronouncing God's name...

excreationist

Married mouth-breather
Joined
Aug 29, 2000
Messages
2,078
Location
Australia
Basic Beliefs
Probably in a simulation
Often Jewish publications will write G‑d without the "o" instead of spelling the word properly. The Torah (Deuteronomy 12:4) prohibits us from erasing, destroying or desecrating the name of G‑d. G‑d has seven names in Hebrew that are considered holy and forbidden to destroy or erase.
In the Torah (start of the OT) God's name was written as YHWH because I think they didn't write down any of the vowels in Hebrew so that copies could be created more cheaply.

We Jews have an absolute obsession with avoiding uttering G‑d’s name. (Notice that we don’t even spell it out fully when writing the English word for G‑d. See: Why Don’t You Spell G‑d’s Name?) Actually, we are careful not to pronounce G‑d’s names except when reading the Torah or prayers.

Our caution is founded on an understanding of the third of the Ten Commandments, “You shall not take His name in vain.” Although this verse is classically interpreted as referring to a senseless oath using G‑d’s name, the avoidance of saying G‑d’s name extends to all expressions, except prayer and Torah study.
I think earlier on some people (e.g creators of KJV) thought that the full version of YHWH was "Jehovah".... I think it is possible that the current favourite, "Yahweh", might not be fully correct.

I think the Bible is very special (but mostly not historical) and it is interesting that it includes a kind of "He Who Must Not Be Named" (like Voldemort)
 

Politesse

Lux Aeterna
Joined
Feb 27, 2018
Messages
8,957
Location
Chochenyo Territory, US
Gender
nb; all pronouns fine
Basic Beliefs
Jedi Wayseeker
Often Jewish publications will write G‑d without the "o" instead of spelling the word properly. The Torah (Deuteronomy 12:4) prohibits us from erasing, destroying or desecrating the name of G‑d. G‑d has seven names in Hebrew that are considered holy and forbidden to destroy or erase.
In the Torah (start of the OT) God's name was written as YHWH because I think they didn't write down any of the vowels in Hebrew so that copies could be created more cheaply.

We Jews have an absolute obsession with avoiding uttering G‑d’s name. (Notice that we don’t even spell it out fully when writing the English word for G‑d. See: Why Don’t You Spell G‑d’s Name?) Actually, we are careful not to pronounce G‑d’s names except when reading the Torah or prayers.

Our caution is founded on an understanding of the third of the Ten Commandments, “You shall not take His name in vain.” Although this verse is classically interpreted as referring to a senseless oath using G‑d’s name, the avoidance of saying G‑d’s name extends to all expressions, except prayer and Torah study.
I think earlier on some people (e.g creators of KJV) thought that the full version of YHWH was "Jehovah".... I think it is possible that the current favourite, "Yahweh", might not be fully correct.

I think the Bible is very special (but mostly not historical) and it is interesting that it includes a kind of "He Who Must Not Be Named" (like Voldemort)
It's more "HE who should never be named lightly".
 

Jarhyn

Wizard
Joined
Mar 29, 2010
Messages
11,547
Gender
Androgyne; they/them
Basic Beliefs
Natural Philosophy, Game Theoretic Ethicist
Well they believed that uttering the name of God in completion was more like a cheat code than anything else....

Utter the tetragrammaton? God pays attention to you.

Utter the ineffable name? God eats out your ass and gives you a tender reach around.

Better be careful with who you let hear and know the cheat codes!

That said, if you accept simulationism (not a great choice but w/e) this would equate to thinking there were functional console access hacks, assumably exposed for a simulation admin, that humans can access but shouldn't.
 

excreationist

Married mouth-breather
Joined
Aug 29, 2000
Messages
2,078
Location
Australia
Basic Beliefs
Probably in a simulation
Well they believed that uttering the name of God in completion was more like a cheat code than anything else....

Utter the tetragrammaton? God pays attention to you.

Utter the ineffable name? God eats out your ass and gives you a tender reach around.

Better be careful with who you let hear and know the cheat codes!

