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Woke is white arrogance

RVonse

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This style of mocking and holier-than-thou antipathy towards the idea of being “woke” to the needs, concerns and pain of others is interesting to behold. It is a repeated poke-poke-poke to agitate and keep agitated to make sure that those who care about justice and the well being of others know that they are mocked and disdained by a few dominance-fetishers who think care is a weakness. It’s the equivalent of the schoolyard bully who constantly bumps and pushes those they deem “weaker” and calls them “fag” or “pussy.”

It manifests here on TFT as this constant barrage of posts by a very small number of posters repeating the same shallow insults over and over. “Wokester.” “Virtue Signaling.” It used to include “PC” as an insult. See how I disdain your care for others. See how weak I think you are. See how I can knock your schoolbooks out of your hand onto the hallway floor and you won’t do it back to me? That means I’m powerful. That means I’m alpha. In my head, anyway.


When a discussion in one of these threads directs towards why compassion is valuable, and why being aware and supportive of the lived experiences of others is not something people are ashamed of, the schoolyard-style bullies keep name-calling for a while, then drop it, and go start another thread with their current mocking words; they run to another student and knock over their books and stand around with their chest out thinking everyone admires their “strength” and dominance.


So - yeah yeah yeah. Wokester. Virtue Signalling. PC run amok.


I am **GLAD** to be awake to the realities of others. I was insulated for so long not realizing what my world was like for others.
I am **GLAD** to signal to others what virtues I find important; among them care, concern, justice
I am **GLAD** to know what language hurts, and avoid it in favor of lannguage that doesn’t hurt. Hooray for Politically Correct norms.

And I’ll keep thinking this next week, when I watch the bullies again posture and preen with their displays of mocking and disdain, their acts of dominance-seeking where they try to knock others down so they can feel strong and worthwhile. And I’ll keep thinking, “how sad is that. They have to work so hard to feel worthwhile. They never feel content and loved. Gotta shove people to the ground so they can feel tall. No one taught them how to build to feel big, they only learned how to destroy others. And they don’t even realize that no one looks at that display and thinks they are powerful. Or - maybe they do know that, but they only know one way to feel powerful and they just have to keep using it, even while they know it doesn’t work.”


I know this and other posts will continue to sprout up. Mock the caring, disdain cooperative aspirations. Try to sell dominance as the only virtue. Beat the chest. Howl the monkey howls.

The dogs bark, but the caravan goes on.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with being compassionate to others. And even though you don't agree with DrZoidberg perhaps you might go halfway and at least allow for artists like Tarantino the freedom to produce content they think others might pay to consume. You don't have to go to their movies or agree with their content but just allow them their freedom of expression and first amendment rights as you would expect them to respect yours.

And above all else, don't claim to be something you really aren't. If you are woke and want to conduct your life privately as woke... that's perfect. Just don't be a big fake "woker" and pretend to be woke just for your own personal and selfish gain. Even Jesus himself knew better when he said it was better to only put a penny in the offering plate in secret than to put a $100 dollar bill in the plate and make a big public horse show over it.

Anyway I think that is what DrZoid is saying.
 

Jimmy Higgins

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[YOUTUBE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f-XevURCBpw&t=241s[/YOUTUBE]

Here's an other perspective on woke, which I thought was interesting.

It's Quentin Tarrantino talking about political correctness and cinema.
And then your post just kind of wanders off into the woods. Tarrantino's point seems a bit muddled and oddly ignorant. Hollywood has had plenty of shifts in films and style. The way he talks, he makes it seem like the 20s to 70s didn't go back and forth. Fuck, the censors when The Code was put together? In This Our Lives, the ending had to change and off Bette Davis because the censors felt it would have encouraged bad behavior among people. Conservatives have been hounding cinema for a century now!

