• Welcome to the new Internet Infidels Discussion Board, formerly Talk Freethought.

Should this "Karen" be locked up for falsely accusing an innocent Black?

Derec

Contributor
Joined
Aug 19, 2002
Messages
21,880
Location
Atlanta, GA
Basic Beliefs
atheist
Pretty sure about 42 million people would be thrilled not to be national news. For example: I'm pretty sure that Breonna Taylor's family would be delighted if she remained obscure--and alive. Ditto Tamir Rice's family and Botham Jean's family and George Floyd's family and a lot of other families would be delighted if their family member were obscure and alive.

Had George Floyd not tried to pass that phony $20, he'd be obscure but most likely still dead because of all the fentanyl and meth in his system.
 

krypton iodine sulfur

Banned
Banned
Joined
Mar 25, 2015
Messages
1,045
Location
British Columbia
Basic Beliefs
n/a
Your example proves the point - the accusation was about rape.
Why do you think rape accusations require believing the female accuser without any evidence but cell phone theft is not?

Typically, rape victims actually witness the crime first hand, but an element of he said; she said often gets thrown into the mix, even when there is physical evidence. There have long been concerns of underreporting for a variety of reasons including (but not limited to) not being believed, being summarily discredited, victim blaming, or being denigrated. I assume the hashtag is #BelieveWomen due to statistical data indicating women are disproportionately affected and due to #MeToo being largely driven by women.

Reporting theft doesn't tend to face the same issues, or is at least not perceived to face them.

#BelieveWomen was a response to how people* reporting rape were mishandled and mistreated and what impact that had. The issue wasn't limited to getting criminal convictions, but even just to being generally heard, believed and supported. There was a heavy stigma to saying you were raped. Some took that hashtag to an extreme state of guilty until proven innocent. Others did not. I am not aware of a foremost definitive explanation of what it is supposed to mean in effect. I am just talking about what prompted the hashtag and why it exists in connection with rape/ sexual assault, specifically.

*I am saying 'people' in recognition of men/ boys and enbies who have faced the same issues. I didn't follow closely enough to know how inclusively most people interpreted the hashtag. I have fuckall interest in debating it one way or the other (nor, on the off chance he's reading along, having metaphor explain it with his particular brand of wtf).
 

Gospel

Unify Africa
Joined
Oct 22, 2007
Messages
3,090
Location
Florida
Gender
B====D
Basic Beliefs
Agnostic
Pretty sure about 42 million people would be thrilled not to be national news. For example: I'm pretty sure that Breonna Taylor's family would be delighted if she remained obscure--and alive. Ditto Tamir Rice's family and Botham Jean's family and George Floyd's family and a lot of other families would be delighted if their family member were obscure and alive.

Had George Floyd not tried to pass that phony $20, he'd be obscure but most likely still dead because of all the fentanyl and meth in his system.

Had Derek Chauvin been as clever as you he wouldn't be facing second degree murder charges.
 

Harry Bosch

Contributor
Joined
Jul 4, 2014
Messages
5,908
Location
Washington
Basic Beliefs
Atheist
Pretty sure about 42 million people would be thrilled not to be national news. For example: I'm pretty sure that Breonna Taylor's family would be delighted if she remained obscure--and alive. Ditto Tamir Rice's family and Botham Jean's family and George Floyd's family and a lot of other families would be delighted if their family member were obscure and alive.

Had George Floyd not tried to pass that phony $20, he'd be obscure but most likely still dead because of all the fentanyl and meth in his system.

Nope. Being drug free wouldn't save a person from being chocked by 8 minutes and 26 seconds. The body needs air to survive.
 

TSwizzle

Let's Go Brandon!
Joined
Jan 8, 2015
Messages
6,558
Location
West Hollywood
Gender
Male
Basic Beliefs
Atheist
Karen stories are not national news.

Pretty sure about 42 million people would be thrilled not to be national news. For example: I'm pretty sure that Breonna Taylor's family would be delighted if she remained obscure--and alive. Ditto Tamir Rice's family and Botham Jean's family and George Floyd's family and a lot of other families would be delighted if their family member were obscure and alive.

Three people squabbling over a phone in a hotel lobby is not national news.
 

ZiprHead

Loony Running The Asylum
Staff member
Joined
Oct 23, 2002
Messages
30,591
Location
Frozen in Michigan
Gender
Old Fart
Basic Beliefs
Democratic Socialist Atheist
There are already laws on the books against physical violence against other people outside of legal justification. Why not apply them? You haven't given a good reason to exempt her from the legal or social consequences for her behavior.

Women are never charged for domestic violence.

And while on the subject, the real news should be all the fake domestic charges that routinely happen during divorce. Why is all that lying socially acceptable? If a women wants the guy out she fills out an order of protection even if there was never any harm done to anyone. Why is that socially acceptable to society and wrong people accused on a routine basis? But then in this case, someone not stealing a phone is some kind of big news for this story?

