Justice report finds systematic discrimination against African Americans in Ferguson

[laughing dog]

All of these are disparate rates of various things which could be due to factors correlated to race rather than race itself. Things like outstanding warrants.

Until you read the report, that is simply a handwaved anything but racism argument.

Hence my question.

Really? Why do you assume that blacks in Ferguson commit petty offenses at a significantly different rate than other races?

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Until you read the report, that is simply a handwaved anything but racism argument.

Hence my question.

Really? Why do you assume that blacks in Ferguson commit petty offenses at a significantly different rate than other races?

And have outstanding arrest warrants over petty offenses! According to the statistics, Ferguson is a couple steps worse than Mad Max.

 

[Frikki]

Why has this place turned into Stormfront Lite?

I call it Lite because the racists here don't have the courage of their convictions.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I would start by asking myself how many young black men hanging out is too many.

Do you see a difference between hanging out and loitering?

Speaking of Ferguson and stopping/ticketing people, what about jaywalking? That is what Michael Brown and his friend were doing when Wilson first encountered them. Just yesterday, as I was driving past Chamblee High School a group of black teens crossed the road right in front of me! And they were also moving deliberately slowly, taking their time. Now, if a cop had witnessed this, don't you think that they would have deserved a ticket? Or would that have drawn the ire of the Holder DOJ?

I have seen plenty of white people cross in front of traffic, slowly... and at a diagonal, so it takes them longer to cross. In my neighborhood, which is lower to middle class with an odd population demographic of young to old white and young black population, I see black teens constantly walking on the sidewalk! I also see them walking in the street. I see white teens walk on the sidewalk and the street as well. It is an epidemic of sidewalk and street walking.

We have had cops drive through the neighborhood to deal with this pedestrian epidemic, but white and black teens continue to flaunt home owners with their walking.

It does make me think, when this stuff happens, do white people (I'm white) notice it more when it involves a minority. Someone noted to me about how black woman drive as if they are the only car on the road (I really never had that impression before). Oddly enough the next morning a black woman blindly pulled onto the street right in front of me... speak about coincidence! But how many times has a white person done that as well? Or elderly person? Sure, there are certain stereotypes about drivers that can fall into sex or race categories for some reason, but this idea that these black teens just jaywalked right in front of you... and walked slowly, on purpose... it just seems to fall under the bias category of when you notice that stuff. And Jebus! Are we really going to get angry over jaywalking?
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Why has this place turned into Stormfront Lite?

I call it Lite because the racists here don't have the courage of their convictions.

Well, there would need to be a few more posters like that before calling this "Stormfront Lite". We did have one or two more like DrewJ, but they eventually were banned.

 

[Nice Squirrel]

Why has this place turned into Stormfront Lite?

I call it Lite because the racists here don't have the courage of their convictions.

Many are still deluded to believe they aren't racist.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Why has this place turned into Stormfront Lite?

I call it Lite because the racists here don't have the courage of their convictions.

Many are still deluded to believe they aren't racist.

Look in the mirror bub! You don't tolerate intolerant views of far-right Christians... you racist!

 

[Derec]

And have outstanding arrest warrants over petty offenses!

If people do not show up for their court date they get a bench warrant for petty offenses. Want to avoid that? Show up on your court date. It's not exactly rocket science!

According to the statistics, Ferguson is a couple steps worse than Mad Max.

If the looters had their way and burned up all the gas stations (like they did with QT) it would not have been far off.

 

[Derec]

Until you read the report, that is simply a handwaved anything but racism argument.

The point is that discrepancy of stop, arrest etc. rates does not prove racism as there are other explanations.

Really? Why do you assume that blacks in Ferguson commit petty offenses at a significantly different rate than other races?

I do not assume that. I advance it as an alternate explanation to the DOJ findings. And if this is the case, what is police supposed to do? Ignore petty crimes committed by minorities once their quota is reached?

 

[Nice Squirrel]

Many are still deluded to believe they aren't racist.

Look in the mirror bub! You don't tolerate intolerant views of far-right Christians... you racist!

Oh I know I am racist, but I try not to be.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

If people do not show up for their court date they get a bench warrant for petty offenses. Want to avoid that? Show up on your court date. It's not exactly rocket science!

Alright, lets review 16,000 of 21,000. That seems like an absurdly high percentage of people with warrants.

According to the statistics, Ferguson is a couple steps worse than Mad Max.

If the looters had their way and burned up all the gas stations (like they did with QT) it would not have been far off.

So if they did what they didn't actually do then they'd be like Mad Max? Yes, I agree with you, they aren't like Mad Max, yet about 75% of the population has outstanding warrants on them.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Really? Why do you assume that blacks in Ferguson commit petty offenses at a significantly different rate than other races?

I do not assume that. I advance it as an alternate explanation to the DOJ findings. And if this is the case, what is police supposed to do? Ignore petty crimes committed by minorities once their quota is reached?

OK, so you automatically dismiss the DoJ report (for completely unrace related reasons, I assume) and accept that blacks in Ferguson love to commit petty crimes because whatever the DoJ says, it has to be wrong.