That said, if you accept simulationism (not a great choice but w/e) this would equate to thinking there were functional console access hacks, assumably exposed for a simulation admin, that humans can access but shouldn't.
I think I'm probably in a simulation and that an intelligent force exists but I think it is non-obvious (see Futurama God quotes)

As far as secret knowledge giving special abilities goes, I think to skeptics this would always be seen as involving coincidence, delusions or hallucinations (or fraud). (so that the simulation stays immersive and fairly indistinguishable from base reality)

Here is my story about when I believed I was in a simulation and weird things happened (I hypnotised myself then was catatonic)

8l55DvY.jpg


 

excreationist

Married mouth-breather
Joined
Aug 29, 2000
Messages
2,078
Location
Australia
Basic Beliefs
Probably in a simulation
Well they believed that uttering the name of God in completion was more like a cheat code than anything else....
That is related to the plot of the black and white movie "Pi".
Early in the film, when Lenny begins talking with Max about his work, he asks if Max is familiar with kabbalah. The numerological interpretation of the Torah and the 216-letter name of God, known as the Shem HaMeforash, are important concepts in traditional Jewish mysticism.
And I think the numbers involved on his computer could be translated into Hebrew letters.
 

excreationist

Married mouth-breather
Joined
Aug 29, 2000
Messages
2,078
Location
Australia
Basic Beliefs
Probably in a simulation
Better be careful with who you let hear and know the cheat codes!

That said, if you accept simulationism (not a great choice but w/e) this would equate to thinking there were functional console access hacks, assumably exposed for a simulation admin, that humans can access but shouldn't.
I'd consider the code in Futurama's Bender's Big Score to be a cheat code - it allows time travel


 

Jarhyn

Wizard
Joined
Mar 29, 2010
Messages
11,547
Gender
Androgyne; they/them
Basic Beliefs
Natural Philosophy, Game Theoretic Ethicist
Well they believed that uttering the name of God in completion was more like a cheat code than anything else....
That is related to the plot of the black and white movie "Pi".
Early in the film, when Lenny begins talking with Max about his work, he asks if Max is familiar with kabbalah. The numerological interpretation of the Torah and the 216-letter name of God, known as the Shem HaMeforash, are important concepts in traditional Jewish mysticism.
And I think the numbers involved on his computer could be translated into Hebrew letters.

See also the Toledot Yeshu, where this is also described, with Yeshu learning the Shem Hameforash, the ineffable name, and then doing all manner of cheeky shit with it.

The movie was about a very old superstition about this cheat code
 

excreationist

Married mouth-breather
Joined
Aug 29, 2000
Messages
2,078
Location
Australia
Basic Beliefs
Probably in a simulation
BTW about a 216 letter/digit name - in base 6 that's 1000....
I think base 6 is the best base (I like how the digits go from 0 to 5 like a star).... you can count to 35 (or "55") using both hands in base 6....
Base 6 is called senary...
 

excreationist

Married mouth-breather
Joined
Aug 29, 2000
Messages
2,078
Location
Australia
Basic Beliefs
Probably in a simulation
On the other hand 216 is 6 x 6 x 6.....

That's very interesting - that the apparent holy name is linked to the number of the beast....
 
Last edited:

excreationist

Married mouth-breather
Joined
Aug 29, 2000
Messages
2,078
Location
Australia
Basic Beliefs
Probably in a simulation
That is related to the plot of the black and white movie "Pi".

That excerpt mentioned theta / the golden ratio - that is related to base 6 because the highest digit is a 5 and is related to the pentagram:
theta_pentagram.png
Also:
it appears, notably, in black hole physics: the golden ratio is precisely the point where a black hole’s modified heat changes from positive to negative, and it is part of the equation for the lower bound on black hole entropy. The golden ratio even relates to the loop quantum gravity parameter to black hole entropy. The three formulas respectively can be seen in this graphic:
backholes.png

So I'm talking about examples of the golden ratio that are a lot more impressive than what was mentioned in the movie.

The odd thing is that when I was really delusional about things like this my thoughts were nonsense rather than talking about these connections involving the golden ratio, etc.
From December 2005:
The matrix - the theory of everything...

As I get closer to this, sabotage seems to keep on happening...
I think I know why...
Because my primary mode of thinking is binary (avoid or don't avoid pain)
And the average of the solution would be the centre of the matrix, and the centre of the matrix = dream/indeterminate/fantasy

I'm already getting very close to it...

Basically it is a 3 x 9 x 3 matrix...

The x is value (truth/false, valuable, worthless)

x=0,y=0,z=0 is indeterminate morality, value, magic.

Note I'm getting confused - I had mixed up x with y... when going from intuitive to logical thinking it reverses...
the y is active/passive (seek/avoid) - it works as a neural network. Intuitive/analogue people think using a neural network.

....

I think the matrix is binary = 3x9x3 spots (keep getting mixed up) = 81
And I think that it is 2^81 combinations =

2417851639229258349412352 combinations of concepts/ideas
After this I'm going to x=2, y=1 (this matrix is noisy I think? or just thinking too much using magic logic), z=1....

That is where the machine logic mind rests. It doesn't feel - except during sexual type connections where it crosses over to x=-2 y=-1 z=-1.

