Mom owns 10 guns for self defense and kills her children with one of them.

[ZiprHead]

It's better to have guns than not have guns. Bad things are apt to happen when guns are involved, but when things can really get ugly is when there are no guns involved.

What does this mean?

Apparently the the two young women died quickly, with little suffering, so compared to being beaten to death with a golf club, it was not as ugly as it could have been.

Of course, the father stood by and watched his wife murder his children. We can assume he had access to the same guns as his wife, but did nothing to save the girls, except try to reason with a well armed woman. Maybe the real fault lies with him, but that seems like piling on after the tackle.

She apparently planned this. She called for a family meeting and had the gun at the ready underneath where she was sitting.

 

[RavenSky]

911 calls released. Very disturbing.
http://heavy.com/news/2016/06/taylor-madison-christy-spears-texas-shooting-911-calls-audio-full-uncensored-youtube/

Even more disturbing are the people in the comments section trying to blame everyone except the shooter.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

I would say involuntary commitment should create a presumption that you're unsuited for guns but it shouldn't be a blanket ban. Sometimes it's a power play, sometimes it's a problem that was fixed.

Better safe than sorry. It should be something where there's an appeals process available so that if doctors will certify that the problem is fixed, you can be taken off the exclusion list, but it seems to be the kind of thing where a blanket ban would be the proper default action.

As I said, a presumption. You're not disagreeing with me here.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

Except for your main point that it shouldn't be a blanket ban and I think it should be a blanket ban.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

What your link shows is that NRA supported legislation to make it easier for possibly mentally ill people to have guns.

I see nothing about mental illness there. It's about people who need help managing their finances.

Now, you might be able to argue that it's a case of mental deficiency--but there's no law against stupid people buying a gun. Thus this is an attempt to deny guns for no valid reason.

(Now, whether there should be an intelligence test to buy a gun is another matter. If you're going to go that route do so openly, though, don't go adding names to the ban list that have done nothing that warrants it.)

 

[angelo]

Someone has already said that many are blaming guns, not the shooters. That's like blaming cars not the driver for crashes.

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

Someone has already said that many are blaming guns, not the shooters. That's like blaming cars not the driver for crashes.

That argument would probably carry more weight, if cars were designed to kill people.

 

[angelo]

Someone has already said that many are blaming guns, not the shooters. That's like blaming cars not the driver for crashes.

That argument would probably carry more weight, if cars were designed to kill people.

Have you ever seen the remains of a body hit at 100 kml by a vehicle?

 

[Arctish]

What your link shows is that NRA supported legislation to make it easier for possibly mentally ill people to have guns.

I see nothing about mental illness there. It's about people who need help managing their finances.

Now, you might be able to argue that it's a case of mental deficiency--but there's no law against stupid people buying a gun. Thus this is an attempt to deny guns for no valid reason.

(Now, whether there should be an intelligence test to buy a gun is another matter. If you're going to go that route do so openly, though, don't go adding names to the ban list that have done nothing that warrants it.)

Actually, it's about NRA opposition to people who are unable to manage simple tasks like paying bills being excluded from buying guns.

VA's Fiduciary Program was established to protect Veterans and other beneficiaries who, due to injury, disease, or due to age, are unable to manage their financial affairs. VA will only determine an individual to be unable to manage his or her financial affairs after receipt of medical documentation or if a court of competent jurisdiction has already made the determination.

Guns for everyone, no matter how mentally impaired! Boo-yah!!

 

[Don2 (Don1 Revised)]

That argument would probably carry more weight, if cars were designed to kill people.

Have you ever seen the remains of a body hit at 100 kml by a vehicle?

Which is why there are low speed limits in residential areas.

 

[angelo]

Have you ever seen the remains of a body hit at 100 kml by a vehicle?

Which is why there are low speed limits in residential areas.

No matter what the speed limits are, watch some idiot flaunt them.

 

[Bronzeage]

What does this mean?