Tarrantino is a unique talent, the "Dead Nigger Parking" scene probably doesn't work for anyone else on the planet, but he sells it. But he must be suffering from brain trauma. The 80s was the transition to PG-13 (R-13 as put by the non-woke / non-PC conservatives). The conservatives were whining about movies like Parenthood and Batman having PG-13 ratings and being unsuitable for teenagers to watch (granted, some of the content of Parenthood did go well over my head). Gremlins created a fervor that its PG rating was absurd. The 1980s began selling harder and more graphic material to younger audiences. So, I'm uncertain what the heck Tarrantino is on about. The 90s wasn't from a bridge from the 70s. Full Metal Jacket, Platoon, Die Hard, Terminator, Aliens... what exactly was missing in the 80s?
 

ZiprHead

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ZiprHead

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I was Born in the U.S.A. but live elsewhere now, and am out-of-touch. I'm not sure what "Wokism" is, or why it's so dreadful. It would be nice to see some real-world examples of Wokism from opinion-makers. Just so I know what we're talking about.

The problem is that the word is vague.

The first two meanings in post 439 are both accurate. And it's hard to draw any lines in there.

In a way, it's like the label "Christian". There's no clear meaning. Anybody can call themselves that. But those who don't self identify as Christian are less likely to know the majority of perfectly nice Christian people. Mostly they hear about the assholish ones who are really noisy and self centered. The kind who will scream about gay marriage destroying the family, while they're working on their third divorce.
Tom

Wow. Life does exist outside Television and the internet ya know. Christians and Atheists for example mingle with each other offline and off-air on a daily basis without any of this hyperbole you just mentioned. You need to go outside bruh.
 

Patooka

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While non-woke directors are effectively blocked from any platform.

It's a shame that Tarantino could never become successful.

I see I missed a word. I meant "While non-woke black directors are effectively blocked from any platform."

sorry. Now the sentence makes sense

Sure, you definitely nailed the part of your statement that made zero fucking sense. The rest of it was clear and insightful.
 

TomC

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I was Born in the U.S.A. but live elsewhere now, and am out-of-touch. I'm not sure what "Wokism" is, or why it's so dreadful. It would be nice to see some real-world examples of Wokism from opinion-makers. Just so I know what we're talking about.

The problem is that the word is vague.

The first two meanings in post 439 are both accurate. And it's hard to draw any lines in there.

In a way, it's like the label "Christian". There's no clear meaning. Anybody can call themselves that. But those who don't self identify as Christian are less likely to know the majority of perfectly nice Christian people. Mostly they hear about the assholish ones who are really noisy and self centered. The kind who will scream about gay marriage destroying the family, while they're working on their third divorce.
Tom

Wow. Life does exist outside Television and the internet ya know. Christians and Atheists for example mingle with each other offline and off-air on a daily basis without any of this hyperbole you just mentioned. You need to go outside bruh.

Seriously?
I'm a gay non-theist from a conservative Catholic family, living in southern Indiana(practically Mike Pence's hometown).
I am very much aware of all this. But not everyone is.
Tom
 

DrZoidberg

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This style of mocking and holier-than-thou antipathy towards the idea of being “woke” to the needs, concerns and pain of others is interesting to behold. It is a repeated poke-poke-poke to agitate and keep agitated to make sure that those who care about justice and the well being of others know that they are mocked and disdained by a few dominance-fetishers who think care is a weakness. It’s the equivalent of the schoolyard bully who constantly bumps and pushes those they deem “weaker” and calls them “fag” or “pussy.”

It manifests here on TFT as this constant barrage of posts by a very small number of posters repeating the same shallow insults over and over. “Wokester.” “Virtue Signaling.” It used to include “PC” as an insult. See how I disdain your care for others. See how weak I think you are. See how I can knock your schoolbooks out of your hand onto the hallway floor and you won’t do it back to me? That means I’m powerful. That means I’m alpha. In my head, anyway.


When a discussion in one of these threads directs towards why compassion is valuable, and why being aware and supportive of the lived experiences of others is not something people are ashamed of, the schoolyard-style bullies keep name-calling for a while, then drop it, and go start another thread with their current mocking words; they run to another student and knock over their books and stand around with their chest out thinking everyone admires their “strength” and dominance.


