Two police shot in Ferguson

[Derec]

Emails surface from the courts and cops in Ferguson that were overtly racist. That's just a few bad apples and not a sign of institutional racism.

One of the emails that got a lot of coverage (the one about black people holding jobs) was from 2008. Hardly recent. But still the entire police department, and really the entire city, was crucified by DOJ for it. Yet Ferguson protesters should get a free pass?

But hooligans that caused trouble in the protests are "Ferguson protesters" en masse.

Yeah. Nothing to see here. Many businesses looted and burnt down, police officers shot, but the Ferguson "protesters" are not to blame.

 

[ronburgundy]

Your right, stats show that the shooters were almost certainly black, and very likely had criminal records.

you mean very likely had trumped up criminal records since that was the finding of the DOJ report

No, I mean that they were actual criminals prior to the shooting, which is made very likely by the combined facts they committed murder of these cops (which indicates their general violence and criminality) along with the large % of black males nationwide who have criminal records because they commit crimes and are rightly convicted of them.

I thought blacks couldn't be racist?

You thought wrong.

 

[ronburgundy]

Your right, stats show that the shooters were almost certainly black, and very likely had criminal records.

you mean very likely had trumped up criminal records since that was the finding of the DOJ report

Oh yeah, as explained above, my comment was based upon the more reliable national level crime stats, including the converging evidence of conviction records and victimization reports. However, it would also be valid just based upon Ferguson data, since your claim that DOJ found a majority of convictions in Ferguson were invalid and "trumped up" is utter nonsense. For the vast majority of convictions, they found no evidence that the charges were "trumped up".

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Except it's not made of straw. It was you, in another thread said that we committed genocide against Indians?

]No. The damage was done by a limited number of hooligans. Not the protestors en masse.

Of course it's a "limited number", the question is what is the limit.
The protesters didn't do much to prevent such behavior in their midst. In fact, Michael Brown's stepfather incited violence.

But blacks were involved in the Watts riots, so maybe we can use that historical precedence and arrest all of the protestors?

Well you have no problem blaming modern-day whites for what happened in the 16th or 17th century so maybe you should. I instead prefer not to blame entire races.

Your strawman arguments are really starting to bore the hell out of me.

 

[Rhea]

Oh, wait. Were the cops white?

Then they deserve what they got because some other white people did bad things at some point in history.
</progressoauthoritarian>

EXCELLENT use of sarcasm.

Exactly.

Yes, the argument that unrelated people who are black should be subject to frisk, arrest, tasing, beating and shooting because OTHER black people have committed a crime is exactly what the protest is about! Great job seeing the underlying prejudice as equivalent! Finally!


Yes. These cops should never have been targeted for violence. It was wrong and counterproductive
1. Because violence is not the answer and
2. Because they personally had nothing to do with the incident (that we know of, without a trial)

They should have been arrested peacefully and brought to trial.

 

[Rhea]

When I heard the news this morning on the radio, they quoted a spox for the PD who said, "they are worried about additional violence."

And I kinda did a double take and thought, well, ya, so are the black residents of Ferguson, y'know? That's what the protests are about? So you get it now, right? That violence is bad? And the PD gets it now? Shooting people without trial is bad?

 

[laughing dog]

Well, if the police officers are on the Ferguson police force, the odds are overwhelming they are not black.

True, but even without that fact, the odds were already overwhelming that they were white, because facts point to black shooters fueled by racist anger.

Which facts specific to this situation point to that?

 

[ksen]

you mean very likely had trumped up criminal records since that was the finding of the DOJ report

No, I mean that they were actual criminals prior to the shooting, which is made very likely by the combined facts they committed murder of these cops

The cops are dead?

(which indicates their general violence and criminality) along with the large % of black males nationwide who have criminal records because they commit crimes and are rightly convicted of them.

hahaha, ok buddy

 

[Mumbles]

They were wearing police uniforms? Well, when you dress up like a thug, people will treat you like a thug!

I heard they were carrying guns, so of course someone shot at them! That person was just worried about the public's safety!

Obviously, this is a "suicide by protestor" attempt!

Clearly, they should have dropped their weapons instantly.

That all sounds ridiculous, right?

Here's the thing, as I've said before - you can only push people for so long. At some point, *someone* is simply going to rage out. It's not a good thing, it's just human nature. The protests themselves were a strong sign that policing in Ferguson had gone horribly wrong - people for the most part actually want to like the police, but there are times when the police themselves make this impossible, and we have extensive documentation that the Ferguson PD made it impossible to like them, due to the town government's insistence on collecting fines.

