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Now the Coup Starts

crazyfingers

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https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/10/politics/pentagon-policy-official-resigns/index.html

Trump administration removes senior defense officials and installs loyalists, triggering alarm at Pentagon

Four senior civilian officials have been fired or have resigned since Monday, including Esper, his chief of staff and the top officials overseeing policy and intelligence. They were replaced by perceived Trump loyalists, including a controversial figure who promoted fringe conspiracy theories and called former President Barack Obama a terrorist.

....

Knowledgeable sources told CNN's Jake Tapper Tuesday that the White House now seems focused on going after Esper's under secretaries at the Defense Department in the wake of his firing on Monday. Esper was replaced by Christopher Miller, the director of the National Counterterrorism Center.

The sources said the effort may be because Esper and his team were pushing back on a premature withdrawal from Afghanistan that would be carried out before the required conditions on the ground were met, and other pending security issues.

"This is scary, it's very unsettling," one defense official told CNN. "These are dictator moves."

...


'It's crazy'

Multiple civilian and military officials working inside the Pentagon are raising the question of whether the departure of Esper and other officials will now clear the way for Trump in his final weeks in office to potentially again call for initiatives he wants to pursue that the Pentagon opposes.

One would be again raising the specter of using active duty forces under the Insurrection Act against any future protests. Another potential raised by officials is he would override the military advice he has been given and bring troops home from Afghanistan by Christmas.

A lot more in the full story
 

Jimmy Higgins

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And we move forward with the coup and how they plan to steal it.

article said:
State Rep. Dawn Keefer, a Republican from York County, announced that Republicans in the state legislature would move to conduct an audit of the election, and that the state should not certify the election results, or select electors to the Electoral College, until it is completed

“The General Assembly needs to take extraordinary measures to answer these extraordinary questions,” Keefer said while speaking in front of a group of a dozen or so House Republicans.

But Keefer admitted that she and the Pennsylvania GOP do not have anything more than questions. There is no evidence of anything resembling coordinated cheating in the election.

“We've just gotten a lot of allegations,” Keefer said, referring to what she said was a flurry of calls and e-mails from voters “who are concerned and outraged by the circumstances surrounding this election.”
As I've been warning, this isn't about finding fraud or corruption. This is about spoiling the vote, and it is spoken in their own words. "We've just gotten a lot of allegations." No, you haven't. Trump has stated a bunch of bullshit. There are virtually no allegations, forget about specific allegations in specific areas.

The GOP is conspiring to take Pennsylvania's 20 electoral votes and spoil them.

And this is paralleled with the Secretary of State saying there would be a "smooth transition to a second Trump administration". When I first heard it, I figured they cut the audio in the video because he fixed his flub. But is wasn't a flub.
 

crazyfingers

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Seeding the military with toadies -

Trump administration removes senior defense officials and installs loyalists, triggering alarm at Pentagon

Just sabre rattling?
Or will the military follow orders to restore America to its rightful owner, the Trump Crime Family?

They were replaced by perceived Trump loyalists, including a controversial figure who promoted fringe conspiracy theories and called former President Barack Obama a terrorist.

.... Well that's very, very bad.
 

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Seeding the military with toadies -

Trump administration removes senior defense officials and installs loyalists, triggering alarm at Pentagon

Just sabre rattling?
Or will the military follow orders to restore America to its rightful owner, the Trump Crime Family?

We posted at the same time almost.

I sure hope that military officers will follow their oaths and will not follow an illegal order.

Do you have more faith that officers won’t follow illegal orders than officers wouldn’t give illegal orders?
 

Jimmy Higgins

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I don't know what is worse, the idea we could have had our last election or that the dictator is supposed to be Donald fucking Trump. I thought America could have done better than the 21st Century Mussolini.
 