So - yeah yeah yeah. Wokester. Virtue Signalling. PC run amok.


I am **GLAD** to be awake to the realities of others. I was insulated for so long not realizing what my world was like for others.
I am **GLAD** to signal to others what virtues I find important; among them care, concern, justice
I am **GLAD** to know what language hurts, and avoid it in favor of lannguage that doesn’t hurt. Hooray for Politically Correct norms.

And I’ll keep thinking this next week, when I watch the bullies again posture and preen with their displays of mocking and disdain, their acts of dominance-seeking where they try to knock others down so they can feel strong and worthwhile. And I’ll keep thinking, “how sad is that. They have to work so hard to feel worthwhile. They never feel content and loved. Gotta shove people to the ground so they can feel tall. No one taught them how to build to feel big, they only learned how to destroy others. And they don’t even realize that no one looks at that display and thinks they are powerful. Or - maybe they do know that, but they only know one way to feel powerful and they just have to keep using it, even while they know it doesn’t work.”


I know this and other posts will continue to sprout up. Mock the caring, disdain cooperative aspirations. Try to sell dominance as the only virtue. Beat the chest. Howl the monkey howls.

The dogs bark, but the caravan goes on.

I think you miss the point. Being opposed to woke, isn't to bully or hurt people. It's the other way around. It's to stop the bullying and hurting of people. The wokes are the bad guys.

What you are saying only applies if you really are awake to the realities of others. How do you know you are? How do you know you're not part of an act? An act where white people pat themselves on the back for being virtuous and awesome. How do you know that CRT actually proves what it says it proves? Woke language stops free expression which hampers any progress of any kind. Being woke prevents you from being to evaluate whether or not being woke is useful.

It's not about wanting to say hurty things to people.

But you've underlined the problem with the woke position. It's a black and white world where the woke are the good, and the non woke are the bad who wants to hurt people, and their only motivation for not being woke is because they are evil. It's a simplistic world view. It's painfully naive IMHO
 

ZiprHead

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Wow. Life does exist outside Television and the internet ya know. Christians and Atheists for example mingle with each other offline and off-air on a daily basis without any of this hyperbole you just mentioned. You need to go outside bruh.

Seriously?
I'm a gay non-theist from a conservative Catholic family, living in southern Indiana(practically Mike Pence's hometown).
I am very much aware of all this. But not everyone is.
Tom

I can't tell if you're trying to rebuke or make a pass at me.
 

Jarhyn

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This style of mocking and holier-than-thou antipathy towards the idea of being “woke” to the needs, concerns and pain of others is interesting to behold. It is a repeated poke-poke-poke to agitate and keep agitated to make sure that those who care about justice and the well being of others know that they are mocked and disdained by a few dominance-fetishers who think care is a weakness. It’s the equivalent of the schoolyard bully who constantly bumps and pushes those they deem “weaker” and calls them “fag” or “pussy.”

It manifests here on TFT as this constant barrage of posts by a very small number of posters repeating the same shallow insults over and over. “Wokester.” “Virtue Signaling.” It used to include “PC” as an insult. See how I disdain your care for others. See how weak I think you are. See how I can knock your schoolbooks out of your hand onto the hallway floor and you won’t do it back to me? That means I’m powerful. That means I’m alpha. In my head, anyway.


When a discussion in one of these threads directs towards why compassion is valuable, and why being aware and supportive of the lived experiences of others is not something people are ashamed of, the schoolyard-style bullies keep name-calling for a while, then drop it, and go start another thread with their current mocking words; they run to another student and knock over their books and stand around with their chest out thinking everyone admires their “strength” and dominance.


So - yeah yeah yeah. Wokester. Virtue Signalling. PC run amok.