Maybe true knowledge of the machine mind is a bad thing since it leads to coming to a single spot which is static and not magical (it's "real"), has value, has no intuition/emotion

so choose your path... x = morality (avoid pain/indeterminate/seek pleasure) y = value (true/interminate/false) z = magic (real/indeterminate/imaginary)

If you don't choose a path goto indeterminate...
 
Last edited:

excreationist

Married mouth-breather
Joined
Aug 29, 2000
Messages
2,078
Location
Australia
Basic Beliefs
Probably in a simulation
Jews NEVER say Yaweh
BTW apparently they have used "Adonai" which is Hebrew for Lord.
[Masoretes] gave the word YHWH the vowels of Adonai, to remind the reader to say Adonai instead. It is thought by some that later Biblical scholars mistook this vowel substitution for the actual spelling of YHWH and interpreted the name of God as "Jehovah".
 

HaRaAYaH

Member
Joined
Mar 1, 2008
Messages
246
Location
USA
Basic Beliefs
Sacred Humanist
Jews NEVER say Yaweh
BTW apparently they have used "Adonai" which is Hebrew for Lord.
[Masoretes] gave the word YHWH the vowels of Adonai, to remind the reader to say Adonai instead. It is thought by some that later Biblical scholars mistook this vowel substitution for the actual spelling of YHWH and interpreted the name of God as "Jehovah".
I know what the word

יְהֹוָֽה
is
Yaweh and Jehovah are not used by Jews.

They sometimes use Hashem (the name) or Ha-hodush-Bora-a-chu. The Holy one blessed be he.
 

Swammerdami

Squadron Leader
Staff member
Joined
Dec 16, 2017
Messages
3,042
Location
Land of Smiles
Basic Beliefs
pseudo-deism
Miscellaneous comments:

(1) Perhaps the earliest reference to the name "Yahweh" comes from 15th-century Egyptian lists:
Yhw (in) the land of the Shasu
Shasu was a place (or ethnic group) to the south or southeast of the Dead Sea; this is at or near Edom, the nation allegedly founded by Esau, Jacob's brother. (Cite: Redford, who cites Giveon's Shosou for the early 18th-dynasty origin of the "lists from Soleb and Amarah".)

(2) It was often thought that knowing the name of a person, god or demon gave power over that entity. This is illustrated in the New Testament when Jesus does an exorcism:
Mark's Gospel 5 verse 9 said:
And [Jesus] asked [the demon], What is thy name? And he answered, saying, My name is Legion: for we are many.

(3) In addition to the Torah, uses of "I am that I am" are found in the writings of Shakespeare and of Edward de Vere. (What other writers used this phrase?)
Second Book of Moses 3 verses 13 to 15 said:
And Moses said unto God, Behold, when I come unto the children of Israel, and shall say unto them, The God of your fathers hath sent me unto you; and they shall say to me, What is his name? what shall I say unto them?
And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, I AM hath sent me unto you.
And God said moreover unto Moses, Thus shalt thou say unto the children of Israel, the Lord God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, hath sent me unto you: this is my name for ever, and this is my memorial unto all generations.

Shakespeares Sonnet CXXI said:
'Tis better to be vile than vile esteemed,
When not to be, receives reproach of being,
And the just pleasure lost, which is so deemed,
Not by our feeling, but by others' seeing.
For why should others' false adulterate eyes
Give salutation to my sportive blood?
Or on my frailties why are frailer spies,
Which in their wills count bad what I think good?
No, I am that I am, and they that level
At my abuses, reckon up their own,
I may be straight though they themselves be bevel;
By their rank thoughts, my deeds must not be shown
Unless this general evil they maintain,
All men are bad and in their badness reign.
Bastard in King John Act I Scene 1 said:
Near or far off, well won is still well shot;
And I am I, howe'er I was begot.
King Richard III in a play of the same name said:
What do I fear? Myself? There's none else by.
Richard loves Richard; that is, I am I.
Edward de Vere said:
[In the postscript of a letter to Lord Burghley] But I pray, my Lord, leave that course, for I mean not to be your ward nor your child. I serve her Majesty, and I am that I am, and by alliance near to your Lordship, but free, and scorn to be offered that injury to think I am so weak of government as to be ruled by servants, or not able to govern myself. If your Lordship take and follow this course, you deceive yourself, and make me take another course than yet I have not thought of. Wherefore these shall be to desire your Lordship, if that I may make account of your friendship, that you will leave that course as hurtful to us both.

By the way, the 2nd reddened phrase is similar to another piece of Shakespeare text:
King Lear in a play of the same name said:
No, you unnatural hags!
I will have such revenges on you both
That all the world shall- I will do such things-
What they are yet, I know not
; but they shall be
The terrors of the earth! ...
 
Top Bottom