Jimmy Higgins

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At what point does it stop being bravado, denial, and stupidity to then become dangerous and authoritarian?
 

crazyfingers

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Seeding the military with toadies -

Trump administration removes senior defense officials and installs loyalists, triggering alarm at Pentagon

Just sabre rattling?
Or will the military follow orders to restore America to its rightful owner, the Trump Crime Family?

We posted at the same time almost.

I sure hope that military officers will follow their oaths and will not follow an illegal order.

Do you have more faith that officers won’t follow illegal orders than officers wouldn’t give illegal orders?

I don't know. I'd like the opinion of someone here who is or has been in the military.
 

Keith&Co.

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Do you have more faith that officers won’t follow illegal orders than officers wouldn’t give illegal orders?

I don't know. I'd like the opinion of someone here who is or has been in the military.
There's 70 days left. It's clear to the Pentagon officers who won. So whatever happens, we could be 71 days from trials for violating treaties, violating laws, the UCMJ, the Constitution.
No matter how amoral the toadies in place are, the generals and admirals have careers they want to keep after the dust settles, and not be in a federal prison. They won't obey illegal orders, and i expect slow compliance with any iffy ones. "That's gonna take us 65 days...to plan. Sir. More or less."
 

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https://www.washingtonpost.com/inve...269a7c-2364-11eb-8599-406466ad1b8e_story.html

So now we see where Trump Is the real fraud. Republicans allegedly pressured The Postal worker to sign a false affidavit that he didn’t understand and then recanted once confronted by postal inspectors. BTW that’s subornation of perjury. If that affidavit was submitted in a court proceeding, well, I wouldn’t want to explain how it happened to a judge.
 

crazyfingers

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Do you have more faith that officers won’t follow illegal orders than officers wouldn’t give illegal orders?

I don't know. I'd like the opinion of someone here who is or has been in the military.
There's 70 days left. It's clear to the Pentagon officers who won. So whatever happens, we could be 71 days from trials for violating treaties, violating laws, the UCMJ, the Constitution.
No matter how amoral the toadies in place are, the generals and admirals have careers they want to keep after the dust settles, and not be in a federal prison. They won't obey illegal orders, and i expect slow compliance with any iffy ones. "That's gonna take us 65 days...to plan. Sir. More or less."

I have a lot of respect for your insight on that topic. I so hope u are right.
 

fromderinside

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Yes there are civilians at the top of military by design. But military training is not only how to make and follow orders it is about the ethics of command and service.

Believe me these backbones of the military, command and service, are very strong. I'm confident that they will counter any impulse to follow the order of any civilian toady put at the head of the military.
 

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Not all World Leaders are supporting Biden. Shithole dictatorships everywhere are supporting Trump: Slovenia, Hungary, Russia, China, Mexico, North Korea, USA...
 

Swammerdami

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U.S. Republicans hint at limited time for Trump to make his post-election case


Silent Rob breaks with tradition said:
Senator Rob Portman of Ohio, a state that Trump won handily last week, said in a statement that Biden is leading in enough states to win election “and President Donald Trump’s campaign must produce evidence to support allegations of election fraud.”

But it's too much for Little Marco of Three Mystic Apes said:
But responding to reporters’ questions about unsubstantiated fraud allegations in hotly contested states such as Pennsylvania, Rubio said he was in no position to know what was going on anywhere outside his home state of Florida.

Like positioned near news?
 

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All of these sub-humans are guilty of treason, IMO.

Trump was a traitor standing at that podium next to Putie in Helsinki.
When future historians analyze Trump's name-calling as projection, they'll be able to suggest a self-portrait of Donald when he calls people Lyin' Ted, Crooked Hillary, etc. And look how many people he said were traitors who attempted a coup -- the "scum of the earth" -- because they dared investigate his Russian connections. Betraying the country is a major theme in his thinking, but of course "country" to Trump means "Me".
 

