The Man Who Taught Us to Test Religious Claims for Truth

[Unknown Soldier]

Many religious apologists will mock any skeptic who asks them to actually show skeptics a miracle. I've been told derisively that God isn't a cosmic vending machine who dispenses goodies upon demand. To do so would be indignant for God. Nay--apologists won't perform "magic tricks," as Christian apologist Trent Horn has said. Their words and arguments are sufficient to let us know God exists, and his miracles have happened as the apostles have attested.

There once was a man who saw issues of proving God differently, or so we are told. This man taught that we should test claims, religious claims in particular, to see if they are true. If the claims pass the test, then we can accept them as true. Otherwise, we can dispense with them as false. And no, this man I'm referring to is not Carl Sagan or Richard Dawkins, although I'm sure they would agree that we should test claims. I'm referring to the Biblical prophet, Elijah. In 1 Kings 18: 20-40 we read the story of Elijah's showdown with the priests of Baal. Rather than debating the Baal priests, Elijah proposed that they test both Yahweh and Baal. The God who can send fire from the sky to burn a bull-sacrifice to him will be deemed the "true" God. Of course, Baal fails to get the job done, and Yahweh comes through in very dramatic fashion proving via a miracle that he is the true God.

Although this tale is obviously unhistorical, I agree with Elijah's logic. We should test religious claims to sift the wheat from the chaff. The wheat of truth that passes the test we should accept, and the chaff that fails should be trashed. So the next time some defender of the faith mocks you for expecting a demonstration from him that proves God and his miraculous powers, explain to him that he does not know his own Bible and in particular he is ignorant of Elijah's "test for the true God."

 

[Unknown Soldier]

Many religious apologists will mock any skeptic who asks them to actually show skeptics a miracle. I've been told derisively that God isn't a cosmic vending machine who dispenses goodies upon demand. To do so would be indignant for God. Nay--apologists won't perform "magic tricks," as Christian apologist Trent Horn has said. Their words and arguments are sufficient to let us know God exists, and his miracles have happened as the apostles have attested.

There once was a man who saw issues of proving God differently, or so we are told. This man taught that we should test claims, religious claims in particular, to see if they are true. If the claims pass the test, then we can accept them as true. Otherwise, we can dispense with them as false. And no, this man I'm referring to is not Carl Sagan or Richard Dawkins, although I'm sure they would agree that we should test claims. I'm referring to the Biblical prophet, Elijah. In 1 Kings 18: 20-40 we read the story of Elijah's showdown with the priests of Baal. Rather than debating the Baal priests, Elijah proposed that they test both Yahweh and Baal. The God who can send fire from the sky to burn a bull-sacrifice to him will be deemed the "true" God. Of course, Baal fails to get the job done, and Yahweh comes through in very dramatic fashion proving via a miracle that he is the true God.

Although this tale is obviously unhistorical, I agree with Elijah's logic. We should test religious claims to sift the wheat from the chaff. The wheat of truth that passes the test we should accept, and the chaff that fails should be trashed. So the next time some defender of the faith mocks you for expecting a demonstration from him that proves God and his miraculous powers, explain to him that he does not know his own Bible and in particular he is ignorant of Elijah's "test for the true God."

Well, it looks like nobody can disagree with Elijah's test for truth. We all know that any religion would fail Elijah's test including Elijah's religion.

 

[Hermit]

I've been told derisively that God isn't a cosmic vending machine who dispenses goodies upon demand. To do so would be indignant for God. Nay--apologists won't perform "magic tricks," as Christian apologist Trent Horn has said.

Maybe Trent Horn should read the Bible.

This is the confidence we have in approaching God: that if we ask anything according to his will, he hears us. And if we know that he hears us—whatever we ask—we know that we have what we asked of him. - 1 John 5:14-15

We know that God does not listen to sinners. He listens to the godly person who does his will. - 1. John 9:31

Then you will call on me and come and pray to me, and I will listen to you. You will seek me and find me when you seek me with all your heart. - Jeremiah 29:12-13

I cried out to him with my mouth; his praise was on my tongue. If I had cherished sin in my heart, the Lord would not have listened; but God has surely listened and has heard my prayer. Praise be to God, who has not rejected my prayer or withheld his love from me! - Psalm 66:17-20

Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you. For everyone who asks receives; the one who seeks finds; and to the one who knocks, the door will be opened. - Matthew 7:7-8

If you then, being evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father who is in heaven give what is good to those who ask Him! - Matthew 7:11

And all things you ask in prayer, believing, you will receive. - Matthew 21:22

So I say to you, ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you.
For everyone who asks receives, and he who seeks finds, and to him who knocks it will be opened. - Luke 11:9-10

Whatever you ask in My name, that will I do, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. If you ask Me anything in My name, I will do it. - John 14:13-14

...whatever you ask of the Father in My name He may give to you. - John 15:16

Until now you have asked for nothing in My name; ask and you will receive, so that your joy may be made full. - John 16:24

But if any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask of God, who gives to all generously and without reproach, and it will be given to him. - James 1:5

You will pray to Him, and He will hear you - Job 22:27


et cetetera

We should test religious claims to sift the wheat from the chaff. The wheat of truth that passes the test we should accept, and the chaff that fails should be trashed.

Talk about shifting the burden of proof. Fuck that.

 

[Unknown Soldier]

I've been told derisively that God isn't a cosmic vending machine who dispenses goodies upon demand. To do so would be indignant for God. Nay--apologists won't perform "magic tricks," as Christian apologist Trent Horn has said.

Maybe Trent Horn should read the Bible.

Trent Horn has read the Bible, of course. In fact, he's read it so well that's he's able to interpret it in any way that will disallow it to be falsified. So if he finds some passage that says God does not listen to sinners, then presto! Apparently failed prayers can be explained as resulting from the supplicant's sin.

Talk about shifting the burden of proof. Fuck that.

I'll be happy to take up the burden of proof if I can prove my position to be right. In this case I can test prayer to see that it does indeed fail.