Its because the media has to make the news and not report it.

Never?

It was an issue in an election here a few cycles ago--big guy calls the police on his little tiny wife and got her arrested. Which is exactly what he should have done in response to domestic violence!

It was not uncommon on the tv show COPS that women were arrested for domestic violence.
 

TomC

Celestial Highness
Joined
Oct 1, 2020
Messages
4,374
Location
Midwestern USA
Gender
Faggot
Basic Beliefs
Agnostic deist
Pretty sure about 42 million people would be thrilled not to be national news. For example: I'm pretty sure that Breonna Taylor's family would be delighted if she remained obscure--and alive. Ditto Tamir Rice's family and Botham Jean's family and George Floyd's family and a lot of other families would be delighted if their family member were obscure and alive.

Had George Floyd not tried to pass that phony $20, he'd be obscure but most likely still dead because of all the fentanyl and meth in his system.

Nope. Being drug free wouldn't save a person from being chocked by 8 minutes and 26 seconds. The body needs air to survive.

But then again,
if Floyd hadn't tried pass a fake $20.
and if Floyd hadn't demanded to be let out of the police car
and hadn't remained belligerent after getting out of the car
and Chauvin didn't know him as the burly bar bouncer Chauvin used to work with

Maybe Floyd could have gone on living a life of crime and drugs. But the life expectancy wouldn't have been very good.
Tom
 

ZiprHead

Loony Running The Asylum
Staff member
Joined
Oct 23, 2002
Messages
30,591
Location
Frozen in Michigan
Gender
Old Fart
Basic Beliefs
Democratic Socialist Atheist
Nope. Being drug free wouldn't save a person from being chocked by 8 minutes and 26 seconds. The body needs air to survive.

But then again,
if Floyd hadn't tried pass a fake $20.
and if Floyd hadn't demanded to be let out of the police car
and hadn't remained belligerent after getting out of the car
and Chauvin didn't know him as the burly bar bouncer Chauvin used to work with

Maybe Floyd could have gone on living a life of crime and drugs. But the life expectancy wouldn't have been very good.
Tom

You see a homeless guy dying in the street from pneumonia and you bash his head in with a rock, are you any less a murderer?
 

laughing dog

Contributor
Joined
Dec 29, 2004
Messages
21,159
Location
Minnesota
Gender
IT
Basic Beliefs
Dogs rule
Your example proves the point - the accusation was about rape.
Why do you think rape accusations require believing the female accuser without any evidence but cell phone theft is not?
Since I have repeatedly written (frequently in response to your blather), that it is about believing but verify, you ought to know the answer to your question - I don't.

One could belief that woman's story and one could have easily verified its veracity without engaging in violence or hysterics.

Rape is a much more serious crime, and thus protections for the (often falsely) accused need to be stronger than for larceny, not weaker.
Nope. One's life can easily be ruined any false accusation of any crime.

Before a story is verified or refuted the correct stance is neutrality, not automatically believing the woman.
There are plenty of instances of half-assed verification attempts of rape allegations. Belief implies one takes the accusation seriously and puts in the commiserate effort. I realize that upsets rape apologists, but that is what it means.
 

TomC

Celestial Highness
Joined
Oct 1, 2020
Messages
4,374
Location
Midwestern USA
Gender
Faggot
Basic Beliefs
Agnostic deist
Nope. Being drug free wouldn't save a person from being chocked by 8 minutes and 26 seconds. The body needs air to survive.

But then again,
if Floyd hadn't tried pass a fake $20.
and if Floyd hadn't demanded to be let out of the police car
and hadn't remained belligerent after getting out of the car
and Chauvin didn't know him as the burly bar bouncer Chauvin used to work with

Maybe Floyd could have gone on living a life of crime and drugs. But the life expectancy wouldn't have been very good.
Tom

You see a homeless guy dying in the street from pneumonia and you bash his head in with a rock, are you any less a murderer?

In what universe is that relevant?
Tom
 

Derec

Contributor
Joined
Aug 19, 2002
Messages
21,880
Location
Atlanta, GA
Basic Beliefs
atheist
Typically, rape victims actually witness the crime first hand,
If there is a rape to begin with. Calling an accuser "rape victim" prejudges the case because it assumes she is telling the truth.

but an element of he said; she said often gets thrown into the mix, even when there is physical evidence.
Of course it is "he said, she said" as usually it is one person's word against the other. As far as physical evidence, it really depends on what it is evidence of. If both parties agree that there was sex but disagree on consent, then physical evidence of sex is immaterial.

