White Liberals Present Themselves as Less Competent in Interactions with African-Americans

[thebeave]

Came across this study from Yale today:

https://insights.som.yale.edu/insights/white-liberals-present-themselves-as-less-competent-in-interactions-with-african-americans

Racial bias can put people of color at a disadvantage when interviewing for a job, buying a house, or interacting with the police. New research suggests that bias may also shape daily interactions between racial minorities and white people, even those whites who tend to be less biased.

According to new research by Cydney Dupree, assistant professor of organizational behavior at Yale SOM, white liberals tend to downplay their own verbal competence in exchanges with racial minorities, compared to how other white Americans act in such exchanges. The study is scheduled for publication in the Journal of Personality and Social Psychology.

The researchers found that liberal individuals were less likely to use words that would make them appear highly competent when the person they were addressing was presumed to be black rather than white. No significant differences were seen in the word selection of conservatives based on the presumed race of their partner. “It was kind of an unpleasant surprise to see this subtle but persistent effect,” Dupree says. “Even if it’s ultimately well-intentioned, it could be seen as patronizing.”

The discussion kind of reminds me of this video by Ami Horowitz from the 2016 election:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rrBxZGWCdgs

Thoughts?

 

[Loren Pechtel]

No surprise. An awful lot of the liberal ideas about racial issues actually amount to saying we should ignore the inferiority of minorities rather than saying they are equal.

 

[prideandfall]

Thoughts?

it's called code-switching and it's basically something humans do in a huge variety of contexts and situations and is definitely not limited to liberal white people talking to or about racial minorities.
unfortunately this means that no direct conclusions can be drawn from the simple fact that it happens - but the implication suggested by the article is clear: that code-switching is done as a form of denigration against black people and white liberals are racist, or something.

reading the linked article makes the title of the article seem like some serious clickbait and quite frankly the premise of the study strikes me as being rather spectacularly full of shit.

words related to competence (that is, words about ability or status, such as “assertive” or “competitive”) and words related to warmth (that is, words about friendliness, such as “supportive” and “compassionate”).

i mean quite frankly it strikes me that this could be easily explained by not wanting to be seen as holding a higher tier in the social pecking order over someone's head.
the criteria they used was presidential speeches and how many "competence" words they used, and what kind of language was used in writing emails - noting that white liberals were less aggressive in their language if the email was being sent to "Lakisha"
but i'm willing to bet the same people would tone down their language for "billy-joe-bob guthry" or any other suggestion at the economically or socially disadvantaged.

 

[laughing dog]

No surprise. An awful lot of the liberal ideas about racial issues actually amount to saying we should ignore the inferiority of minorities rather than saying they are equal.

Wow. Simply wow.

 

[untermensche]

No surprise. An awful lot of the liberal ideas about racial issues actually amount to saying we should ignore the inferiority of minorities rather than saying they are equal.

Talk of racial minority inferiority sounds like Nazi ideas.

What humans that think say is inferior schools and the insane drug war and lack of opportunity have destroyed many minority communities.

And that all humans are equally products of their environments.

And all humans have an equal distribution of talent and abilities.

Any differences are due to environment.

 

[Jolly_Penguin]

No surprise. An awful lot of the liberal ideas about racial issues actually amount to saying we should ignore the inferiority of minorities rather than saying they are equal.

Wow. Simply wow.

Indeed. I am guessing you purposefully misinterpreted what Loren wrote, but what he wrote is indeed sad. Ties in with the soft bigotry of low expectations, as well as the eggshelll walking effect.

A white liberal friend of mine once pointed out to me that she didn't do it consciously, but she was always a little more guarded in what she'd say around me when we'd initially met, lest I misinterpret it as racial, which she wouldn't do if she was around white people or myself and other not-white people once she knew me us better and was confident we wouldn't seek out racial offence.

 

[Arctish]

From the OP article:

Now, Dupree is working to understand how these behaviors play out in real-world organizations: for example, whether medical professionals engage in this behavior when interacting with minority patients and how corporate executives present themselves to minority peers. She is also testing the efficacy of this possibly strategic behavior: for example, do black receivers of white liberals’ competence downshift see this behavior as demeaning or endearing?