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There's 70 days left. It's clear to the Pentagon officers who won. So whatever happens, we could be 71 days from trials for violating treaties, violating laws, the UCMJ, the Constitution.
No matter how amoral the toadies in place are, the generals and admirals have careers they want to keep after the dust settles, and not be in a federal prison. They won't obey illegal orders, and i expect slow compliance with any iffy ones. "That's gonna take us 65 days...to plan. Sir. More or less."

I have a lot of respect for your insight on that topic. I so hope u are right.

I just keep thinking about his Parade. The military fete he so desperately wanted? He couldn't strong-arm the Pentagon into doing that, and it was just an expensive logistical nightmare. No violations of oaths or shadowy areas of legality involved.

Now his days are literally numbered. His and his posse's.
 

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There's 70 days left. It's clear to the Pentagon officers who won. So whatever happens, we could be 71 days from trials for violating treaties, violating laws, the UCMJ, the Constitution.
No matter how amoral the toadies in place are, the generals and admirals have careers they want to keep after the dust settles, and not be in a federal prison. They won't obey illegal orders, and i expect slow compliance with any iffy ones. "That's gonna take us 65 days...to plan. Sir. More or less."

I have a lot of respect for your insight on that topic. I so hope u are right.

I just keep thinking about his Parade. The military fete he so desperately wanted? He couldn't strong-arm the Pentagon into doing that, and it was just an expensive logistical nightmare. No violations of oaths or shadowy areas of legality involved.

Now his days are literally numbered. His and his posse's.

Please post that again - maybe twice a day from now until 1/20?
Both of my parents served in the Navy - starting with WWI for my dad, and ending with the Korean war and retiring as a LT Commander. Mom was a WAVE in WWII. They met at Treasure Island toward the end of WWII. It's probably a good thing they're not alive today; I can only imagine how they would react and what they might do.
 

hurtinbuckaroo

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Turns out the postal worker that claimed he witnessed vote tampering was lying and was paid $130,000 by republican operatives.

There's that $130,000 figure again.

He was not paid. There’s now a GoFundMe page collecting money for him, but that was done after the fact.
 

Angry Floof

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Good speech from Senator Chris Murphy to Republicans yesterday.

And what so far have we seen that would suggest that there is an end to your decision to put your allegiance to this president above an allegiance to the country?

The Secretary of State was asked today if he thought there would be a smooth transition of power from President Trump to the winner of the election, Vice President and President-elect Biden, and Secretary Pompeo said, "There will be a smooth transition to a second Trump administration."

Listen, these guys aren't playing. This isn't just for show. They are going to keep pushing the bounds of democracy until somebody stops them. It's logical to ask, if Republicans had been willing to support every conspiracy that the President has engaged in over the last week, then why wouldn't they support the next set of attacks on democracy that this President engages in? How far are Republicans willing to go in their attacks against the decision of voters?

For the President, there really is no downside to what he's doing right now. Either he steals the election or he grows his political power, because we learned in the last 24 hours that the President is raising money today online from his supporters, not for a fund that is designed to strictly finance a recount effort, but for a new political action committee that he has established that will fund his political efforts over the next four years.
There's no downside for the President. There's a big downside for the rest of us. There's a big downside for this country.
Over the last week and over the last five years. Only one or two Republicans have had the spine and conscience to oppose Trump and their colleagues' support of him.

Like I said, they're going to have to see and experience the pain themselves of the worst case consequences of their conscienceless, power hungry ideology before they'll have the wherewithal to do the right thing.

Video: https://www.facebook.com/atrupar/vi...DY0MDc4MDoxMDE1ODUxNTIxOTg1MDc4MQ/?sk=friends
 

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Turns out the postal worker that claimed he witnessed vote tampering was lying and was paid $130,000 by republican operatives.

There's that $130,000 figure again.

He was not paid. There’s now a GoFundMe page collecting money for him, but that was done after the fact.
But possibly done after being told it would happen. The problem now is that it is one thing to make accusations. When the FBI shows up, they expect names, dates, events.
 