There have long been concerns of underreporting for a variety of reasons including (but not limited to) not being believed, being summarily discredited, victim blaming, or being denigrated. I assume the hashtag is #BelieveWomen due to statistical data indicating women are disproportionately affected and due to #MeToo being largely driven by women.
The claims of underreporting are just guesses, and in any case any underreporting does not justify believing the accuser automatically without evidence. There is still presumption of innocence.

Reporting theft doesn't tend to face the same issues, or is at least not perceived to face them.

So evidence should be required for theft but not rape?

#BelieveWomen was a response to how people* reporting rape were mishandled and mistreated and what impact that had.
Which is bullshit. When Crystal Mangum falsely accused those lacrosse players she got a great deal of support and sympathy while her victims were dragged through the mud in the media and even suspended by their own school.
When Jackie Coakley make false accusations of having been raped she was likewise supported. Many continued supporting her even after her claims were shown to be completely made up.

Blasey-Ford was also supported despite her not coming forward for 30 years and not being able to remember when or where the alleged rape allegedly happened. Same with that crazy woman who claimed Trump raped her in the changing room at Barney's.

The issue wasn't limited to getting criminal convictions, but even just to being generally heard, believed and supported.

Bullshit. First of all, the goal should not be to get more criminal convictions. Nobody should be convicted of a crime unless the guilt is proven beyond a reasonable doubt.
Second, rape accusers are heard, supported and believed (often without evidence or contrary to available evidence) plenty.

There was a heavy stigma to saying you were raped. Some took that hashtag to an extreme state of guilty until proven innocent. Others did not. I am not aware of a foremost definitive explanation of what it is supposed to mean in effect. I am just talking about what prompted the hashtag and why it exists in connection with rape/ sexual assault, specifically.

It is feminist nonsense. If you say "believe women" you claim in effect that women are trustworthy just for being women. It is sexist at its core.

*I am saying 'people' in recognition of men/ boys and enbies who have faced the same issues. I didn't follow closely enough to know how inclusively most people interpreted the hashtag. I have fuckall interest in debating it one way or the other (nor, on the off chance he's reading along, having metaphor explain it with his particular brand of wtf).

The hashtag is very gender-exclusive.
 

Derec

Contributor
Joined
Aug 19, 2002
Messages
21,880
Location
Atlanta, GA
Basic Beliefs
atheist
Nope. Being drug free wouldn't save a person from being chocked by 8 minutes and 26 seconds. The body needs air to survive.
It's not like Floyd was strangled. Chauvin merely kept his knee on Floyd's back. Had Floyd's lungs not been full of liquid because of his overdose, he'd have been fine.
 

Derec

Contributor
Joined
Aug 19, 2002
Messages
21,880
Location
Atlanta, GA
Basic Beliefs
atheist
Since I have repeatedly written (frequently in response to your blather), that it is about believing but verify, you ought to know the answer to your question - I don't.
What you have repeatedly written is nonsensical. If you a-priori believe the female accuser, you are disbelieving the accused. "Believe women" means to prejudge the case no matter how much you want to weasel out of the logical implications of the hashtag.

One could belief that woman's story and one could have easily verified its veracity without engaging in violence or hysterics.
If you already believe her story there is confirmation bias at hand - see Nifong, Mike.
Same if you already disbelieve her. Both will affect how investigators and prosecutors view evidence meant to verify the claims.
The only fair position is one of neutrality, not a-priori belief in favor of either side.

Nope. One's life can easily be ruined any false accusation of any crime.
Being falsely accused of any crime is bad, yes, but there is a world of difference between being accused of petty theft and a major felony.
Being expelled for rape also ruins one's life, and yet you are on the record of not supporting any due process rights for college students falsely accused of rape.

There are plenty of instances of half-assed verification attempts of rape allegations. Belief implies one takes the accusation seriously and puts in the commiserate effort. I realize that upsets rape apologists, but that is what it means.

Belief means you are prejudging the case. And calling everybody who disagrees with you "rape apologists" is really low.
 

laughing dog

Contributor
Joined
Dec 29, 2004
Messages
21,159
Location
Minnesota
Gender
IT
Basic Beliefs
Dogs rule
What you have repeatedly written is nonsensical.
Nope.
If you a-priori believe the female accuser, you are disbelieving the accused. "Believe women" means to prejudge the case no matter how much you want to weasel out of the logical implications of the hashtag.
Only to rape apologists.

Being falsely accused of any crime is bad, yes, but there is a world of difference between being accused of petty theft and a major felony.
Depends on the area.

Being expelled for rape also ruins one's life
Do you have any actual evidence to support that? Do you think transcripts have a big red letter R stamped on them or even say "expelled" at all?

, and yet you are on the record of not supporting any due process rights for college students falsely accused of rape.
That is a blatant and gross misrepresentation but par for your course in these matters.
Derec said:
Belief means you are prejudging the case.
No, it does not. You can repeat that all you want but that does not make it true.
Derec[QUOTE=Derec said:
And calling everybody who disagrees with you "rape apologists" is really low.
That is true, no one to my knowledge is calling everybody a "rape apologist" who disagrees.
 