It's an interesting question. Is the downshift in assertive language a sign of bias or is it a practical means to establish social harmony?

The scenarios studied were liberal white politicians giving speeches to largely minority crowds, and people sending work-related or introductory e-mails to strangers. In those situations, being perceived as friendly, approachable, and easy to work with would be a bonus. If a pattern of vocabulary choices that emphasize one's ability to work cooperatively with others results in more positive outcomes than one that emphasizes assertiveness or competitiveness, then it's very success would tend to reinforce the choices.

A white liberal friend of mine once pointed out to me that she didn't do it consciously, but she was always a little more guarded in what she'd say around me when we'd initially met, lest I misinterpret it as racial, which she wouldn't do if she was around white people or myself and other not-white people once she knew me us better and was confident we wouldn't seek out racial offence.

I wonder how much gender norms in western societies plays a role in that, too.

 

[repoman]

No surprise. An awful lot of the liberal ideas about racial issues actually amount to saying we should ignore the inferiority of minorities rather than saying they are equal.

Talk of racial minority inferiority sounds like Nazi ideas.

What humans that think say is inferior schools and the insane drug war and lack of opportunity have destroyed many minority communities.

And that all humans are equally products of their environments.

And all humans have an equal distribution of talent and abilities.

Any differences are due to environment.

read the context.

 

[Derec]

Nothing new.

 

[untermensche]

No surprise. An awful lot of the liberal ideas about racial issues actually amount to saying we should ignore the inferiority of minorities rather than saying they are equal.

Talk of racial minority inferiority sounds like Nazi ideas.

What humans that think say is inferior schools and the insane drug war and lack of opportunity have destroyed many minority communities.

And that all humans are equally products of their environments.

And all humans have an equal distribution of talent and abilities.

Any differences are due to environment.

read the context, moron.

The moron is the person that isn't appalled by such racist ignorant shit!

 

[Jarhyn]

No surprise. An awful lot of the liberal ideas about racial issues actually amount to saying we should ignore the inferiority of minorities rather than saying they are equal.

Wow. Simply wow.

Indeed. I am guessing you purposefully misinterpreted what Loren wrote, but what he wrote is indeed sad. Ties in with the soft bigotry of low expectations, as well as the eggshelll walking effect.

A white liberal friend of mine once pointed out to me that she didn't do it consciously, but she was always a little more guarded in what she'd say around me when we'd initially met, lest I misinterpret it as racial, which she wouldn't do if she was around white people or myself and other not-white people once she knew me us better and was confident we wouldn't seek out racial offence.

There's a cultural problem in the US in which it is frequently the case that any criticism of the disruptive or idiotic behavior of people who are darker skinned persons by lighter skinned persons gets instantly interpreted as racism. Never mind that a declaration of racism in relation to that disapproval tacitly attributes bad behavior to race is ITSELF racist.

I've had this happen on a few occasions. So it is entirely understandable that persons interacting with aforementioned cultures will occasionally guard their response to prevent that from being used against them.

 

[ZiprHead]

Nothing new.

Oh my god. She's quoting a gospel song. What a bigot!

 

[laughing dog]

No surprise. An awful lot of the liberal ideas about racial issues actually amount to saying we should ignore the inferiority of minorities rather than saying they are equal.

Wow. Simply wow.

Indeed. I am guessing you purposefully misinterpreted what Loren wrote, but what he wrote is indeed sad. Ties in with the soft bigotry of low expectations, as well as the eggshelll walking effect.

Instead of guessing (and guessing wrong as usual), I suggest you try thinking instead of reacting. For example, ask yourself why a different pattern of speech would be referred to as an "inferiority of a minority".

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

No surprise. An awful lot of the liberal ideas about racial issues actually amount to saying we should ignore the inferiority of minorities rather than saying they are equal.

Terribly underachieving son of DC powerhouse is definitely Presidential material.
Ambitious man from Illinois has no experience and shouldn't be elected President.

 

[dismal]

No surprise. An awful lot of the liberal ideas about racial issues actually amount to saying we should ignore the inferiority of minorities rather than saying they are equal.

