Meanwhile, in the 'You Get What YOU Voted For' category

[Jimmy Higgins]

link

Many in the Chaldean Christian community of the Detroit metro area reportedly voted for Donald Trump with the belief that he would keep them safe. Now the Iraqi religious minority group in Michigan is facing mass deportations, which means being forcibly returned to Iraq, where they fear their faith endangers them.

...

Naoum said those in Michigan are generally Republican and supported President Trump by attending his rallies, holding fundraisers and having a Chaldean priest bless him during his campaign trail.
Nadine Yousif Kalasho, an attorney from Code Legal Aid who is partnering with the ACLU in their lawsuit, said that community members typically don’t vote but did so in the past election to support Trump.

...

Although their green cards were taken away, the Iraqi nationals were not deported because the Iraqi government previously did not accept them. They have been under supervision by ICE for decades with the understanding that they just had to report to immigration when told and not engage in illegal activity.
But things changed when Trump issued another travel ban in March — it included the stipulation that Iraq would have to accept deportations from the U.S. in order to be exempted from the ban overall.

Oh dear.

A majority of the Chaldean Christian community has lost confidence that Trump administration will stop Iraqis from being deported, according to Naoum.

Where is my violin? You voted for it, you voted this monstrosity. My only regret is that not enough Trump voters get to directly be negatively affected from the consequences of their vote. My gawd, the Trump election has jaded me!

 

[Opoponax]

Notwithstanding my late night viewing of Starship Troopers, I've become convinced there needs to be a test for voting.

And not some exercise in filling out a joke disguised as a 10 question multiple choice test . It would be a real test where you'd have to sit through a semester long course in civics and very basic Constitutional principles before taking a reasonably challenging exam at the end. In other words, you have to demonstrate some capacity to be able to make something approaching an informed choice. It would also demonstrate that you gave a shit.

Yeah, it would disenfranchise millions, but so fucking what? We've all gotten an ass-full of "The People" and the people have really fucked up, whether it be through demonstrably bad choices or sheer laziness. So educate the grossly misinformed and the lazy will be no better or worse off because they weren't exercising their right to vote anyway.

I've also come to an ill-defined and vague conclusion about media and the First Amendment with respect to news not being to be for profit, but that one's in need of further ripening before I start blurting out tyrannical shit.

 

[Malintent]

Notwithstanding my late night viewing of Starship Troopers, I've become convinced there needs to be a test for voting.

And not some exercise in filling out a joke disguised as a 10 question multiple choice test . It would be a real test where you'd have to sit through a semester long course in civics and very basic Constitutional principles before taking a reasonably challenging exam at the end. In other words, you have to demonstrate some capacity to be able to make something approaching an informed choice. It would also demonstrate that you gave a shit.

Yeah, it would disenfranchise millions, but so fucking what? We've all gotten an ass-full of "The People" and the people have really fucked up, whether it be through demonstrably bad choices or sheer laziness. So educate the grossly misinformed and the lazy will be no better or worse off because they weren't exercising their right to vote anyway.

I've also come to an ill-defined and vague conclusion about media and the First Amendment with respect to news not being to be for profit, but that one's in need of further ripening before I start blurting out tyrannical shit.

I also have been thinking about Starship Troopers lately. The bit that keeps coming to me is from the beginning of the movie where the "TV" commercials are advertising joining the military to fight the aliens.. they say, "Service Guarantees Citizenship"... The implication being that no one is just born into having civil privilege... it must be earned in some way.

On the other hand... I also have been channeling Idiocracy... like the whole thing.

 

[Deepak]

Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard.

 

[whichphilosophy]

Notwithstanding my late night viewing of Starship Troopers, I've become convinced there needs to be a test for voting.

And not some exercise in filling out a joke disguised as a 10 question multiple choice test . It would be a real test where you'd have to sit through a semester long course in civics and very basic Constitutional principles before taking a reasonably challenging exam at the end. In other words, you have to demonstrate some capacity to be able to make something approaching an informed choice. It would also demonstrate that you gave a shit.

Yeah, it would disenfranchise millions, but so fucking what? We've all gotten an ass-full of "The People" and the people have really fucked up, whether it be through demonstrably bad choices or sheer laziness. So educate the grossly misinformed and the lazy will be no better or worse off because they weren't exercising their right to vote anyway.

I've also come to an ill-defined and vague conclusion about media and the First Amendment with respect to news not being to be for profit, but that one's in need of further ripening before I start blurting out tyrannical shit.

An 'education' as a pre-requisite before voting would not be of any use as there are several schools of thought amongst the informed and uninformed. Poorer people on low incomes most likely couldn't get enough time to study this.