TomC

Celestial Highness
Joined
Oct 1, 2020
Messages
4,374
Location
Midwestern USA
Gender
Faggot
Basic Beliefs
Agnostic deist
You see a homeless guy dying in the street from pneumonia and you bash his head in with a rock, are you any less a murderer?

In what universe is that relevant?
Tom
The same one as your "what ifs" .

Could you explain that a bit more?

Floyd was put in a police car. He was safe there. He demanded to be let out. He was.

Could you explain what you mean by "what ifs"? What I was talking about was the "since thens". Floyd got what he wanted. Since he did, he's pretty much responsible for the outcome.
Not entirely. Chauvin could have done better. But mostly Floyd got his way. Didn't work out well, as often happens when drug addled people get their way.
Tom
 

laughing dog

Contributor
Joined
Dec 29, 2004
Messages
21,159
Location
Minnesota
Gender
IT
Basic Beliefs
Dogs rule
The same one as your "what ifs" .

Could you explain that a bit more?

Floyd was put in a police car. He was safe there. He demanded to be let out. He was.

Could you explain what you mean by "what ifs"? What I was talking about was the "since thens". Floyd got what he wanted. Since he did, he's pretty much responsible for the outcome.
Not entirely. Chauvin could have done better. But mostly Floyd got his way. Didn't work out well, as often happens when drug addled people get their way.
Tom
It is ridiculous to say Mr. Floyd wanted death because that is what he got. To say he is responsible for having Mr. Chauvin violated Minneapolis police procedure and sit on his neck for more than 8 minutes is idiotic.
 

Toni

Contributor
Joined
Aug 11, 2011
Messages
15,171
Location
NOT laying back and thinking of England
Basic Beliefs
Peace on Earth, goodwill towards all
The same one as your "what ifs" .

Could you explain that a bit more?

Floyd was put in a police car. He was safe there. He demanded to be let out. He was.

Could you explain what you mean by "what ifs"? What I was talking about was the "since thens". Floyd got what he wanted. Since he did, he's pretty much responsible for the outcome.
Not entirely. Chauvin could have done better. But mostly Floyd got his way. Didn't work out well, as often happens when drug addled people get their way.
Tom

Your description of events is dramatically at odds with actual events.
 

Arctish

Centimillionaire
Joined
Jul 30, 2003
Messages
6,205
Location
Alaska
Basic Beliefs
Agnostic Humanist
Derec, what was the point you were trying to make when you introduced George Floyd and #Believe Women into this discussion?

Are you suggesting the clerk who reported Floyd had paid for something with a counterfeit bill should not have been believed if they were female, but should have been believed if they were male? Or are you saying the clerk should not have been believed at all? And how does this relate to the OP?
 

Loren Pechtel

Super Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Sep 16, 2000
Messages
36,308
Location
Nevada
Gender
Yes
Basic Beliefs
Atheist
Fine, if you want to look at it like that, I'm blaming the victim. The victim had the choice of indulging in a trivial act that had a great chance to de-escalate a tense situation and he chose not to do so. Cops shouldn't "get away with that" and neither should any of us. His failure to recognize this choice for the bad choice that it was likely contributed to the increased danger of himself and his son.

And just to be clear, I'm not ONLY blaming the victim. She screwed up, but he did too and it doesn't help society to ignore or excuse people making bad choices like this. Life isn't like a simplistic TV drama where one side is the good guys and one side is the bad guys. Sometimes everyone is the badguy. Sometimes everyone is the good guy but they all make bad choices. Why can't we recognize this fact so that we can move on and all make better choices?

Showing a nutcase the phone risks her snatching it.
 

Loren Pechtel

Super Moderator
Staff member
Joined
Sep 16, 2000
Messages
36,308
Location
Nevada
Gender
Yes
Basic Beliefs
Atheist
It was not uncommon on the tv show COPS that women were arrested for domestic violence.

It's not uncommon in real life either.

"COPS" was following real police recording what they did. Thus it was real life, although no guarantee the cases presented are representative of everything the police see.
 

ZiprHead

Loony Running The Asylum
Staff member
Joined
Oct 23, 2002
Messages
30,591
Location
Frozen in Michigan
Gender
Old Fart
Basic Beliefs
Democratic Socialist Atheist
New video shows woman attacking teen she falsely accused of stealing her iPhone at Soho hotel

Authorities in New York City released parts of a security camera video Wednesday showing a woman rushing at and attempting to tackle the 14-year-old son of jazz musician Keyon Harrold who she falsely accused of stealing her iPhone that she left in an Uber.

