Ohio Strikes People From Voter Registration For Not Voting

[Rhea]

Or, we could decide that a 4-in-200,000,000 chance of voter fraud is not worth a 20,000-in-200,000,000 voter suppression,
(numbers are invented, but that's about the size difference of one problem versus the other problem)
And never choose to use voter suppression as a way to combat voter fraud.

Catch the one voting fraudulently for Dad, throw the book at them, deter others.

 

[ronburgundy]

Keeping voter lists up-to-date is a reasonable thing to do.

“He took a lot of time choosing his candidates,” said Annette Givans of her father, John Cenkner.

Cenkner died in Palmdale in 2003. Despite this, records show that he somehow voted from the grave in 2004, 2005, 2006, 2008 and 2010.

But he’s not the only one.

http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2016/05/23/cbs2-investigation-uncovers-votes-being-cast-from-grave-year-after-year/

Removing currently living people that are currently registered and currently want to vote from the registrar is the exact opposite of "keeping the lists up to date".

There are public government records of death. It would be far easier to use those lists than to create lists of people who haven't voted in the past 6 elections. Besides, this GOP shitbag exposes the dishonesty of his motives, because if dead people voting was such an issue, then failure to vote recently would not indicate that you were dead. Not only is he removing living and registered voters, but he is failing to remove many of the dead people he is pretending this is about.
This approach would only every be taken or supported by people more interested in blocking the most basic rights of people that do not vote consistently (minorities, poor, younger voters), than any sincere concern with voter fraud or dead people voting.

 

[dismal]

The article you posted mentioned that the Sec of State sent postcards to folks who hadn't voted. This link was to make the obvious point that people die. If there was no process to remove inactive voters from the rolls, then President Taft could still vote in Ohio.

Does the state not issue death certificates? Why can't the voter rolls be cross-ref with those instead of just willy-nilly disenfranchising thousands?

We are committed to operating our voting system with 19th century technology. But I suppose that could be done with enormous rooms full of clerks with green eyeshades.

 

[fast]

Or, we could decide that a 4-in-200,000,000 chance of voter fraud is not worth a 20,000-in-200,000,000 voter suppression,
(numbers are invented, but that's about the size difference of one problem versus the other problem)
And never choose to use voter suppression as a way to combat voter fraud.

Catch the one voting fraudulently for Dad, throw the book at them, deter others.

No objections

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

The article you posted mentioned that the Sec of State sent postcards to folks who hadn't voted. This link was to make the obvious point that people die. If there was no process to remove inactive voters from the rolls, then President Taft could still vote in Ohio.

Does the state not issue death certificates? Why can't the voter rolls be cross-ref with those instead of just willy-nilly disenfranchising thousands?

I think dismal provided the answer:

We are committed to operating our voting system with 19th century technology. But I suppose that could be done with enormous rooms full of clerks with green eyeshades.

So it would be too expensive and would probably compete with and draw resources away from all the regular local bingo games.

Apparently in Ohio they have integrated their technology so that they know when people are either alive or dead but didn't vote, but they don't know when people are dead but didn't vote.

Understand?

 

[SimpleDon]

It kind of calls in question, why do we bother to register voters at all? What is the purpose of registering voters?

What is the difference between registering voters, purging the registration rolls if you don't vote often enough and then allowing election day registration? Why not let anyone who shows up with the proper ID card vote?

In Georgia now the document requirements to be able to vote on election day are much stricter than the documents that are required to register. It doesn't make any sense, then to register voters.

In Georgia they have a computer system to log that you voted that is checked to see if you have already voted in another polling place, so that you can't vote twice.

But it doesn't check if you have voted absentee. Apparently that is too much trouble to go to. In fact, as strict as Georgia is about the voter ID card, all that you have to do is to sign a declaration that you are qualified to vote to get an absentee ballot. In fact, a single person can get up to nine absentee ballots by submitting a list of registered voters and signing a declaration that all of the names are of qualified, living voters.

Can someone explain this difference to me? Why are they so strict about one method of voting, showing up at a polling place, and so lax about the alternative, by mail using absentee ballots?

I thought that it guts democracy if a single unqualified person votes? And yet, all of the voter fraud cases in the last twenty years or so in Georgia have involved absentee ballots.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

It kind of calls in question, why do we bother to register voters at all? What is the purpose of registering voters?

What is the difference between registering voters, purging the registration rolls if you don't vote often enough and then allowing election day registration? Why not let anyone who shows up with the proper ID card vote?

In Georgia now the document requirements to be able to vote on election day are much stricter than the documents that are required to register. It doesn't make any sense, then to register voters.

In Georgia they have a computer system to log that you voted that is checked to see if you have already voted in another polling place, so that you can't vote twice.