 

[Opoponax]

Poorer people on low incomes most likely couldn't get enough time to study this.

The same could be said for anyone who has to work, has kids, is in college, etc.

The point is that if someone wants to participate in the system, they should have to sacrifice something for it. Knowledge of how one's form of federal government works in the context of elected officials, its Constitution, and its key amendments, and foundational history are pretty fucking basic. And the consequence for not knowing that should be that you can't vote.

If a person can't must the necessary Give a Fuck to learn, then they shouldn't have the ability to make decisions that could potentially affect tens of millions of lives. This isn't the 18th century anymore, but they sure as hell debated about who should be allowed to vote. And in a nutshell one of the bases for that conversation concerned those who have an interest in the government. From that came the seemingly reasonable idea that we all have an interest in our government. But that also assumed that people would be aware enough to make an informed choice about what their own interests were.

Instead, we now have tens of millions of people who provably vote against their own best interests, which results in the government and private industry combining to fuck over everyone's best interest. And even worse, we have tens of millions who vote not out of their own best interests, but to knowingly and purposefully damage the lives of others via the vote. It's a disgusting abuse of the right to vote. Therefore, it shouldn't be a right simply granted, but a privilege earned.

I believe that the conservative media in this nation has played an important, if not the primary role in bringing us to this point. The portrayal of those who disagree with the Republican agenda, and now Trump, paints a picture of stupid but cunning evil Marxists who hate the United States. The attack on minorities, women, higher education, teachers, and unions runs 24/7 without letup and with little regard for truth and context. You can't rattle the cages of people for literally decades with shit like that and not have any effect.

That said, the only cure for that is to curb First Amendment rights. The safer thing to do is to simply inoculate the masses through basic, substantive information. You claim to care? Then fine, you'll put aside a few hours a week for 14-16 weeks and take the time to learn some basics so that you can know how the system works.

Ignorant conservative voters in their tens of millions absolutely believe that Barack Obama violated the Constitution in myriad ways throughout his Presidency. Ask them how, and they can't tell you one goddamn thing that makes one bit of sense. If they knew what the specific powers and limitations on powers that accompany the Executive, they'd know that Obama always stayed within those limits, or that at the most, he floated an order for the purpose of letting the courts decide the matter.

And that little bit of knowledge about the function powers of the executive branch would have never allowed such bullshit to fester and grow. The basic idea of "That can't be true because the Constitution doesn't permit a president to do A because the Constitution states in Article I, that A is a power reserved strictly for Congress." Or, "The judiciary will likely shoot down Y executive order because of Amendment X." I could go on and on, but one more: "No, despite the fact that Mr. Bad Guy is a convicted rapist-murderer, we can't just 'take him out back and shoot him' because the 14th Amendment requires that every person, regardless of who they are or what they've done is entitled to due process, which does protect Mr. Bad Guy from being summarily executed, but it's primary function is that it protects all of us."

Wad blown.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard.

Our current speaks otherwise. McConnell is beside himself wondering why the populace put them into power in every house, yet seem to disapprove of Trump and extremely disapprove the House/Senate ACA repeal/replace bills... which were hardly surprises just dropped on the people.

 

[rousseau]

Notwithstanding my late night viewing of Starship Troopers, I've become convinced there needs to be a test for voting.

And not some exercise in filling out a joke disguised as a 10 question multiple choice test . It would be a real test where you'd have to sit through a semester long course in civics and very basic Constitutional principles before taking a reasonably challenging exam at the end. In other words, you have to demonstrate some capacity to be able to make something approaching an informed choice. It would also demonstrate that you gave a shit.

Yeah, it would disenfranchise millions, but so fucking what? We've all gotten an ass-full of "The People" and the people have really fucked up, whether it be through demonstrably bad choices or sheer laziness. So educate the grossly misinformed and the lazy will be no better or worse off because they weren't exercising their right to vote anyway.

I've also come to an ill-defined and vague conclusion about media and the First Amendment with respect to news not being to be for profit, but that one's in need of further ripening before I start blurting out tyrannical shit.

Yep, if you haven't described the exact perfect system, something like it will come about eventually.

Democracy is only a couple hundred years old. Once we're publicly aware it doesn't work in it's current form, it will change.

 

[Elixir]

Notwithstanding my late night viewing of Starship Troopers, I've become convinced there needs to be a test for voting.