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Turns out the postal worker that claimed he witnessed vote tampering was lying and was paid $130,000 by republican operatives.

There's that $130,000 figure again.

He was not paid. There’s now a GoFundMe page collecting money for him, but that was done after the fact.

It was originally reported he was paid. Here's one that's still up.

Postal Worker Admits GOP Donors Paid Him $130K to Lie About Vote Tampering

They set up a GoFundMe page but GoFundMe took it down before he got paid.
 

hurtinbuckaroo

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Turns out the postal worker that claimed he witnessed vote tampering was lying and was paid $130,000 by republican operatives.

There's that $130,000 figure again.

He was not paid. There’s now a GoFundMe page collecting money for him, but that was done after the fact.

It was originally reported he was paid. Here's one that's still up.

Postal Worker Admits GOP Donors Paid Him $130K to Lie About Vote Tampering

Your “VladTV” Link incorrectly claims that WaPo reported that he was paid by Republicans to do it. If WaPo said that, it wasn’t in the article I read.
 

crazyfingers

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What a fucking baby

https://www.cnn.com/2020/11/11/politics/state-department-biden-messages/index.html

Washington (CNN)A stack of messages from foreign leaders to President-elect Joe Biden are sitting at the State Department but the Trump administration is preventing him from accessing them, according to State Department officials familiar with the messages.

Traditionally, the State Department supports all communications for the President-elect, which is why many countries began sending messages to State over the weekend. But with Biden prohibited from accessing State Department resources by the Trump administration, because President Donald Trump refuses to accept Biden's victory, dozens of incoming messages have not been received.
 

Shadowy Man

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And a sad sack of hypocrites, who all called Clinton and the Democrats cry babies and sore losers four years ago.
 

GenesisNemesis

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At what point does it stop being bravado, denial, and stupidity to then become dangerous and authoritarian?

It started being dangerous and authoritarian way back when Trump stated his support for the Tienanmen Square massacre in the 1990s.
 

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My wife read me an analysis that it's not a coup, it's a short window to declassify the paperwork on the Russian investigation.
That'll bring a lot of intel operations out into the open, possibly exposing intel operations, operatives, and weakening the case when it inevitably goes to trial.
 

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Opinion | The Completely Insane Electoral College Strategy - POLITICO - "The Constitution theoretically gives state legislatures great power over elections, but that’s not a reason to precipitate a constitutional crisis."
President Donald Trump is challenging the outcome of the Nov. 3 presidential election in several razor-thin battleground states, pushing for recounts and filing lawsuits that are very unlikely to overturn Joe Biden’s current leads.

Faced with this prospect, some allies of the president are advocating, or beginning to whisper about, Republican state legislatures taking matters into their own hands and sending slates of Trump electors to Congress regardless of the vote count.

...
We may be one presidential tweet away from this gambit becoming orthodoxy for much of the Republican Party.

...
One can only guess that the political reaction against this in the states in question would be thermonuclear. This must be one reason why the Republican leader of the state Senate in Pennsylvania, Jake Corman, has so far been steadfast in saying the Legislature is not going down this route.

Any such move would also be subject to litigation likely to go all the way to the Supreme Court. Even if the power of the legislatures is vast, there will be a dispute over whether they can ignore the results of elections that, prior to an unwelcome outcome, were supposed to determine the state’s electors.
Currently, Biden has enough to win with PA by itself, AZ and NV, or GA with at least one of AZ and NV. So if PA's legislature refuses to go along, then that's it for this strategy.

If anything, it shows what a sore loser Trump is.
 

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My wife read me an analysis that it's not a coup, it's a short window to declassify the paperwork on the Russian investigation.
That'll bring a lot of intel operations out into the open, possibly exposing intel operations, operatives, and weakening the case when it inevitably goes to trial.
I see shit like this happening, and it makes me very glad I declined the CIA's offer of employment back in 2017. A very large part of that decision was the current administration.
 