I am **GLAD** to be awake to the realities of others. I was insulated for so long not realizing what my world was like for others.
I am **GLAD** to signal to others what virtues I find important; among them care, concern, justice
I am **GLAD** to know what language hurts, and avoid it in favor of lannguage that doesn’t hurt. Hooray for Politically Correct norms.

And I’ll keep thinking this next week, when I watch the bullies again posture and preen with their displays of mocking and disdain, their acts of dominance-seeking where they try to knock others down so they can feel strong and worthwhile. And I’ll keep thinking, “how sad is that. They have to work so hard to feel worthwhile. They never feel content and loved. Gotta shove people to the ground so they can feel tall. No one taught them how to build to feel big, they only learned how to destroy others. And they don’t even realize that no one looks at that display and thinks they are powerful. Or - maybe they do know that, but they only know one way to feel powerful and they just have to keep using it, even while they know it doesn’t work.”


I know this and other posts will continue to sprout up. Mock the caring, disdain cooperative aspirations. Try to sell dominance as the only virtue. Beat the chest. Howl the monkey howls.

The dogs bark, but the caravan goes on.

I think you miss the point. Being opposed to woke, isn't to bully or hurt people. It's the other way around. It's to stop the bullying and hurting of people. The wokes are the bad guys.

What you are saying only applies if you really are awake to the realities of others. How do you know you are? How do you know you're not part of an act? An act where white people pat themselves on the back for being virtuous and awesome. How do you know that CRT actually proves what it says it proves? Woke language stops free expression which hampers any progress of any kind. Being woke prevents you from being to evaluate whether or not being woke is useful.

It's not about wanting to say hurty things to people.

But you've underlined the problem with the woke position. It's a black and white world where the woke are the good, and the non woke are the bad who wants to hurt people, and their only motivation for not being woke is because they are evil. It's a simplistic world view. It's painfully naive IMHO

The fundamental problem here is that being "woke" is not something white people are in a position, in most cases, to evaluate. You'll note "woke" here in this post is a slur.

You know, at one point I didn't think cultural appropriation could really be a thing. And while I still believe any person has every right to do any thing that serves function in their life beyond mere social signalling, this right here IS a problem and COULD appropriately fit under that banner.

Because DrZ and others here are appropriating a compliment into a fucking slur.

He is painting "being labeled as woke" as something white people do for white people. I would agree with his assessment in fact if that were the case. But it's not. It's not any (ok, not not ANY, but I'm running roughshod over corner case exceptions RN) white person's business calling any other white person woke. Not as a compliment and certainly not as a slur. Imagine if black people just started using the word "white", and/or ,"mayonnaise" to mean "shit". Or some such. I'm sure each and every person here is probably capable of coming up with a better example.

It's disrespectful.

It's fucking racist.

You know you aren't a part of an act when it is your actions and behaviors that are subsequently complimented by others.

Yet here DrZ is being exactly what he criticizes in the people he slurs with another culture, another language's words. He is saying hurty things. Why do you say hurty things to people DrZ? Isn't that what you are decrying here?

You've underlined the problem with any white person who talks about "wokeness" and who is and is not that, and especially yourself: it's painfully naive IMHO.
 

TomC

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Wow. Life does exist outside Television and the internet ya know. Christians and Atheists for example mingle with each other offline and off-air on a daily basis without any of this hyperbole you just mentioned. You need to go outside bruh.

Seriously?
I'm a gay non-theist from a conservative Catholic family, living in southern Indiana(practically Mike Pence's hometown).
I am very much aware of all this. But not everyone is.
Tom

I can't tell if you're trying to rebuke or make a pass at me.

Neither.
Just pointing out the reality.
Tom
 

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If you have a problem with the American anthem, this planet is not for you.
What an utterly ridiculous and ignorant thing to say. Francis Scott Key shoved a dictionary and a lot of punctuation into a terribly sick pig, and then gathered up what was blown out the rear end of said pig to tell the story of our getting our butts whooped in the War of 1812 and put it to an impossible to sing acoustic harmony of a drinking song. The thing has several verses that no one knows. It is awful! It is so bad, the only good thing about it was it inspired this moment.