Apparently the the two young women died quickly, with little suffering, so compared to being beaten to death with a golf club, it was not as ugly as it could have been.

Of course, the father stood by and watched his wife murder his children. We can assume he had access to the same guns as his wife, but did nothing to save the girls, except try to reason with a well armed woman. Maybe the real fault lies with him, but that seems like piling on after the tackle.

She apparently planned this. She called for a family meeting and had the gun at the ready underneath where she was sitting.

Do you mean, it would have been better if everyone were armed and the children could have killed their mother before she had a chance to kill them?

This is a strange use of the word "better."

 

[Alcoholic Actuary]

Not bad satire. We hope.

Truth be told, I do support (at least in personal thought) keeping our high-powered multi-round guns, but to think we're actually overall safer with them is quite questionable.

It isn't questionable it is a statistical fact: someone who owns a gun is 12 times more likely to injure themselves or family members than to successfully repel an attacker. Belief that guns increase safety comes from an over-estimation of the risk of home intrusion and actually being a victim of gun violence (which is actually declining but is more popular than ever in the media), and an under-estimation of the risk posed by hand held explosive devices. There is a significant statistical difference between the number of bow and arrow accidents and gun accidents.

aa

 

[Alcoholic Actuary]

Which is why there are low speed limits in residential areas.

No matter what the speed limits are, watch some idiot flaunt them.

I doubt we could ever eliminate auto accidents 100%, but do you believe that there are greater or fewer accidents due to driving restrictions?

aa

 

[ZiprHead]

She apparently planned this. She called for a family meeting and had the gun at the ready underneath where she was sitting.

Do you mean, it would have been better if everyone were armed and the children could have killed their mother before she had a chance to kill them?

This is a strange use of the word "better."

No, I'm saying it wasn't an escalating situation that may have given the father time to get another gun for defense.

 

[Bronzeage]

Do you mean, it would have been better if everyone were armed and the children could have killed their mother before she had a chance to kill them?

This is a strange use of the word "better."

No, I'm saying it wasn't an escalating situation that may have given the father time to get another gun for defense.

So "better" in this case, is the man killing his wife. Do all the "better" scenarios end up with someone dead?

 

[ZiprHead]

No, I'm saying it wasn't an escalating situation that may have given the father time to get another gun for defense.

So "better" in this case, is the man killing his wife. Do all the "better" scenarios end up with someone dead?

You're the one that interjected "better". I don't know what the fuck you are talking about. I wasn't making any value judgments. Just reporting a fact.

 

[Shadowy Man]

That argument would probably carry more weight, if cars were designed to kill people.

Have you ever seen the remains of a body hit at 100 kml by a vehicle?

Are cars designed for the purpose of hitting people at 100 km/h?

 

[Bronzeage]

So "better" in this case, is the man killing his wife. Do all the "better" scenarios end up with someone dead?

You're the one that interjected "better". I don't know what the fuck you are talking about. I wasn't making any value judgments. Just reporting a fact.

It was you who posted, "It's better to have guns than not have guns." That is a value judgment.

I'm just trying to understand how guns, or more guns, improves the situation. As it happened, when more guns arrived, the woman submitted to being shot by a policeman.

 

[ZiprHead]

You're the one that interjected "better". I don't know what the fuck you are talking about. I wasn't making any value judgments. Just reporting a fact.

It was you who posted, "It's better to have guns than not have guns." That is a value judgment.

I'm just trying to understand how guns, or more guns, improves the situation. As it happened, when more guns arrived, the woman submitted to being shot by a policeman.

I think you better do some checking. I never said that and I never would. As a matter of fact, I would be perfectly happy if the ownership of hand guns by civilians was prohibited.

It was fast that posted the having guns are better comment

Quote Originally Posted by fast

It's better to have guns than not have guns. Bad things are apt to happen when guns are involved, but when things can really get ugly is when there are no guns involved.