T.G.G. Moogly

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My wife read me an analysis that it's not a coup, it's a short window to declassify the paperwork on the Russian investigation.
That'll bring a lot of intel operations out into the open, possibly exposing intel operations, operatives, and weakening the case when it inevitably goes to trial.

Trumpo Dumpo is just out of options. He's played all his cards and doesn't have anything left. Basically he needs new creditors to keep him in his current lifestyle and once he's no longer president he's in financial and legal fuckville.
 

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My wife read me an analysis that it's not a coup, it's a short window to declassify the paperwork on the Russian investigation.
That'll bring a lot of intel operations out into the open, possibly exposing intel operations, operatives, and weakening the case when it inevitably goes to trial.
I see shit like this happening, and it makes me very glad I declined the CIA's offer of employment back in 2017. A very large part of that decision was the current administration.

It forced my retirement, since CBP, and ICE were our biggest customers and had morphed from relatively benign mostly humanitarian endeavors into malevolent, cruel tools of small minded trump appointees.
I'm actually considering taking some work from the people who bought the Company once the new administration takes over. We'll see; I have no interest in interacting with those entities as they were when I left.
 

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I think it's too much even for current republican party. More likely they would hang Trump than commit mass suicide.

I somewhat disagree with your take on the Repugs reading of the situation.
The problem is: so very many Americans voted for Trump, and the Repugs want to hold on to them--particularly in Georgia, through the Senate rub-offs. McConnell was more concessionary at first when the networks called Biden, then he is now, because now it looks like he and the Repugs could possibly lose control of the Senate, thanks to Georgia.
 

jab

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Trump’s statement today:

We all know why Joe Biden is rushing to falsely pose as the winner, and why his media allies are trying so hard to help him: they don’t want the truth to be exposed. The simple fact is this election is far from over. Joe Biden has not been certified as the winner of any states, let alone any of the highly contested states headed for mandatory recounts, or states where our campaign has valid and legitimate legal challenges that could determine the ultimate victor. In Pennsylvania, for example, our legal observers were not permitted meaningful access to watch the counting process. Legal votes decide who is president, not the news media.

“Beginning Monday, our campaign will start prosecuting our case in court to ensure election laws are fully upheld and the rightful winner is seated. The American People are entitled to an honest election: that means counting all legal ballots, and not counting any illegal ballots. This is the only way to ensure the public has full confidence in our election. It remains shocking that the Biden campaign refuses to agree with this basic principle and wants ballots counted even if they are fraudulent, manufactured, or cast by ineligible or deceased voters. Only a party engaged in wrongdoing would unlawfully keep observers out of the count room – and then fight in court to block their access.

“So what is Biden hiding? I will not rest until the American People have the honest vote count they deserve and that Democracy demands.”

He’s betting on the Supreme Court that he’s stacked. I don’t trust them either after Bush v. Gore. Kavanaugh especially. I don’t see how exactly they can reverse the results, but damn they will try.

They won't get a chance to try, unless there's some hard evidence of widespread fraud or cheating by the Democratic campaign. And if the GOP had that evidence, they would be shouting it from the rooftops.

In the absence of any evidence, a legal challenge will be dismissed in the lower courts, and will never get to the Supremes.

The courts - at every level - aren't interested in unsubstantiated claims of unspecified unlawful activity. Sure, you can pay a lawyer to take a baseless brief and start proceedings in the lower courts; But without evidence, that brief will be laughed out of court in short order.

Trump's MO is to sue everyone and everything, whenever he doesn't get his way. But in this situation, all that will achieve is to make DJT poorer, and his lawyers richer. It's not going to achieve anything else.