[YOUTUBE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxHnXajIex4[/YOUTUBE]

American the Beautiful is sweet, to the point, easy to sing, and gets us from the beginning to the end without needing a water break.
God Bless America is self-serving, but checks most of the boxes. The Flyers' had Kate Smith perform God Bless America, not the Star Spangled Banner... and it is an icon moment for Philadelphia Flyers' history.

I didn't say it's perfect.
You said, "If you have a problem with the American anthem, this planet is not for you."

It is a shit song, a shit anthem, we (America) have better options available

All the other national anthems are worse.
Canada's isn't worse.
 

Don2 (Don1 Revised)

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While non-woke directors are effectively blocked from any platform.

It's a shame that Tarantino could never become successful.

I see I missed a word. I meant "While non-woke black directors are effectively blocked from any platform."

sorry. Now the sentence makes sense

Your "analysis" of history is based on emotional, Reich-wing propaganda and not on actual facts on the ground.

Here is an analysis that while flawed, at least links to real people and facts:
‘They Set Us Up to Fail’: Black Directors of the ’90s Speak Out
 

KeepTalking

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Or in other words, "any white person who applies the term to any other person is arrogant", to the extent that a westerner calling themselves a medicine man in front of First Peoples deserves the slap, social or physical, they are about to receive.

If that were the thread title, I would be in full agreement with the OP.
 

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Politesse

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In a way, it's like the label "Christian". There's no clear meaning. Anybody can call themselves that. But those who don't self identify as Christian are less likely to know the majority of perfectly nice Christian people. Mostly they hear about the assholish ones who are really noisy and self centered. The kind who will scream about gay marriage destroying the family, while they're working on their third divorce.

Except it's rare to find anyone who calls themselves "Woke"; it's more like the term "Fundamentalist" than "Christian", a formerly earnest self-descriptor that was popular for 1-2 years then converted by political tides into a implied pejorative that is therefore avoided by most, even if the term is often applied to them by hostile interlocutors.
 

lpetrich

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Or have warning labels on those books, like "full of insulting stereotypes". It would be good to have these as a record of the bad old days of when they were published.
 

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Or have warning labels on those books, like "full of insulting stereotypes". It would be good to have these as a record of the bad old days of when they were published.

That works, too! Just say no to burning books. Just say yes to accurate content warnings prominently displayed.
 

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Even as a child, I never understood the issue with books, because content that is upsetting does not have to be read. In my schools, the curriculum including short stories and books that would now cause someone somewhere some consternation. As far as I know, none of us were harmed by being introduced to these subjects.
So, I wonder if we, as a species, are simply becoming less sustainable.
 

TomC

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Or have warning labels on those books, like "full of insulting stereotypes". It would be good to have these as a record of the bad old days of when they were published.

That works, too! Just say no to burning books. Just say yes to accurate content warnings prominently displayed.

Why do we need warnings?

I remember when Boston had a severe movie rating committee. They banned a couple of good films. After that, even movies that hadn't come to the attention of Bostonian prudes put "Banned in Boston" on their posters, because it was good for ticket sales.

Similarly, putting "Parental Advisory" warnings on music CDs helped boost sales.
Warning labels, like many other things, don't always have the effects intended.
Tom
 

Jarhyn

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Or have warning labels on those books, like "full of insulting stereotypes". It would be good to have these as a record of the bad old days of when they were published.

That works, too! Just say no to burning books. Just say yes to accurate content warnings prominently displayed.

Why do we need warnings?

I remember when Boston had a severe movie rating committee. They banned a couple of good films. After that, even movies that hadn't come to the attention of Bostonian prudes put "Banned in Boston" on their posters, because it was good for ticket sales.

Similarly, putting "Parental Advisory" warnings on music CDs helped boost sales.
Warning labels, like many other things, don't always have the effects intended.
Tom

"Has content your parents don't want you to see because prudery and conflicting generational understandings of propriety" is completely different from "has problematic and insulting viewpoints expressed".

