Politics vs Tradition - derail from Can we rename this forum

[Lion IRC]

Current US politics aren't very presidential!

The forum is US Presidential Politics.

Sure, times have changed in the U.S. and there's a lot of dead Presidents turning in their graves.
But Trump is what happens when respect for institutions and traditions gets flushed down the toilet. And it was the liberal Left who taught altright conservatives that manners are overrated.

 

[iolo]

Current US politics aren't very presidential!

The forum is US Presidential Politics.

Sure, times have changed in the U.S. and there's a lot of dead Presidents turning in their graves.
But Trump is what happens when respect for institutions and traditions gets flushed down the toilet. And it was the liberal Left who taught altright conservatives that manners are overrated.

Aye, you miss slavery and lynching, naturally. Respect honesty and decency, matey!

 

[RavenSky]

But Trump is what happens when respect for institutions and traditions gets flushed down the toilet. And it was the liberal Left who taught altright conservatives that manners are overrated.

Manners matter... as in getting the family's permission before invoking your religion at their loved one's funeral?

Because that is what your linked article is talking about...

"the new cemetery director began enforcing a little-noticed 2007 policy that prohibits volunteer honor guards from reading recitations — including religious ones — in their funeral rituals, unless families specifically request them." (bolding mine)

Are you suggesting that having the good manners to ask the families what (if any) invocations they might want at the grave-side service is a bad thing?

 

[Lion IRC]

Can we rename this thread?

Boobs.


we need to reman it "Boobs"

In the hope someone will post some, or in reference to your president and his underlings?

moobs

View attachment 11166

a young Steve Bannon

Eeeeewww!

 

[funinspace]

Current US politics aren't very presidential!

The forum is US Presidential Politics.

Sure, times have changed in the U.S. and there's a lot of dead Presidents turning in their graves.
But Trump is what happens when respect for institutions and traditions gets flushed down the toilet. And it was the liberal Left who taught altright conservatives that manners are overrated.

I seriously don't get the idea of some volunteers doing their own thing at a funeral thinking they have rights to spout their mouth off w/o asking the family who arranged the affair, if they can speak in the first fucking place. Respect my ass! This is more than a tad personal for me, as I buried my father last year in a national cemetery, as he was a veteran from WWII. I guess I'm glad that we didn't have volunteer honor guards in our parts...didn't know that volunteers were allowed to stick their dicks into other peoples business at a national cemetery w/o asking...talk about lacking manners.

My father was one of those veterans who didn't need to wave his status in peoples face, and snivel that he should be showed respect. I have a couple in-law relatives that think their short play time in the military gives them the right to demand everyone cheer them, give them little trinket benefits, et.al. They are braggarts, blowhards, and no-nothings that my father had little respect for. They are perfect poster children for alt-right snowflakes...

 

[ronburgundy]

But Trump is what happens when respect for institutions and traditions gets flushed down the toilet. And it was the liberal Left who taught altright conservatives that manners are overrated.

Manners matter... as in getting the family's permission before invoking your religion at their loved one's funeral?

Because that is what your linked article is talking about...

"the new cemetery director began enforcing a little-noticed 2007 policy that prohibits volunteer honor guards from reading recitations — including religious ones — in their funeral rituals, unless families specifically request them." (bolding mine)

Are you suggesting that having the good manners to ask the families what (if any) invocations they might want at the grave-side service is a bad thing?

Yeah, religious zealots like Lion IRC tend to view their ability to forcibly cram their religion down others people's throats to be their "right", and thus view it as a violation of their "rights" when the real rights of others are protected against such coercion and theocratic authoritarianism.

 

[ronburgundy]

Current US politics aren't very presidential!

The forum is US Presidential Politics.

Sure, times have changed in the U.S. and there's a lot of dead Presidents turning in their graves.
But Trump is what happens when respect for institutions and traditions gets flushed down the toilet. And it was the liberal Left who taught altright conservatives that manners are overrated.

"Respect tradition" means nothing other than to blindly obey authority and accept being coerced against your will. Any tradition that has any real positive value and that arises because it serves the majorities interests will naturally thrive and be respected for its actual consequences not because it is tradition. Demand that a tradition be "respected" only is required when the tradition is worthy of respect.