The court cases are delaying tactics, to delay the certifaction of the vote and delay, perhaps even so long as to cancel the gathering of the electors, and throwing the election to the House of Reps.
 

jab

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The easy answer to that is that cheating only happened in Philadelphia, Atlanta and Detroit.
Easy, but it makes no sense.
Stealing the presidency for Biden does nothing if we don't steal at least the Senate at the same time. We'd surely have spent as much time and money crucifying McConnell.

Sure, but it may not have been feasible. Ramping up democratic votes in the few states, actually counties/cities, that are typically democratic would be much easier than flipping republican seats all around the country.

So how could the Dems rig Arizona Pres but not Senate?
 

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Time for Biden to start requesting restraining orders against this sort of garbage, and then keep throwing the people in jail for contempt if they continue the non-compliance.
 

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Sure, but it may not have been feasible. Ramping up democratic votes in the few states, actually counties/cities, that are typically democratic would be much easier than flipping republican seats all around the country.

So how could the Dems rig Arizona Pres but not Senate?

Kelly did win in Arizona, right?
 

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They won't get a chance to try, unless there's some hard evidence of widespread fraud or cheating by the Democratic campaign. And if the GOP had that evidence, they would be shouting it from the rooftops.

In the absence of any evidence, a legal challenge will be dismissed in the lower courts, and will never get to the Supremes.

The courts - at every level - aren't interested in unsubstantiated claims of unspecified unlawful activity. Sure, you can pay a lawyer to take a baseless brief and start proceedings in the lower courts; But without evidence, that brief will be laughed out of court in short order.

Trump's MO is to sue everyone and everything, whenever he doesn't get his way. But in this situation, all that will achieve is to make DJT poorer, and his lawyers richer. It's not going to achieve anything else.

The court cases are delaying tactics, to delay the certifaction of the vote and delay, perhaps even so long as to cancel the gathering of the electors, and throwing the election to the House of Reps.

I think some lawyers need to be fined and/or disbarred for frivolous lawsuits. You can’t sue saying they weren’t allowed to have people in the room and then admit in the hearing that they had people in the room. How much better use of court time is being wasted on these fools? Consequences!!
 

T.G.G. Moogly

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Time for Biden to start requesting restraining orders against this sort of garbage, and then keep throwing the people in jail for contempt if they continue the non-compliance.

Biden's been around the block, he's the least concerned of anyone.

Has anyone seen even a single credible case of election fraud? Members of the GOP in many states have said their elections were legit and claims of fraud are baseless.
 

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It was originally reported he was paid. Here's one that's still up.

Postal Worker Admits GOP Donors Paid Him $130K to Lie About Vote Tampering

They set up a GoFundMe page but GoFundMe took it down before he got paid.

But apparently it's been moved to a Christian crowdfunding site and Christians are much more ethical.

https://givesendgo.com/bebrave

And oh dear is this guy a total fuckup.

Audio recording shows Pa. postal worker recanting ballot-tampering claim - WaPo

During the recorded interview, however, federal agents repeatedly reminded Hopkins that his cooperation was voluntary, and Hopkins agreed to sign a document stating that he was not coerced.

Asked by an agent whether he had legal representation, Hopkins said Project Veritas had a lawyer on retention “in case there’s anything that happens.” The agent told Hopkins that if he had a personal lawyer, “I would make whatever efforts possible to have that person here.” Hopkins said he didn’t have a lawyer.

Hopkins also repeatedly expressed regret for signing the initial affidavit because it overstated what he knew and witnessed, according to the recording.

And he made the recording himself for the scam Project Veritas and the idiots released it claiming it showed coercion.
 

Jimmy Higgins

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He is almost to $250,000! And this is after Project Veritas releases 2 hours of audio that includes the guy saying Project Veritas wrote up the affidavit!
 

ZiprHead

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He is almost to $250,000! And this is after Project Veritas releases 2 hours of audio that includes the guy saying Project Veritas wrote up the affidavit!

Ooh, he's making money.

If I was the postmaster he lied about, I would sue him for every penny for defamation.
 
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