There's already precedent, too - the age test. So tests are not disallowed.
I think it would be great, but developing the test itself would be problematic. Republicans would like questions such as "What is the best way to cook 'possum?" or multiple choice questions like
Which is the proper spelling of "cat"?
a) cat
b) kat
c) catt
d) katt
... whereas the Dems might offer stumpers like "Which amendment to the Constitution guarantees free speech?" which would disqualify 90+ percent of all trump voters.
Epic floor fights would inevitably ensue.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Hmmm:

Q: What is a rampart?

A: A delicacy
B: A geologic term
C: Barrier or mound
D: Worthy of censorship

Q: Which state wasn't in the original colonies.

A: Rhode Island
B: Massachusetts
C: Alaska
D: Georgia

Q: If we declared independence in 1776 and the Constitution was written in 1787, what happened in between?

A: Original rules governing the nation were established in the Articles of Confederation which were abandoned and replaced with the Constitution.
B: Obama!
C: CLINTON!!!!
D: 2nd Amendment

 

[Elixir]

Hmmm:

Q: What is a rampart?

A: A delicacy
B: A geologic term
C: Barrier or mound
D: Worthy of censorship

Q: Which state wasn't in the original colonies.

A: Rhode Island
B: Massachusetts
C: Alaska
D: Georgia

Q: If we declared independence in 1776 and the Constitution was written in 1787, what happened in between?

A: Original rules governing the nation were established in the Articles of Confederation which were abandoned and replaced with the Constitution.
B: Obama!
C: CLINTON!!!!
D: 2nd Amendment

That must be the Dem version. Now for the Rep version:

Q: Your truck leaks a quart of oil every 100 miles. How may quarts of oil will it leak in 200 miles?

A: 200
B: 20
C: 2
D: Who cares? Oil is cheap.​

Q: Picking lettuce earns five dollars an hour. You pick lettuce for three hours. How much have you earned?

A: $5
B: $15
C: More than the Mexican picking next to me
D: I ain't pickin' no damn lettuce​

Q: Your gun jams while taking a shot at a doe. What do you do?

A: Stare down the barrel to see if you can spot the problem
B: Bang it on a rock
C: Pull out your other gun and shoot the damn deer
D: All of the above​

 

[Keith&Co.]

... whereas the Dems might offer stumpers like "Which amendment to the Constitution guarantees free speech?" which would disqualify 90+ percent of all trump voters.
Epic floor fights would inevitably ensue.

I have had my standing as a citizen and as a patriot questioned by someone who thinks they should abolish all the amendments. The Constitution is sufficient as itself, she insisted, we can run the country with just the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. No amendments.

I laughed myself silly.

 

[Keith&Co.]

You know, i JUST realized why the Republicans are so against immigration...
Those people HAVE to study before they vote!

 

[braces_for_impact]

Actually the Republican version of the test would be 785 questions. They all have the same answer. Benghazi.

 

[Opoponax]

Actually the Republican version of the test would be 785 questions. They all have the same answer. Benghazi.

That's solid. But the first question should be:

Assume that Congress passed and the President signed the following statute:

"The appellate jurisdiction of the United States Supreme Court shall not extend to any case involving the constitutionality of any state statute limiting the circumstances in which a woman may obtain an abortion, or involving the constitutionality of this statute."

The strongest argument against the constitutionality of this statute is that


A. Congress may not exercise its authority over the appellate jurisdiction of the Supreme Court in a way that seriously interferes with the establishment of a supreme and uniform body of federal constitutional law.

B. Congress may only regulate the appellate jurisdiction of the Supreme Court over cases initially arising in federal courts.

C. the appellate jurisdiction of the Supreme Court may only be altered by a constitutional amendment.

D. Fuck the commie fag who wrote this liberal question. Trump 2020! Wooooo!

They would receive credit for either A or D.

 

[barbos]

You have to be a citizen to vote, right? and if you are a citizen you can't be easily deported. I only heard of war crime nazies being stripped of citizenship and deported. And by the way, are they last Iraq war refugees? that's pretty quick citizenship if you ask me.

 

[whichphilosophy]

Poorer people on low incomes most likely couldn't get enough time to study this.

The same could be said for anyone who has to work, has kids, is in college, etc.

The point is that if someone wants to participate in the system, they should have to sacrifice something for it. Knowledge of how one's form of federal government works in the context of elected officials, its Constitution, and its key amendments, and foundational history are pretty fucking basic. And the consequence for not knowing that should be that you can't vote.

If a person can't must the necessary Give a Fuck to learn, then they shouldn't have the ability to make decisions that could potentially affect tens of millions of lives. This isn't the 18th century anymore, but they sure as hell debated about who should be allowed to vote. And in a nutshell one of the bases for that conversation concerned those who have an interest in the government. From that came the seemingly reasonable idea that we all have an interest in our government. But that also assumed that people would be aware enough to make an informed choice about what their own interests were.