But it doesn't check if you have voted absentee. Apparently that is too much trouble to go to. In fact, as strict as Georgia is about the voter ID card, all that you have to do is to sign a declaration that you are qualified to vote to get an absentee ballot. In fact, a single person can get up to nine absentee ballots by submitting a list of registered voters and signing a declaration that all of the names are of qualified, living voters.

Can someone explain this difference to me? Why are they so strict about one method of voting, showing up at a polling place, and so lax about the alternative, by mail using absentee ballots?

You mean other than voter suppression? Each of these rules is generally developed in order to restrict a person's ability to vote, not protect it. In poll voting fraud isn't easy or wise.

I thought that it guts democracy if a single unqualified person votes? And yet, all of the voter fraud cases in the last twenty years or so in Georgia have involved absentee ballots.

It is fishy, isn't it.

 

[dismal]

So it would be too expensive and would probably compete with and draw resources away from all the regular local bingo games.

If only the states had invested in some sort of moon shot technology that could maintain a database of people's names and addresses and produce some sort of official photo identification based thereupon, and could be cross-referenced with other official databases.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Did a little digging. Apparently this method of notification is straight out of the Federal legislation on voting. So this a bit much to do about nothing.

However, as ld notes, it seems silly to run it this way, but not allow same day voting registration.

 

[Playball40]

Keeping voter lists up-to-date is a reasonable thing to do.

“He took a lot of time choosing his candidates,” said Annette Givans of her father, John Cenkner.

Cenkner died in Palmdale in 2003. Despite this, records show that he somehow voted from the grave in 2004, 2005, 2006, 2008 and 2010.

But he’s not the only one.

http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2016/05/23/cbs2-investigation-uncovers-votes-being-cast-from-grave-year-after-year/

Sorry but this does not mean voter fraud. It's possible some of these people had identical names to someone else and the poll worker marked it off wrong. It's possible some poll worker checked off Sr. when it should have been Jr. There are many reasons for this disparity, not all of which mean 'fraud'. And if it was so easy for them to cross check SS records to voting lists, they should be able to do the same in Ohio without removing someone for "not voting". Some people will only vote on issues that matter to them. There is no law against that.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

This is common--don't vote for too long and they figure you aren't there anymore. It's the only way to purge the rolls as there's no reporting of the fact you moved away.

Carrying people on the rolls that aren't really there costs them money in sample ballots etc, I have no problem with such purges. They aren't voter suppression.

 

[Rhea]

Some people will only vote on issues that matter to them. There is no should not be a law against that.

For accuracy. Because apparently there is.

 

[laughing dog]

This is common--don't vote for too long and they figure you aren't there anymore. It's the only way to purge the rolls as there's no reporting of the fact you moved away....

Since Ohio does not allow registration on election day, it is a form of voter suppression.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

This is common--don't vote for too long and they figure you aren't there anymore. It's the only way to purge the rolls as there's no reporting of the fact you moved away.

Carrying people on the rolls that aren't really there costs them money in sample ballots etc, I have no problem with such purges. They aren't voter suppression.

It is too bad people don't file something every year and send it to the state that could be used to determine if a person lived at that address. Something that maybe you had to fill out... and submit in the spring, maybe April. Because voting is important, you'd need to make certain this document was of high standing... maybe required a signature too!

Only if this could be set up in each state, that way we'd have a good idea of who lived where and whether their address was current with their voter registration.

I guess I can only dream.

 

[Arctish]

This is common--don't vote for too long and they figure you aren't there anymore. It's the only way to purge the rolls as there's no reporting of the fact you moved away.

Carrying people on the rolls that aren't really there costs them money in sample ballots etc, I have no problem with such purges. They aren't voter suppression.

It is too bad people don't file something every year and send it to the state that could be used to determine if a person lived at that address. Something that maybe you had to fill out... and submit in the spring, maybe April. Because voting is important, you'd need to make certain this document was of high standing... maybe required a signature too!

Only if this could be set up in each state, that way we'd have a good idea of who lived where and whether their address was current with their voter registration.

I guess I can only dream.

Your dream would purge the rolls of Libertarians and lazy people. They don't like having to register their vehicles. How do you think they would feel about having to register themselves with the government every year?

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

It is too bad people don't file something every year and send it to the state that could be used to determine if a person lived at that address. Something that maybe you had to fill out... and submit in the spring, maybe April. Because voting is important, you'd need to make certain this document was of high standing... maybe required a signature too!

Only if this could be set up in each state, that way we'd have a good idea of who lived where and whether their address was current with their voter registration.

I guess I can only dream.