Talk of racial minority inferiority sounds like Nazi ideas.

What humans that think say is inferior schools and the insane drug war and lack of opportunity have destroyed many minority communities.

And that all humans are equally products of their environments.

And all humans have an equal distribution of talent and abilities.

Any differences are due to environment.

read the context, moron.

Hey, there's no need to talk to untermensche like he's some sort of racial minority.

 

[Gun Nut]

Indeed. I am guessing you purposefully misinterpreted what Loren wrote, but what he wrote is indeed sad. Ties in with the soft bigotry of low expectations, as well as the eggshelll walking effect.

A white liberal friend of mine once pointed out to me that she didn't do it consciously, but she was always a little more guarded in what she'd say around me when we'd initially met, lest I misinterpret it as racial, which she wouldn't do if she was around white people or myself and other not-white people once she knew me us better and was confident we wouldn't seek out racial offence.

There's a cultural problem in the US in which it is frequently the case that any criticism of the disruptive or idiotic behavior of people who are darker skinned persons by lighter skinned persons gets instantly interpreted as racism. Never mind that a declaration of racism in relation to that disapproval tacitly attributes bad behavior to race is ITSELF racist.

I've had this happen on a few occasions. So it is entirely understandable that persons interacting with aforementioned cultures will occasionally guard their response to prevent that from being used against them.

I was involved in an arrest of a middle-aged male that assaulted a bartender. The suspect fled the scene and my partner chased while I aided the injured victim, dealt with communications, and kept the scene secure. My partner subdued the suspect about 2 blocks away and worked with local law enforcement.
While all this was happening, a black lady approached me and started balling me out and calling me a racist... she was almost violent, and out of her mind pissed off... apparently, I was a "fucking racist" for being involved in stopping someone from attacking someone else.
But... here's the punch line... The fucking perp was WHITE.
I asked the lady what she saw and what happened to upset her, and she began to explain how we were only going after that guy because he was black. I said to her that the man was clearly white. She looked up the block, looked back at me.. said, "fucking racist", and walked away.

 

[PyramidHead]

Indeed. I am guessing you purposefully misinterpreted what Loren wrote, but what he wrote is indeed sad. Ties in with the soft bigotry of low expectations, as well as the eggshelll walking effect.

Instead of guessing (and guessing wrong as usual), I suggest you try thinking instead of reacting. For example, ask yourself why a different pattern of speech would be referred to as an "inferiority of a minority".

Nah, I think Loren just chose his words poorly. He was saying that liberals are the ones who think "minorities are inferior but we should ignore this inferiority", while Moderate Libertarians actually believe they are equal to whites.

 

[Gun Nut]

Indeed. I am guessing you purposefully misinterpreted what Loren wrote, but what he wrote is indeed sad. Ties in with the soft bigotry of low expectations, as well as the eggshelll walking effect.

Instead of guessing (and guessing wrong as usual), I suggest you try thinking instead of reacting. For example, ask yourself why a different pattern of speech would be referred to as an "inferiority of a minority".

Nah, I think Loren just chose his words poorly. He was saying that liberals are the ones who think "minorities are inferior but we should ignore this inferiority", while Moderate Libertarians actually believe they are equal to whites.

I read it as, "when you think you are smarter than the other person, and the other person is a minority, you dumb yourself down to not come off as haughty". I wish they would do that for non-minorities too.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

I often find the need to dumb myself down in order to be able to interact with the barely functional idiots whom I'm forced to interact with throughout my daily life. I really would love it if people of all races and creeds would come together as brothers and sisters and just fucking stop being such absolute morons all the time.

 

[untermensche]

Indeed. I am guessing you purposefully misinterpreted what Loren wrote, but what he wrote is indeed sad. Ties in with the soft bigotry of low expectations, as well as the eggshelll walking effect.

Instead of guessing (and guessing wrong as usual), I suggest you try thinking instead of reacting. For example, ask yourself why a different pattern of speech would be referred to as an "inferiority of a minority".

What would be proper would be to say that the inferiority of individuals is ignored on all sides.

White supremacists ignore all those inferior individuals who are white.