The 10-second clip shows the woman tackling Keyon Harrold Jr. and encircling her arms around him on Saturday in the lobby of the Arlo Soho, an upscale, boutique hotel in New York where Harrold and his son were guests, the hotel said.

The New York City Police Department said Tuesday that the teen's father “sustained scratches to his hand.” No other injuries were reported.

Police said they are searching for the woman and have “positively identified” her, but have not publicly identified her. The incident was not being investigated as a bias incident, according to police. Harrold and his son are Black and have suggested that racial bias played a role in the incident.

Video in the link.
 
Last edited:

TV and credit cards

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 17, 2013
Messages
4,437
Location
muh-dahy-nuh
Basic Beliefs
Humanist
Objectivity

I really wouldn't expect anything other than local news to cover this or the bicyclists attack on the BMW in Manhattan. If you search both with NYTimes preceding... well, you probably know what the results will be. Maybe I'm missing the mark with "NYTimes Manhattan BMW attack". I have no trouble finding this story. "NYTimes Harrold", "NYTimes Arlo".

As messed up as the young lady's conduct was, I still see no racial component to glom onto. Perhaps in time when her name is released for social pillorying there will be something, some little thing we can pretzel into a less than "woke" comment by her. I can't imagine she doesn't have a facebook page. She has yet to be outed by any facebook "friend". We'll see. Or not, depending on the outcome and our news sources.
 

TomC

Celestial Highness
Joined
Oct 1, 2020
Messages
4,374
Location
Midwestern USA
Gender
Faggot
Basic Beliefs
Agnostic deist
Since the Floyd discussion is a derail, I'll just quote one thing from Wikipedia:

According to prosecutors, Floyd told the officers that he was not resisting, but that he was recovering from COVID-19, that he was claustrophobic and suffered from anxiety, and that he did not want to sit in the car.[8][9][15]:3:10[61] While Kueng and Lane attempted to put him in the car, Floyd begged them not to, repeatedly saying "I can't breathe" and offering to lie on the ground instead.[9][61][62] During his interview with crime investigators, Lane said that he first saw Floyd bleeding from the mouth at that moment, which he attributed to his "thrashing back and forth" in the car and hitting his face on the glass that goes to the front seat.

Had Floyd stayed in the car this tragedy wouldn't have happened. Not justifying Chauvin, just pointing out that there's plenty of blame to spread around.

Somehow this part of the story doesn't get mentioned much by the SJWs.
Tom
 

Mumbles

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 12, 2007
Messages
1,585
Location
Maryland
Basic Beliefs
Atheist
Since the Floyd discussion is a derail, I'll just quote one thing from Wikipedia:

According to prosecutors, Floyd told the officers that he was not resisting, but that he was recovering from COVID-19, that he was claustrophobic and suffered from anxiety, and that he did not want to sit in the car.[8][9][15]:3:10[61] While Kueng and Lane attempted to put him in the car, Floyd begged them not to, repeatedly saying "I can't breathe" and offering to lie on the ground instead.[9][61][62] During his interview with crime investigators, Lane said that he first saw Floyd bleeding from the mouth at that moment, which he attributed to his "thrashing back and forth" in the car and hitting his face on the glass that goes to the front seat.

Had Floyd stayed in the car this tragedy wouldn't have happened. Not justifying Chauvin, just pointing out that there's plenty of blame to spread around.

Somehow this part of the story doesn't get mentioned much by the SJWs.
Tom

Putting aside the undefined insult "SJW"...someone who is obviously freaking out does not mean "put your full weight on his neck for 8+ minutes." That one should be obvious.
 
  • Like
Reactions: WAB

TomC

Celestial Highness
Joined
Oct 1, 2020
Messages
4,374
Location
Midwestern USA
Gender
Faggot
Basic Beliefs
Agnostic deist
And you believed that?

Well, if you insist on derailing...
Why wouldn't I? It was reported by local news covering the court proceedings. Now it's on Wikipedia.
And frankly, it's more plausible than than the common narrative about a blood thirsty killer looking for a black man to murder.

And let me repeat something. I'm not justifying how Chauvin handled it. He clearly screwed up royally.
Tom
 

WAB

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 3, 2004
Messages
4,059
Location
Hyperboria
Basic Beliefs
n/a
And you believed that?

Well, if you insist on derailing...
Why wouldn't I? It was reported by local news covering the court proceedings. Now it's on Wikipedia.
And frankly, it's more plausible than than the common narrative about a blood thirsty killer looking for a black man to murder.

And let me repeat something. I'm not justifying how Chauvin handled it. He clearly screwed up royally.
Tom

Are you claustrophobic? If someone did that to me I would react in an even worse way.
 

TomC

Celestial Highness
Joined
Oct 1, 2020
Messages
4,374
Location
Midwestern USA
Gender
Faggot
Basic Beliefs
Agnostic deist
And you believed that?