Your dream would purge the rolls of Libertarians and lazy people. They don't like having to register their vehicles. How do you think they would feel about having to register themselves with the government every year?

I was referring to taxes.

 

[Rhea]

Your dream would purge the rolls of Libertarians and lazy people. They don't like having to register their vehicles. How do you think they would feel about having to register themselves with the government every year?

I was referring to taxes.

Exactly. It does not take a rocket scientist to create a program that can be fed all of the following and make an educated guess as to which people are alive and residing but not voting, and which people are dead but voting and which people are dead, moved or incapacitated and not voting.

• Tax Return database of names and addresses
• Motor vehicle data base of names and addresses
• Utility databases of names and addresses
• Voter registration database of names and addresses
• Military list of names and addresses
• Public assistance list of names and addresses
• Property tax databases of names and addresses
• death record database
• birth record database
• marriage record database

Feed them in, correlate them, investigate only the anomalies.

 

[Frikki]

Today in Holy fucking shit are you fucking kidding me?! Land^® , we come to this article.



And for the inevitable conclusion:

Voters of all stripes in Ohio are affected, but the policy appears to be helping Republicans in the state's largest metropolitan areas, according to a Reuters survey of voter lists. In the state’s three largest counties that include Cleveland, Cincinnati and Columbus, voters have been struck from the rolls in Democratic-leaning neighborhoods at roughly twice the rate as in Republican neighborhoods.

Over 144,000 voters were stricken from the voter rolls in the three largest counties in the state (also known as where Democrats live), Cuyahoga (Cleveland), Franklin (Columbus), and Hamilton (Cincinnati). FYI, the winning margin for W in Ohio was about 120k and 170k. Obama was a bit higher, around 160k and 270k.

Our wonderful Secretary of State, John Husted: "If this is really important thing to you in your life, voting, you probably would have done so within a six-year period."

To muddle the waters a bit:

Federal law prohibits states from removing voters solely because they haven't voted, but it also requires them to keep voter lists up to date. Ohio residents who are removed from voting lists must re-register at least 30 days before an election.

Which seems to make one wonder how this process is even legal.

What kind of a fucking third world country are you running over there?

- - - Updated - - -

This is common--don't vote for too long and they figure you aren't there anymore. It's the only way to purge the rolls as there's no reporting of the fact you moved away.

Carrying people on the rolls that aren't really there costs them money in sample ballots etc, I have no problem with such purges. They aren't voter suppression.

Loren I hope that all the things you support happen to you.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

This is common--don't vote for too long and they figure you aren't there anymore. It's the only way to purge the rolls as there's no reporting of the fact you moved away....

Since Ohio does not allow registration on election day, it is a form of voter suppression.

Respond to the notice you get!

- - - Updated - - -

This is common--don't vote for too long and they figure you aren't there anymore. It's the only way to purge the rolls as there's no reporting of the fact you moved away.

Carrying people on the rolls that aren't really there costs them money in sample ballots etc, I have no problem with such purges. They aren't voter suppression.

It is too bad people don't file something every year and send it to the state that could be used to determine if a person lived at that address. Something that maybe you had to fill out... and submit in the spring, maybe April. Because voting is important, you'd need to make certain this document was of high standing... maybe required a signature too!

Only if this could be set up in each state, that way we'd have a good idea of who lived where and whether their address was current with their voter registration.

I guess I can only dream.

There's no requirement to file a tax return if your income is low enough. Furthermore, that runs afoul of privacy laws.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

I was referring to taxes.

Exactly. It does not take a rocket scientist to create a program that can be fed all of the following and make an educated guess as to which people are alive and residing but not voting, and which people are dead but voting and which people are dead, moved or incapacitated and not voting.

• Tax Return database of names and addresses
• Motor vehicle data base of names and addresses
• Utility databases of names and addresses
• Voter registration database of names and addresses
• Military list of names and addresses
• Public assistance list of names and addresses
• Property tax databases of names and addresses
• death record database
• birth record database
• marriage record database

Feed them in, correlate them, investigate only the anomalies.

You realize many of these involve things where name duplication is a possibility?

And what about the house behind us? The owners now live in California but they still own the house here. (I have no idea why, although starting this year I think they've taken to renting it out as we see various people staying there.)

And how do you plan to use voter registration to verify voter registration?

- - - Updated - - -

This is common--don't vote for too long and they figure you aren't there anymore. It's the only way to purge the rolls as there's no reporting of the fact you moved away.

Carrying people on the rolls that aren't really there costs them money in sample ballots etc, I have no problem with such purges. They aren't voter suppression.

Loren I hope that all the things you support happen to you.

Just how hard is it to vote? This case involves someone who has skipped the last three (at a minimum) general elections.