Instead, we now have tens of millions of people who provably vote against their own best interests, which results in the government and private industry combining to fuck over everyone's best interest. And even worse, we have tens of millions who vote not out of their own best interests, but to knowingly and purposefully damage the lives of others via the vote. It's a disgusting abuse of the right to vote. Therefore, it shouldn't be a right simply granted, but a privilege earned.

I believe that the conservative media in this nation has played an important, if not the primary role in bringing us to this point. The portrayal of those who disagree with the Republican agenda, and now Trump, paints a picture of stupid but cunning evil Marxists who hate the United States. The attack on minorities, women, higher education, teachers, and unions runs 24/7 without letup and with little regard for truth and context. You can't rattle the cages of people for literally decades with shit like that and not have any effect.

That said, the only cure for that is to curb First Amendment rights. The safer thing to do is to simply inoculate the masses through basic, substantive information. You claim to care? Then fine, you'll put aside a few hours a week for 14-16 weeks and take the time to learn some basics so that you can know how the system works.

Ignorant conservative voters in their tens of millions absolutely believe that Barack Obama violated the Constitution in myriad ways throughout his Presidency. Ask them how, and they can't tell you one goddamn thing that makes one bit of sense. If they knew what the specific powers and limitations on powers that accompany the Executive, they'd know that Obama always stayed within those limits, or that at the most, he floated an order for the purpose of letting the courts decide the matter.

And that little bit of knowledge about the function powers of the executive branch would have never allowed such bullshit to fester and grow. The basic idea of "That can't be true because the Constitution doesn't permit a president to do A because the Constitution states in Article I, that A is a power reserved strictly for Congress." Or, "The judiciary will likely shoot down Y executive order because of Amendment X." I could go on and on, but one more: "No, despite the fact that Mr. Bad Guy is a convicted rapist-murderer, we can't just 'take him out back and shoot him' because the 14th Amendment requires that every person, regardless of who they are or what they've done is entitled to due process, which does protect Mr. Bad Guy from being summarily executed, but it's primary function is that it protects all of us."

Wad blown.

My point is that no amount of education short of brainwashing will reduce the amount of diversity and absurdity in opinions. Some uneducated idiots can be led by educated fools. As the German saying goes, "Educated fools exceed all fools."

The other point is who is going to pay for this education which could take a considerable amount of time. This means the taxes will be raised to cover this.

If our education systems are at fault then additional education will be like pouring petrol on the fire.

 

[whichphilosophy]

Actually the Republican version of the test would be 785 questions. They all have the same answer. Benghazi.

I thought the question would contain Benghazi and the answer would contain Hilary or perhaps vica versa.

 

[Opoponax]

You have to be a citizen to vote, right? and if you are a citizen you can't be easily deported. I only heard of war crime nazies being stripped of citizenship and deported. And by the way, are they last Iraq war refugees? that's pretty quick citizenship if you ask me.

1. That's the point: simply being born within the U.S. or to parents of American citizenship gives such a person the right to vote. There is no test, nothing measuring one's ability to understand the slightest thing about how the government works. We've reached a point where that has become damaging to the Republic.
2. Neither myself, nor anyone else, ever said anything about stripping anyone of citizenship.
3. Neither myself, nor anyone else, ever said anything about deporting anyone.
4. This is being applied to anyone, regardless how their citizenship is attained.

 

[Opoponax]

My point is that no amount of education short of brainwashing will reduce the amount of diversity and absurdity in opinions. Some uneducated idiots can be led by educated fools. As the German saying goes, "Educated fools exceed all fools."

Oh. Well if the Germans said it, then it must be true.

The other point is who is going to pay for this education which could take a considerable amount of time. This means the taxes will be raised to cover this.

This is always the Republican ace in the hole: it'll raise taxes. What I'm thinking is that if people could make informed decisions, and if they actually gave a shit about welfare of the country, they'd have a stake in holding its leaders accountable. The cost of educating those who care enough to vote would be worthwhile investment rather than a frivolous expenditure. It's like building a bridge. Sure, it costs money upfront, but the longterm benefit so far outweighs those costs that it's not even worth debating. And hey, charge a nominal fee for the course; say, $10. Roughly 4 million people reach voting age in the U.S. each year, so while the program would still cost taxpayer money, it could be set off to some degree.

If our education systems are at fault then additional education will be like pouring petrol on the fire.

No one said our educational systems are fault. But your response is sadly predictable; don't educate people because then they'll tend to make rational decision based on factual information. And as is apparent, that would be disastrous for people like Trump and the Republican party.