At any rate, it removes the plausible deniability as to the nature of the content and the excuse for those using it and referencing it to say they didn't know.
 

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That said, one of my teenage heroes, Spike Lee. He's super politically correct and super woke. Has been all the time. His rise to fame was because of the PC culture of the 80'ies. The PC culture, in all it's suffocating fakery, served him well. The 80'ies gave him a voice and a platform he wouldn't otherwise have had.

Spike Lee is PC? Are you sure about that? Is that why Do The Right Thing beat out Driving Miss Daisy for the Oscar? Oh that's right, it didn't because the PC movie that won the Oscar was actually the one that made white people feel good about putting their racism in the past, not the one that confronted modern day racism.

Your conflation of PC with woke just proves again that you have no idea what woke means.
 

KeepTalking

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I see I missed a word. I meant "While non-woke black directors are effectively blocked from any platform."

sorry. Now the sentence makes sense
But it is still a shame that Tarantino could never become successful.

Agreed. I heard his movies are really thought-provoking, and that he likes to push boundaries, so it's a terrible tragedy that they were never shown on the silver screen, and are impossible to find running on any movie channel or streaming service.
 

Jimmy Higgins

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I see I missed a word. I meant "While non-woke black directors are effectively blocked from any platform."

sorry. Now the sentence makes sense
But it is still a shame that Tarantino could never become successful.

Agreed. I heard his movies are really thought-provoking, and that he likes to push boundaries, so it's a terrible tragedy that they were never shown on the silver screen, and are impossible to find running on any movie channel or streaming service.
Guy can't even get anyone to act in his films for fear of being black listed themselves.
 

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Why do we need warnings?

I remember when Boston had a severe movie rating committee. They banned a couple of good films. After that, even movies that hadn't come to the attention of Bostonian prudes put "Banned in Boston" on their posters, because it was good for ticket sales.

Similarly, putting "Parental Advisory" warnings on music CDs helped boost sales.
Warning labels, like many other things, don't always have the effects intended.
Tom

"Has content your parents don't want you to see because prudery and conflicting generational understandings of propriety" is completely different from "has problematic and insulting viewpoints expressed".

It's not completely different by any stretch. It's still self righteous prudes sticking their opinions on media.


At any rate, it removes the plausible deniability as to the nature of the content and the excuse for those using it and referencing it to say they didn't know.

"Plausible deniability"? "using" a book?
I have a slightly higher opinion of humans in general. It's still pretty bleak. But people like you who want to put warnings on "To Kill a Mockingbird" and keep it out of reach of children don't give me much hope for the future.
Tom
 
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I've followed this ridiculous thread for awhile without saying anything. But, when I saw Zoid say, "If you have a problem with the American anthem, this planet is not for you", I was a bit stunned. Hyperbole much! I guess the planet isn't for me because I have refused to stand for that horrible war mongering pos since I was 17. A lot of us refused to stand for it as a mild protest during the Viet Nam War. To me, that song reminds me too much of America's tendency to start wars that are unnecessary. The song glorifies war and symbols like the flag.

I was disgusted at the way so many people reacted when Kaep and then later, other football players took a knee as a gentle protest. WTF does a so called anthem have to do with a violent sport? Oh wait. I get it now. Football is a macho warrior sport. Yeah. That must be it. :p ;)

But, we are supposed to have freedom of speech in this country. So, if you like the damn song, sing along. I don't condemn you for that. If you feel like I do, protest it, or sit quietly like I do. We are supposed to have the right to do either. I don't salute the flag either. I like the line in a song that I've heard Ray Charles sing. "The flag is just a rag as long as one of us' not free". Anthems, flags etc. are symbols that I dislike. They remind me too much of being forced to support things that you don't. I do love my country. I just want it to be better. So, I see it like a favorite line from an old jazz song. "Even when I hate you, it's only because I love you".