I'm curious, do you disagree with the DoJ and feel the officer did kill that man because of race related issues? Because the DoJ indicates the evidence does not indicate that he did. Or do you agree with the DoJ when it correlates with your bias?

 

[laughing dog]

The point is that discrepancy of stop, arrest etc. rates does not prove racism as there are other explanations.

Your response is redundant: that is the point of the anything but racism argument.

I do not assume that. I advance it as an alternate explanation to the DOJ findings.

In order to be taken seriously an alternative explanation, you need to provide an actual reason for that assumption. Otherwise your "alternative explanation" is weaker than the DOJ conclusions drawn from actual data.

And if this is the case, what is police supposed to do? Ignore petty crimes committed by minorities once their quota is reached?

No. But there is no evidence that your assumption is the case. Especially when the dismissal rate for petty crimes is 68% less than the dismissal rate for petty crimes by whites.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

2 out of 3!! :yay:

The OP is making the assumption I've called you guys on many times: Assuming that a different outcome is proof of discrimination.

Is it any surprise that others are objecting to it?

Look for why there is a difference rather than assuming discrimination. (Hint: Robots flag more black drivers also.)

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racism? what racism?

http://www.vox.com/2015/3/3/8144027/ferguson-investigation-obama-joke

It seems the investigation also uncovered additional disturbing material that suggests a culture of racial bias among those who hold power in the city: according to the Associated Press, the report includes a 2008 message — which appears to be an attempt at humor — from a municipal email account that says President Obama wouldn't be in office long, because "what black man holds a steady job for four years."

It may be in poor taste but that's obviously a joke.

 

[RavenSky]

I challenge you to go find an actual quote with link on that one. I suspect you *remember* a lot of stuff that wasn't said how you remember it. If I am wrong, and you produce any member of this board actually saying what you above claim they said, I will apologize to you. Until then...

The original thread ("Michael Brown Shooting and Aftermath" but should have been called "Dying for Swisher Sweets")was 90+ pages! There is also a possibility that I remember it from a different forum. In any case, I remember it said.

In other words, you cannot document that anyone from this board actually said what you claim, but you are going to accuse us of it anyway as some sort of rebuttal in this thread.

No.

You may retract your undocumented accusation, because I really don't care what you may have read (or imagined) on some other board.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Ummm....

During the period 2012-2014 black drivers were twice as likely as white drivers to be searched during traffic stops, but 26% less likely to be found in possession of contraband.

And is that proof of discrimination or a matter of the attitude they took with the police?

Get hostile with the cops and you're likely to be patted down for weapons. They don't need probable cause for that.

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I would start by asking myself how many young black men hanging out is too many.

Do you see a difference between hanging out and loitering?

Speaking of Ferguson and stopping/ticketing people, what about jaywalking? That is what Michael Brown and his friend were doing when Wilson first encountered them. Just yesterday, as I was driving past Chamblee High School a group of black teens crossed the road right in front of me! And they were also moving deliberately slowly, taking their time. Now, if a cop had witnessed this, don't you think that they would have deserved a ticket? Or would that have drawn the ire of the Holder DOJ?

Remove "black" from this--you're simply describing high school students, period.

 

[Derec]

Especially when the dismissal rate for petty crimes is 68% less than the dismissal rate for petty crimes by whites.

This actually comes closest to actual evidence, unless there is a reason for discrepancy (like more repeat offenders). Do you have a link to this claim.

 

[laughing dog]

It may be in poor taste but that's obviously a joke.

The obvious point within the context of the report is that it is a racist joke.

 

[laughing dog]

Especially when the dismissal rate for petty crimes is 68% less than the dismissal rate for petty crimes by whites.

This actually comes closest to actual evidence, unless there is a reason for discrepancy (like more repeat offenders). Do you have a link to this claim.

Here is a link to one newspaper article with that information (:)

The review also found that blacks were 68 percent less likely than others to have their cases dismissed by a municipal court judge. And from April to September of last year, 95 percent of people kept at the city jail for more than two days were black, it found.

Of the cases in which the police department documented the use of force, 88 percent involved blacks, and of the 14 dog bites for which racial information is available, all 14 victims were black.

Here is a link to the report: http://apps.washingtonpost.com/g/documents/national/department-of-justice-report-on-the-ferguson-mo-police-department/1435/

Here is a link to an article on the racist emails (including their content): http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2015/03/04/the-seven-racist-e-mails-the-justice-department-highlighted-in-its-report-on-ferguson-police/

 

[Derec]

The review also found that blacks were 68 percent less likely than others to have their cases dismissed by a municipal court judge. And from April to September of last year, 95 percent of people kept at the city jail for more than two days were black, it found.

Interesting, but not part of the police.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Especially when the dismissal rate for petty crimes is 68% less than the dismissal rate for petty crimes by whites.

This actually comes closest to actual evidence, unless there is a reason for discrepancy (like more repeat offenders). Do you have a link to this claim.

I'm sorry, did you just say "repeat offender" for a petty crime?

Let it go George... he's a Serial Jaywalker.