So Obama is in Cuba.

[Ford]

Much is being made of the historic nature of this visit, and with good reason.

Obama is the first sitting President to visit the island since "Silent Cal" Coolidge made his way down to Havana.

Of course the Miami ex-pats are losing their minds over this (and by extension the Florida Republicans, and the GOP at large) but is there anybody outside of descendants of former Batista supporters and/or stalwart Cold Warriors that doesn't think this is long overdue?

 

[Derec]

Unless he brings Joanne Deborah Chesimard back in handcuffs the visit is a failure.

 

[Ford]

Unless he brings Joanne Deborah Chesimard back in handcuffs the visit is a failure.

I stand corrected. Aside from people who feel that the most important issue that has ever faced America - the extradition of Joanne Chesimard AKA Assata Shakur AKA the most wanted fugitive on the planet AKA the one person without whose arrest America would surely fall - is there anybody who thinks this isn't long overdue?

 

[repoman]

she is a cunt, but not so important the scheme of things

 

[Trausti]

 

[Ford]

"And that, kids, is when I finally decided that TFT was a complete waste of time."

 

[repoman]

So is his wrist limp in a faggy way or in a cool, confident ghetto pimp way?

Conservative minds want to know!

 

[Colonel Sanders]

I liken the conservative shock and outrage to a pro wrestling feud. They don't want to get over it.

It's like it's 1985 and the Iron Sheik suddenly becomes Hulk Hogan's ally; just way too much to take in at all once for Hulkamaniacs/conservatives. They're still prayin' and takin' their vitamins only to find out that God doesn't exist and vitamin therapy is bullshit.

It's gonna take some time.

 

[untermensche]

Now it is time for the US to pay Cuba reparations for the decades of torture and abuse.

And time to give Guantanamo back to it's rightful owners.

 

[Will Wiley]

Now it is time for the US to pay Cuba reparations for the decades of torture and abuse.

And time to give Guantanamo back to it's rightful owners.

Will opening up some Macdonalds restaurants do?

 

[ZiprHead]

Now it is time for the US to pay Cuba reparations for the decades of torture and abuse.

And time to give Guantanamo back to it's rightful owners.

Will opening up some Macdonalds restaurants do?

Add in some KFCs to the offer and we might have something to talk about.

 

[Cheerful Charlie]

Unless he brings Joanne Deborah Chesimard back in handcuffs the visit is a failure.

And sends Luis Posada Carriles back to Cuba.

 

[Derec]

Now it is time for the US to pay Cuba reparations for the decades of torture and abuse.

What torture and abuse? You mean Cuba needs to pay reparations because they have been ruled by a gang of ruthless thugs for decades, and therefore they are the ones who tortured and abused.

And time to give Guantanamo back to it's rightful owners.

And US is the rightful leaseholder by treaty. Why should we give that up?

- - - Updated - - -

And sends Luis Posada Carriles back to Cuba.

First 'Shakur'.

 

[Derec]

I stand corrected. Aside from people who feel that the most important issue that has ever faced America - the extradition of Joanne Chesimard AKA Assata Shakur AKA the most wanted fugitive on the planet AKA the one person without whose arrest America would surely fall - is there anybody who thinks this isn't long overdue?

No, she is not the most important thing. But you can think the extradition is long overdue without thinking it is "the most important issue that has ever faced America".
Cuba needs this deal much, much more than US needs it. We were, for once, in a very strong negotiating position. And instead of grabbing the Cubanos by the short and curlies Obama is very accommodating in his negotiations with Cuba. And isn't it normal that when countries normalize their relations they extradite murderers and other criminals?

I mean what would be wrong with finally bringing a known murderer and terrorist to justice? Is it wrong because she is a left-wing terrorist or because she is black?

 

[untermensche]

What torture and abuse?

Your complete lack of knowledge of US activity against Cuba is noted.

And US is the rightful leaseholder by treaty. Why should we give that up?

The US has no treaty with the government of Cuba concerning Guantanamo.

US presence on some other nations property is a crime.

 

[Derec]

Your complete lack of knowledge of US activity against Cuba is noted.

I know the communist thugs that violently took power in Cuba committed many acts of murder, torture and abuse. Including that idol of every left-wing college student, Che Guevara.

The US has no treaty with the government of Cuba concerning Guantanamo.

It is pursuant to the agreement US made with the pre-Castro government of Cuba. I am not aware of any international court ruling in Cuba's communist government's favor on this matter. Are you?

 

[Sarpedon]

Whether a country's change of government invalidates previous treaties is a question open for debate.

What I liked was how Obama tricked Castro into having a news conference where the latter actually was asked and was expected to answer questions from the press, including one about political prisoners.

 

[untermensche]

I know the communist thugs that violently took power in Cuba committed many acts of murder, torture and abuse. Including that idol of every left-wing college student, Che Guevara.

Your arguments seem to have been developed in high school.

Cuba in the Cross-Hairs: A Near Half-Century of Terror

https://chomsky.info/hegemony02/

The US has no treaty with the government of Cuba concerning Guantanamo.

It is pursuant to the agreement US made with the pre-Castro government of Cuba. I am not aware of any international court ruling in Cuba's communist government's favor on this matter. Are you?

Nice song and dance.

The current government of Cuba has no treaty with the US concerning Guantanamo.

US occupation of the land is doubly a crime.

It's holding of people without legitimate trial is a crime and it's occupation of the land is a crime.

 

[fromderinside]

The current government of Cuba has no treaty with the US concerning Guantanamo.

US occupation of the land is doubly a crime.

It's holding of people without legitimate trial is a crime and it's occupation of the land is a crime.

Read  Guantanamo Bay Naval Base

From what I read the answers to your claims are

1. Wrong

2. Wrong

3. Doubtful Rules of war applied to non state actors seems pretty well established.

See Derec. We can agree.

 

[untermensche]

Whether a country's change of government invalidates previous treaties is a question open for debate.

Perhaps.

But we have a specific case, not some idealized situation.

The question concerning the Guantanamo treaty is the state of Cuba in 1903 and in 1934.

Was it a free nation or was it a nation under external influence?

Cuba basically became a US protectorate in 1902.

In 1906 the US invaded Cuba and occupied it for 3 years.

In 1934 Cuba had just undergone a coup and it was not a democracy.

And of course in 1952 Cuba again had a military coup and democracy did not exist.

This was the government Castro overturned.

It is hard to find even a sliver of legitimacy to the US so-called treaty with Cuba.

- - - Updated - - -

The current government of Cuba has no treaty with the US concerning Guantanamo.

US occupation of the land is doubly a crime.

It's holding of people without legitimate trial is a crime and it's occupation of the land is a crime.

Read  Guantanamo Bay Naval Base

From what I read the answers to your claims are

1. Wrong

2. Wrong

3. Doubtful Rules of war applied to non state actors seems pretty well established.

See Derec. We can agree.

This is not an argument of any kind.

It is basically saying if a powerful nation forces a treaty on a weak nation that cannot defend itself we must honor that crime.