 

[RavenSky]

Seeing that the shooting didn't involve all of the police getting mowed down, I think your statement about the Ferguson protestors is just an attempt to smear an entire group of people over the hateful and violent actions of one or maybe two people.

Except that Ferguson protesters have been violent since they looted and torched that QT on the first night of the riots.

Bullshit.

That's just you blaming the entire group for the actions of a very few... your typical M.O.

 

[RavenSky]

One of the emails that got a lot of coverage (the one about black people holding jobs) was from 2008. Hardly recent. But still the entire police department, and really the entire city, was crucified by DOJ for it. Yet Ferguson protesters should get a free pass?

But hooligans that caused trouble in the protests are "Ferguson protesters" en masse.

Yeah. Nothing to see here. Many businesses looted and burnt down, police officers shot, but the Ferguson "protesters" are not to blame.

You have a very short, or utterly biased, memory. It was Feguson protesters who protected stores from looters.

 

[ksen]

They were wearing police uniforms? Well, when you dress up like a thug, people will treat you like a thug!

I heard they were carrying guns, so of course someone shot at them! That person was just worried about the public's safety!

Obviously, this is a "suicide by protestor" attempt!

Clearly, they should have dropped their weapons instantly.

That all sounds ridiculous, right?

Here's the thing, as I've said before - you can only push people for so long. At some point, *someone* is simply going to rage out. It's not a good thing, it's just human nature. The protests themselves were a strong sign that policing in Ferguson had gone horribly wrong - people for the most part actually want to like the police, but there are times when the police themselves make this impossible, and we have extensive documentation that the Ferguson PD made it impossible to like them, due to the town government's insistence on collecting fines.

came here to post basically this

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

One of the emails that got a lot of coverage (the one about black people holding jobs) was from 2008. Hardly recent. But still the entire police department, and really the entire city, was crucified by DOJ for it. Yet Ferguson protesters should get a free pass?


Yeah. Nothing to see here. Many businesses looted and burnt down, police officers shot, but the Ferguson "protesters" are not to blame.

You have a very short, or utterly biased, memory. It was Feguson protesters who protected stores from looters.

It is becoming unbearable.

 

[Horatio Parker]

Wait and see.

The cops are already out of the hospital. They're saying it was a handgun, fired from 125-225 yards away. Several shots were fired. They have shell casings.

No other info that I've seen.

 

[ksen]

You have a very short, or utterly biased, memory. It was Feguson protesters who protected stores from looters.

It is becoming unbearable.

yet udderly predictable

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Wait and see.

The cops are already out of the hospital. They're saying it was a handgun, fired from 125-225 yards away. Several shots were fired. They have shell casings.

No other info that I've seen.

Hopefully they find the man who made the shots, try him, and convict him. Of course, the court probably rather just fine him.

- - - Updated - - -

It is becoming unbearable.

yet udderly predictable

The extent is getting bothersome though. Not quite DrewJ bad, but getting there.

 

[ksen]

I'm sure if they get these guys the prosecutur will take a couple of months and present all evidence for both sides and allow the defendants to take the stand at any future grand jury proceedings.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

I'm sure if they get these guys the prosecutur will take a couple of months and present all evidence for both sides and allow the defendants to take the stand at any future grand jury proceedings.

That'd only be fair.

 

[Jason Harvestdancer]

They were wearing police uniforms? Well, when you dress up like a thug, people will treat you like a thug!

I heard they were carrying guns, so of course someone shot at them! That person was just worried about the public's safety!

Obviously, this is a "suicide by protestor" attempt!

Clearly, they should have dropped their weapons instantly.

That all sounds ridiculous, right?

Here's the thing, as I've said before - you can only push people for so long. At some point, *someone* is simply going to rage out. It's not a good thing, it's just human nature. The protests themselves were a strong sign that policing in Ferguson had gone horribly wrong - people for the most part actually want to like the police, but there are times when the police themselves make this impossible, and we have extensive documentation that the Ferguson PD made it impossible to like them, due to the town government's insistence on collecting fines.

Yep.

The thing for most of the race warriors on this board to realize is that white cops and black cops aren't white or black, they are blue. A white cop is blue, and a black cop is blue. Everyone else is a civilian, the enemy, and some of those enemies are white and some of those enemies are black. And the blue people do have a noted tendency to mistreat the black people in Ferguson, but the people who shot at the cops weren't shooting black people or white people, they were shooting blue people.

 

[ksen]

Jason: yet another pretty good egg I don't agree on a lot with.