Well, if you insist on derailing...
Why wouldn't I? It was reported by local news covering the court proceedings. Now it's on Wikipedia.
And frankly, it's more plausible than than the common narrative about a blood thirsty killer looking for a black man to murder.

And let me repeat something. I'm not justifying how Chauvin handled it. He clearly screwed up royally.
Tom

Are you claustrophobic? If someone did that to me I would react in an even worse way.

He was in a car when this started.
Tom
 

WAB

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 3, 2004
Messages
4,059
Location
Hyperboria
Basic Beliefs
n/a
Are you claustrophobic? If someone did that to me I would react in an even worse way.

He was in a car when this started.
Tom

I know. The whole thing is a terrible affair.

Floyd was a criminal, and yet that cop should have acted differently. If someone had their knee on my neck and I was face down, I would probably not be able to remain calm for more than perhaps five or ten seconds.
 

TomC

Celestial Highness
Joined
Oct 1, 2020
Messages
4,374
Location
Midwestern USA
Gender
Faggot
Basic Beliefs
Agnostic deist
Are you claustrophobic? If someone did that to me I would react in an even worse way.

He was in a car when this started.
Tom

I know. The whole thing is a terrible affair.

Floyd was a criminal, and yet that cop should have acted differently. If someone had their knee on my neck and I was face down, I would probably not be able to remain calm for more than perhaps five or ten seconds.

I totally agree with this.
Tom
 
  • Like
Reactions: WAB

Don2 (Don1 Revised)

Contributor
Joined
Apr 1, 2004
Messages
11,641
Location
USA
Basic Beliefs
Nonpracticing agnostic
New video shows woman attacking teen she falsely accused of stealing her iPhone at Soho hotel

Authorities in New York City released parts of a security camera video Wednesday showing a woman rushing at and attempting to tackle the 14-year-old son of jazz musician Keyon Harrold who she falsely accused of stealing her iPhone that she left in an Uber.

The 10-second clip shows the woman tackling Keyon Harrold Jr. and encircling her arms around him on Saturday in the lobby of the Arlo Soho, an upscale, boutique hotel in New York where Harrold and his son were guests, the hotel said.

The New York City Police Department said Tuesday that the teen's father “sustained scratches to his hand.” No other injuries were reported.

Police said they are searching for the woman and have “positively identified” her, but have not publicly identified her. The incident was not being investigated as a bias incident, according to police. Harrold and his son are Black and have suggested that racial bias played a role in the incident.

Video in the link.

Her level of self-entitlement is shocking. She gets the hotel manager to act as her investigator all based on her word alone. She claims with no evidence another guest stole her phone and demands he prove his innocence. It's just an iphone. She doesn't call the phone. She doesn't retrace her steps. When her argument is refuted she gets antsy like she's on drugs. She keeps crossing a line past the hotel manager where he told her to stand back. She attacks the boy in order to try to get his phone. Then she lies that she is the one was assaulted even though cameras from multiple angles show she did it.

In regards to the op question of whether she should be locked up, I don't think it's a physically serious assault (maybe mentally) and if it's a first offense or a second, I don't think she should be jailed. That's a bit extreme. She maybe should be in an anger management program or diversion/rehabilitation with therapy/medication/ some kind of education about her sense of entitlement. Hypothetically...if she were generally a good person and was just having a really bad day where she flipped out, it starts to become understandable...but if that were true, then why was she lying about it after having a chance to calm down that she was the one assaulted? Where's the remorse? Therefore, barring some very unexpected other evidence such as an additional camera angle and earlier video of her being assaulted first that we haven't seen yet, I think she should be charged with assault and put in one of those accelerated rehabilitation programs.
 

Don2 (Don1 Revised)

Contributor
Joined
Apr 1, 2004
Messages
11,641
Location
USA
Basic Beliefs
Nonpracticing agnostic
Miya Ponsetto, 22 year old California resident, former cheerleader. Simi Valley.

Instagram:
https://www.instagram.com/miya_baby212/

Check out her comment about haters and who she follows: Arlo hotels, A LOT OF Trumps, kardashians, Proud Boys, but also one for BLM. Just one. Not sure what to make of that.

Info from heavy.com:
https://heavy.com/news/miya-ponsetto/

Online records show Ponsetto was arrested twice in 2020. She was charged on September 1 in West Los Angeles by the California Highway Patrol with driving while her license was suspended and failure to obey traffic lanes. She was previously charged on February 28 with public intoxication after an incident at LAX airport.

Traffic violations are normal. Also, she had gotten in trouble for being behind in her rent. I think this is normal for economically disadvantaged persons and so when she was driving with her license suspended this may also have been normal if she couldn't afford to pay for things with her car in order to get her license renewed. MAYBE. On the other hand, public intoxication seems unusual and given her license suspension may indicate a drug/alcohol problem. Also MAYBE. Given that she's just 22, it's maybe just the recklessness of youth. Maybe it's nothing but she does have a record not for assaults, though.

