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The Marjorie Taylor Greene case

DrZoidberg

DrZoidberg

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https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-55940542

This is interesting. She's elected on a QAnon platform, is found out to be a scumbag. Of course. I think all of those guys are dicks. But after it was found out that she actually believed all those things she said she believed when elected, then she was booted out.

I too think she's a horrible person, and I'm not saying booting her out wasn't lawful. But is it ever ethically right to boot a politician out of power after she was elected into power. There's no new information that arose. I mean, there was. But none of the stuff that emerged should have shocked anybody. She was a QAnon supporter. Right there you know everything you need to know. It's not like she's betrayed her voters trust in any way.

What do you guys think? Just to clarify. I'm not asking if you think she's a horrible person. I'm asking if you were truly shocked by the revelations uncovered about her after the election? Do you think anybody was more than mildly surprised? If she is what was expected, I don't understand the outrage.
 
DrZoidberg said:
But is it ever ethically right to boot a politician out of power after she was elected into power.
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She is still in the position she was elected into.

To remove her from Congress would have taken a 2/3 vote. That’s a Constitutionally allowed process.
 
DrZoidberg said:
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-55940542

This is interesting. She's elected on a QAnon platform, is found out to be a scumbag. Of course. I think all of those guys are dicks. But after it was found out that she actually believed all those things she said she believed when elected, then she was booted out.

I too think she's a horrible person, and I'm not saying booting her out wasn't lawful. But is it ever ethically right to boot a politician out of power after she was elected into power. There's no new information that arose. I mean, there was. But none of the stuff that emerged should have shocked anybody. She was a QAnon supporter. Right there you know everything you need to know. It's not like she's betrayed her voters trust in any way.

What do you guys think? Just to clarify. I'm not asking if you think she's a horrible person. I'm asking if you were truly shocked by the revelations uncovered about her after the election? Do you think anybody was more than mildly surprised? If she is what was expected, I don't understand the outrage.
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She wasn't booted out of her elected position. She is still a member of Congress, pulling down the 6-figure salary. However, her coworkers, who control her workplace, decided by a democratic vote that they did not want to work with her on committees--not after this pistol packin' non-mama had within the past 2 or 3 years threatened death to some of them and their political associates and had this year refused to wear masks sometimes in their common workplace; not after an anti-democratic gang infused with some of her "former" confreres had just recently forced entry into said workplace and threatened the safety, freedom, and lives of members of Congress and the Vice President, in an attempt to prevent said Congress from performing their constitutionally mandated duty with regard to an election.
If she weren't an elected official, she could well have been fired when her posts came to light.
 
The reason she should be expelled from Congress, even though she was elected to it by her constituents in her district, is that she has endorsed violence against her political opponents in Congress. If it was only whacky views, I would favor allowing her to remain in her seat. Promoting violence is a threshold that should never be permitted, however. Other voters in other districts across the whole country elect their own representatives to Congress with the presumption that they will not have their own representative's life being threatened at the whim of their own colleagues. It does not matter if Greene's voters knew beforehand or not that she endorsed the assassination of other political figures. Once she does that, she deserves to be gone, even if it would override the will of the voters of her own district.
 
That, and rubbing the noses of Sandy Hook survivors in her obscene delusions is ....totally obscene. What did Repubs think would happen if they tried to put her on the EDUCATION committee???
 
Of course her beliefs are total whackadoodle. On the other hand, how many in Congress believe in some sort of deity that can read their thoughts during prayer and (maybe) act on them. Pretty much all of them, right? As insane as MTG's beliefs are, they don't necessarily defy the laws of science as we know them, unlike the religious beliefs of others in Congress. It would be interesting to see if Nancy Pelosi and other Catholics in Congress really believes that snacking on a sacred cracker and some wine at Communion means she is actually tasting the flesh and blood of Jesus. Its a little hard to objectively say whose beliefs score higher on the Crazy-O-Meter.
 
thebeave said:
Of course her beliefs are total whackadoodle. On the other hand, how many in Congress believe in some sort of deity that can read their thoughts during prayer and (maybe) act on them. Pretty much all of them, right? As insane as MTG's beliefs are, they don't necessarily defy the laws of science as we know them, unlike the religious beliefs of others in Congress.
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Denying that the Sandy Hook massacre occurred denies the overwhelming evidence. Denying that 9-11 happened is denying overwhelming evidence.
thebeave said:
It would be interesting to see if Nancy Pelosi and other Catholics in Congress really believes that snacking on a sacred cracker and some wine at Communion means she is actually tasting the flesh and blood of Jesus. Its a little hard to objectively say whose beliefs score higher on the Crazy-O-Meter.
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I don't know any Catholics who think they are tasting the flesh and blood of Jesus. To a person, they know it is symbolic. So I think any sane rational person could easily Ms. Greene's beliefs score higher on the Crazy-O-Meter.

The GOP leadership showed incredibly poor judgment when it put that asshat on a committee that dealt with issues directly affecting children. I think the Democratic leadership should have taken McCarthey's deal (the GOP takes her off Education and put her on the Small Business Committee) on the condition that the GOP make it publicly clear that her abhorrent views are unacceptable to the party.
 