For example, the tradition of not eating feces is alive and well, with only a few German perverts going against it
No one need enforce it or even remind others of it, because it is a tradition arising from its continued benefits to all.
In contrast, religious traditions about food restrictions are dying off, and their proponents having to actively promote them to try to stave off their demise. Disputes, family break ups, and even violence are caused by defenders of such traditions. That is because if they ever served any purpose other than authoritarian obedience, that purpose is long been extinct.

All human progress is knowledge, technology, medicine, politics, and morality have been the result of people telling tradition to fuck off.

 

[Cheerful Charlie]

Current US politics aren't very presidential!

The forum is US Presidential Politics.

Sure, times have changed in the U.S. and there's a lot of dead Presidents turning in their graves.
But Trump is what happens when respect for institutions and traditions gets flushed down the toilet. And it was the liberal Left who taught altright conservatives that manners are overrated.

Bulllllllshit! Long ago, when Reagan was running for president, I was listening to radio, when a high ranking leader of the Texas GOP explained the idea of "Negarive campaigning".


"If we can not build our candidates up, we will tear you candidates down!" and that has been the GOP MO ever since.I used to hear Reagan's 5 minute radio rants on the way to work, and the old bastard was an expert at irresponsible ranting and name calling.

We had the rise of that liar Jerry Falwell, and then the rise of Lee Atwater and his ilk. We had the rise of Faux news and it;s lying.

I have been living in the middle of the right's crusade against civility for years and years. They took this incivility as a central core of modern day conservatism, and no, it wasn't the left that did that.

 

[PyramidHead]

What is the purpose of calling the left the 'liberal left'? Is there a conservative left? I only hear that phrase used by Republicans, much like 'the Democrat party'.

 

[funinspace]

What is the purpose of calling the left the 'liberal left'? Is there a conservative left? I only hear that phrase used by Republicans, much like 'the Democrat party'.

It was to differentiate them from the 'libertarian left'

 

[Cheerful Charlie]

What is the purpose of calling the left the 'liberal left'? Is there a conservative left? I only hear that phrase used by Republicans, much like 'the Democrat party'.

It was to differentiate them from the 'libertarian left'

It is general name calling, buzz words for the right.

Frank Luntz, a GOP supporter long ago pioneered the use of name calling as a standard way of talking about Democrats and liberals etc.

"Luntz describes his specialty as "testing language and finding words that will help his clients sell their product or turn public opinion on an issue or a candidate."

This is now standard right wing way of making every statement about politics a pejorative when talking about Democrats, liberals or moderates.

If you are not familiar with Luntz, google for him. He has a long history of teaching the GOP to manipulate people with framing and emotionally fraught labels.

 

[iolo]

It was to differentiate them from the 'libertarian left'

It is general name calling, buzz words for the right.

Frank Luntz, a GOP supporter long ago pioneered the use of name calling as a standard way of talking about Democrats and liberals etc.

"Luntz describes his specialty as "testing language and finding words that will help his clients sell their product or turn public opinion on an issue or a candidate."

This is now standard right wing way of making every statement about politics a pejorative when talking about Democrats, liberals or moderates.

If you are not familiar with Luntz, google for him. He has a long history of teaching the GOP to manipulate people with framing and emotionally fraught labels.

Surely, though, there hasn't, except in extremely backward countries, been a liberal left since about 1850?

 

[Lion IRC]

The forum is US Presidential Politics.

Sure, times have changed in the U.S. and there's a lot of dead Presidents turning in their graves.
But Trump is what happens when respect for institutions and traditions gets flushed down the toilet. And it was the liberal Left who taught altright conservatives that manners are overrated.

Bulllllllshit! Long ago, when Reagan was running for president, I was listening to radio, when a high ranking leader of the Texas GOP explained the idea of "Negarive campaigning".


"If we can not build our candidates up, we will tear you candidates down!" and that has been the GOP MO ever since.I used to hear Reagan's 5 minute radio rants on the way to work, and the old bastard was an expert at irresponsible ranting and name calling.

We had the rise of that liar Jerry Falwell, and then the rise of Lee Atwater and his ilk. We had the rise of Faux news and it;s lying.

I have been living in the middle of the right's crusade against civility for years and years. They took this incivility as a central core of modern day conservatism, and no, it wasn't the left that did that.

Lee Atwater
LOL
Come on Charlie. Get with the program.
#gloves_off