Edited to Add:
I have also found her ask.fm account which I don't think many other people found. I registered to see very disturbing sexual harassment directed at her by many peer posters. I mean, she's got tons of questions asked of her. About half are about attractiveness and many are inappropriate, instead of about other things.

I didn't see anything that said she was racist but it seems like the posts are from a few years back when she was a senior or just graduated, maybe.

There were two interesting things I'd like to bring to your attention...

In one post she claimed to have Italian, Greek, Puerto Rican, and Vietnamese ancestry.

In another, she gets the question: "If you could change one thing about yourself what would it be?" She responds, "how easily annoyed I am and my anger."

https://ask.fm/miyatayy
 

TomC

Celestial Highness
Joined
Oct 1, 2020
Messages
4,374
Location
Midwestern USA
Gender
Faggot
Basic Beliefs
Agnostic deist
She doesn't call the phone. She doesn't retrace her steps. When her argument is refuted she gets antsy like she's on drugs. She keeps crossing a line past the hotel manager where he told her to stand back.

I'm no mindreader, but I think this is the problem. She was high.

Drug addled people usually exhibit bad judgement. Which she did, in spades. Now, she seems to be in hiding.
She left her phone in a taxi. Then attacked a kid because he had a similar device, when she was too drug addled to take her phone with her from the car.

Yeah, that looks like drug addled behavior to me. I could be wrong.
Tom
 

TV and credit cards

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 17, 2013
Messages
4,437
Location
muh-dahy-nuh
Basic Beliefs
Humanist
She doesn't call the phone. She doesn't retrace her steps. When her argument is refuted she gets antsy like she's on drugs. She keeps crossing a line past the hotel manager where he told her to stand back.

I'm no mindreader, but I think this is the problem. She was high.

Drug addled people usually exhibit bad judgement. Which she did, in spades. Now, she seems to be in hiding.
She left her phone in a taxi. Then attacked a kid because he had a similar device, when she was too drug addled to take her phone with her from the car.

Yeah, that looks like drug addled behavior to me. I could be wrong.
Tom

No. No. I've seen this a number of times and none of them were high.

-My neighbor who stomped around like a lunatic about my landscaping while her brother and I tried in vain to appease her and her sister-in-law rolled her eyes at the spectacle.
-My sister who displayed a frightening level of paranoia when I attempted to help her execute our mother's will.
-A former student who after transferring from the Chicago area to San Diego was just absolutely beside herself with woe trying to solve a minor banking issue.
-A shipmate who prior to deployment, after being told her baby was not the navy's problem by the Legal Office absolutely broke down all over the front of my khakis in the passageway.
Just to name a few.

It is not fair to attribute an extreme emotional outburst to drug use, especially among inexperienced youth.
 

Don2 (Don1 Revised)

Contributor
Joined
Apr 1, 2004
Messages
11,641
Location
USA
Basic Beliefs
Nonpracticing agnostic
New details emerge about ‘Soho Karen’ Miya Ponsetto’s penchant for going berserk in hotels

Hotels are apparently a favored stomping ground for the so-called “Soho Karen” who falsely accused a black teen of stealing her iPhone in a violent, caught-on-video confrontation in Manhattan.

It turns out that 10 months before she allegedly went berserk in a Soho lobby on the day after Christmas, Miya Ponsetto, 22, was busted in February after she and her mom allegedly caused a disturbance at the Peninsula Hotel in Beverly Hills by refusing to leave, according to TMZ.

The Post detailed that California criminal case against Ponsetto and her mom Nicole, who were slapped with public intoxication charges in the incident.

But TMZ’s account adds new details.

Hotel staff had asked the women to leave, and called the cops when the pair refused — only to have Nicole Ponsetto allegedly assault an officer, pushing and kicking the cop, TMZ reported.

The mom faces an additional charge of battery on a police officer and both women are due in court later this month.

The incident apparently did little to scare Ponsetto straight — just a day after she was charged with public intoxication for the Peninsula Hotel incident, on May 27, she was slapped with a drunken driving charge in Los Angeles County, where she pleaded no contest, TMZ said.

...
...

“She was a popular girl, one of the cheerleaders, a grade older than me” at Simi Valley High School in California, another former student told The Post Saturday.

She wouldn’t even look your way if she thought you weren’t important or if you didn’t have money,” said the ex-student, Vannessa Stoerchle, now of Phoenix.

“But I was really surprised to see this,” she said.

“Weird to see someone in high school who was a popular girl end up this way. Never thought Miya would end up racially profiling some one like that,” she added.

She was one of those girls who seemed to have everything handed to her.

Emphasis added.

Seems to be very superficial when you see this but also in concert with all her Kardashian and Trump following on social media.