Our government was attacked. Several factions were involved. One of the factors in these factions growing has been a steadily increasing violent propaganda. The root cause of which is a lust for power. Showing the propagandists that they cannot have power if they do not put limits on their usage of violent talk is an appropriate way to curtail the violent outcomes. Creating a schism in the Republican Party to disavow and reduce the cancer back to previous levels is also appropriate. The problem isn't that this happened to poor Qaren victim but that instead that the same thing isn't happening all around the country...including at the state level with people using the same kind of violent rhetoric to gain positions in state assemblies. Having that happen would be counter-productive and so we are left with Marjorie Taylor Greene being the symbol to others in hopes the violent rhetoric will be significantly reduced.
 
thebeave said:
Of course her beliefs are total whackadoodle. On the other hand, how many in Congress believe in some sort of deity that can read their thoughts during prayer and (maybe) act on them. Pretty much all of them, right? As insane as MTG's beliefs are, they don't necessarily defy the laws of science as we know them, unlike the religious beliefs of others in Congress. It would be interesting to see if Nancy Pelosi and other Catholics in Congress really believes that snacking on a sacred cracker and some wine at Communion means she is actually tasting the flesh and blood of Jesus. Its a little hard to objectively say whose beliefs score higher on the Crazy-O-Meter.
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You are presenting a false dichotomy. Something most people haven't realized yet and no one wants to promote (except here on an atheist board) is that the QAnon is actually a strain of the fundamentalist Christian pro-life movement. I've been hearing for DECADES from Christian fundamentalists that celebrities and Democrats are Satanists and when stem cells became a thing in science there started to be a strain about how these powerful people behind the scenes were using stem cells (from abortions) to increase their life expectancy. If you still don't get it, think John Birch Society. QAnon is nearly the same as far as conspiracy theories and relation to far right Christian nationalism. Satanist pedophilia is only the latest variety of the past...and the desired outcome is also the same...i.e. at any cost to stop the abortionists...before it was about killing doctors and bombing abortion clinics, now it is about Congress and killing Pelosi. But these people and their religious leaders have been taken over by a political movement to support a particular politician. Sure QAnon is more extreme because there are more QAnon people AND QAnon is organized to work directly with paramilitary organizations--i.e. they've been attending protests and counter-protests with Oathkeepers, 3 Percenters, and Proud Boys and engaging in violent activities at those locations, but this is because Trump has unified these groups. Now it is time to dismantle the unification and reduce the power their support thinks it can get. This is a practical matter for survival and we will at no time soon be completely rid of religion.
 
thebeave said:
Of course her beliefs are total whackadoodle. On the other hand, how many in Congress believe in some sort of deity that can read their thoughts during prayer and (maybe) act on them. Pretty much all of them, right? As insane as MTG's beliefs are, they don't necessarily defy the laws of science as we know them, unlike the religious beliefs of others in Congress. It would be interesting to see if Nancy Pelosi and other Catholics in Congress really believes that snacking on a sacred cracker and some wine at Communion means she is actually tasting the flesh and blood of Jesus. Its a little hard to objectively say whose beliefs score higher on the Crazy-O-Meter.
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It’s not just the crazy ideas. If that were all I don’t think she’d be in this position I think it is more of her agreeing that Pelosi should be shot and that Obama and Clinton should be lynched.
 
Jimmy Higgins said:
Trausti said:
DrZoidberg said:
If she is what was expected, I don't understand the outrage.
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With Trump gone, need a new Emmanuel Goldstein for the two minutes hate.
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Yeah, all that gnashing of teeth about Ocasio-Cortez and sustainable energy and $15 minimum wage was totally rational. Meanwhile, complaints about a 9/11 truther is political!
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Exactly. How dare those jews do 9/11 or whatever it is she claims! Now let's get back to trashing AoC as an antisemite or whatever.
 
thebeave said:
Of course her beliefs are total whackadoodle. On the other hand, how many in Congress believe in some sort of deity that can read their thoughts during prayer and (maybe) act on them. Pretty much all of them, right? As insane as MTG's beliefs are, they don't necessarily defy the laws of science as we know them, unlike the religious beliefs of others in Congress. It would be interesting to see if Nancy Pelosi and other Catholics in Congress really believes that snacking on a sacred cracker and some wine at Communion means she is actually tasting the flesh and blood of Jesus. Its a little hard to objectively say whose beliefs score higher on the Crazy-O-Meter.
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Dogmatic atheism is also a belief system! As is Belief in the Rights of Man.

I realize many on this board seem to be fervent and devout worshipers of the Cult of Atheism — there's even a thread asking whether Christians should be allowed to post here — but to compare mainstream Christianity with the hateful lies of QAnon is ... confused.

And on the topic of the communion sacrament, whatever the intellectual limitations of Christians might be, many or most understand the concept of metaphor better than thebeave seems to.
 
thebeave said:
Of course her beliefs are total whackadoodle. On the other hand, how many in Congress believe in some sort of deity that can read their thoughts during prayer and (maybe) act on them. Pretty much all of them, right? As insane as MTG's beliefs are, they don't necessarily defy the laws of science as we know them, unlike the religious beliefs of others in Congress. It would be interesting to see if Nancy Pelosi and other Catholics in Congress really believes that snacking on a sacred cracker and some wine at Communion means she is actually tasting the flesh and blood of Jesus. Its a little hard to objectively say whose beliefs score higher on the Crazy-O-Meter.
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Jewish Space Laser! Billions of people believe in god. A much smaller number think the Jews are using a Space Laser and causing fires in California.

There is silly dogma and then there is whacked out conspiracy theories.
 
thebeave said:
Its a little hard to objectively say whose beliefs score higher on the Crazy-O-Meter.
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It's not the Crazy-O-Meter being used here.
When a Christain congressperson starts saying, 'my god tells me i get to shoot congressperson X in the head for being (Muslim, Jewish, Mormon.... gay, single mom, immigrant... black, brown, mixed...) that'll be comparable.
Or if an atheist says 2nd Amendment allows that i shoot X inna head...
Or if a Muslim announces a need to behead Y...
Or if a Mormon moves to remove all coffee from the Congressional office complex...
You know, actual intent to or invitation for harm. That meter.
 
Here's why our little Margorie got denied the right to serve alongside other committees members. She posted this on Facebook just last year. Exhibit A from Schumer's testimony:
greene_psycho2.jpg
 
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