I think she was taught to be a narcissist.

I could be wrong, but this is how it seems for now without other information.
 

thebeave

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 22, 2001
Messages
3,435
Location
Silicon Valley, CA
Basic Beliefs
Atheist
^^ This past behavior, along with her Soho incident tells me she's just a "bad seed". Which is why I tend get pretty annoyed when the race card comes out before we really know who she really is.
 

Trausti

Deleted
Joined
Jul 30, 2005
Messages
9,784
^^ This past behavior, along with her Soho incident tells me she's just a "bad seed". Which is why I tend get pretty annoyed when the race card comes out before we really know who she really is.

Without the race card there is no story. If you’re white, you ain’t right.
 

laughing dog

Contributor
Joined
Dec 29, 2004
Messages
21,159
Location
Minnesota
Gender
IT
Basic Beliefs
Dogs rule
^^ This past behavior, along with her Soho incident tells me she's just a "bad seed". Which is why I tend get pretty annoyed when the race card comes out before we really know who she really is.
What makes you think we know who she really is?
 

ruby sparks

Contributor
Joined
Nov 24, 2017
Messages
9,167
Location
Northern Ireland
Basic Beliefs
Atheist
She assaulted him, so she's in big trouble. At this point, I'm not seeing racism, so at this point I'm seeing that card as being overplayed. Perhaps something more will come out, but I haven't heard it yet.
 

Toni

Contributor
Joined
Aug 11, 2011
Messages
15,171
Location
NOT laying back and thinking of England
Basic Beliefs
Peace on Earth, goodwill towards all
^^ This past behavior, along with her Soho incident tells me she's just a "bad seed". Which is why I tend get pretty annoyed when the race card comes out before we really know who she really is.
What makes you think we know who she really is?

Where did I say we really know who she is?

The part where you called her a 'bad seed.'

Who someone is is not merely what their name, address, SS# are.

We think we know who someone is by a single incident, filled in by someone who knew her in high school?

I can tell you for certain that if you polled my high school, among those who knew me back then or 'knew me' you'd get a vastly different take on who I was/what kind of person I was. Mostly you'd get Who??????
 

TomC

Celestial Highness
Joined
Oct 1, 2020
Messages
4,374
Location
Midwestern USA
Gender
Faggot
Basic Beliefs
Agnostic deist
We think we know who someone is by a single incident, filled in by someone who knew her in high school?

It's not a single incident. It's a pattern.

It includes assault, drugs(which includes alcohol), her mother, and hotels.


Perhaps there's also racism to consider. Perhaps not.
Tom
 

TomC

Celestial Highness
Joined
Oct 1, 2020
Messages
4,374
Location
Midwestern USA
Gender
Faggot
Basic Beliefs
Agnostic deist
She assaulted him, so she's in big trouble. At this point, I'm not seeing racism, so at this point I'm seeing that card as being overplayed. Perhaps something more will come out, but I haven't heard it yet.

Honestly, if I were the guy and his son, I hope I'd tell the cops "I won't press charges if she gets psychiatric care, whether she wants it or not."

I'm not sure if I would. I'm a bit hot headed. I'd like to think I would though, because I see that as the right thing to do. With the clarity of hindsight.
Tom
 

laughing dog

Contributor
Joined
Dec 29, 2004
Messages
21,159
Location
Minnesota
Gender
IT
Basic Beliefs
Dogs rule
^^ This past behavior, along with her Soho incident tells me she's just a "bad seed". Which is why I tend get pretty annoyed when the race card comes out before we really know who she really is.
What makes you think we know who she really is?

Where did I say we really know who she is?
If you don't really know her, why should anyone take your opinion that she is a "bad seed" as convincing. And if you don't really know her, why should you get annoyed when other people who do not really know her come to a conclusion to which you disagree?

After all, a "bad seed" may be a racist as well. I have no idea whether she is a racist or not, but I think everyone is jumping to conclusions based on very limited information.
 

krypton iodine sulfur

Banned
Banned
Joined
Mar 25, 2015
Messages
1,045
Location
British Columbia
Basic Beliefs
n/a
She assaulted him, so she's in big trouble. At this point, I'm not seeing racism, so at this point I'm seeing that card as being overplayed. Perhaps something more will come out, but I haven't heard it yet.

Honestly, if I were the guy and his son, I hope I'd tell the cops "I won't press charges if she gets psychiatric care, whether she wants it or not."

I'm not sure if I would. I'm a bit hot headed. I'd like to think I would though, because I see that as the right thing to do. With the clarity of hindsight.
Tom

I don't think you can ordinarily compel a person to get mental health care in that way, but I'd suspect a judge could give her a suspended sentence on condition of completing some form of therapy or counselling.
 
  • Like
Reactions: WAB
Top Bottom