It has nothing to do with the "woke" movement. Woke is just an old term, initially part of Black urban slang that was supposed to refer to a person who had suddenly awakened to the fact that systemic racism remains a problem in the US. It's been appropriated to mean other things, and now it's over used. My friends and I have been awake for a long time. ;) We don't need to brag about it. And, sure. Sometimes people on the left can be as crazy and obnoxious as people on the right. Anything can be taken to extremes. That's what humans sometimes do. We are after all, great apes.

If Gen Z wants to start a woke movement, I'll just say, OK Zoomers.;)
 

Gospel

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I like directors like D'Urville Martin, Reginald Hudlin, Jeymes Samuel but that's just me.

I have enjoyed films by many of them on the list I posted and had no idea they were black, nor did I care.

Likewise, however here are some black film directors who aren't even listed on the Wiki Page of black directors. lol

Billy Woodberry
Charles Lane
Isaac Julien
Maïmouna Doucouré
Rick Famuyiwa
Souleymane Cisse
Wanuri Kahiu
 

Bomb#20

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Jimmy Higgins said:
Canada's isn't worse.
I think it's way better than ours.
Tom
"God keep our land glorious and free! O Canada, we stand on guard for thee."​

I can't really get behind governments teaching kids to say prayers. And the English version wasn't a translation of the original -- it was all new lyrics. Have you heard the French version?

"O Canada!
Land of our ancestors
Glorious deeds circle your brow
For your arm knows how to wield the sword
Your arm knows how to carry the cross;
Your history is an epic
Of brilliant deeds
And your valour steeped in faith
Will protect our homes and our rights."​
 

Bomb#20

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Yeah, it's not an inquisition. And yah, it's absolutely indefensible.

Granted I would see a lot of those books relegated to storage, or the high shelves ... Or some other place of shame amongst the stacks. ... It just pays to well classify it as such, too.
Yeah, the Index of Forbidden Books was never intended to prohibit Jesuits from reading them.
 

Jarhyn

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It's not completely different by any stretch. It's still self righteous prudes sticking their opinions on media.


At any rate, it removes the plausible deniability as to the nature of the content and the excuse for those using it and referencing it to say they didn't know.

"Plausible deniability"? "using" a book?
I have a slightly higher opinion of humans in general. It's still pretty bleak. But people like you who want to put warnings on "To Kill a Mockingbird" and keep it out of reach of children don't give me much hope for the future.
Tom

On is not in. These are very different words despite being so close of an utterance.

Everything else is just bullshit that flows from that spring of conflation.
 

TSwizzle

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This style of mocking and holier-than-thou antipathy towards the idea of being “woke” to the needs, concerns and pain of others is interesting to behold. It is a repeated poke-poke-poke to agitate and keep agitated to make sure that those who care about justice and the well being of others know that they are mocked and disdained by a few dominance-fetishers who think care is a weakness. It’s the equivalent of the schoolyard bully who constantly bumps and pushes those they deem “weaker” and calls them “fag” or “pussy.”

It manifests here on TFT as this constant barrage of posts by a very small number of posters repeating the same shallow insults over and over. “Wokester.” “Virtue Signaling.” It used to include “PC” as an insult. See how I disdain your care for others. See how weak I think you are. See how I can knock your schoolbooks out of your hand onto the hallway floor and you won’t do it back to me? That means I’m powerful. That means I’m alpha. In my head, anyway.


When a discussion in one of these threads directs towards why compassion is valuable, and why being aware and supportive of the lived experiences of others is not something people are ashamed of, the schoolyard-style bullies keep name-calling for a while, then drop it, and go start another thread with their current mocking words; they run to another student and knock over their books and stand around with their chest out thinking everyone admires their “strength” and dominance.


So - yeah yeah yeah. Wokester. Virtue Signalling. PC run amok.


I am **GLAD** to be awake to the realities of others. I was insulated for so long not realizing what my world was like for others.
I am **GLAD** to signal to others what virtues I find important; among them care, concern, justice
I am **GLAD** to know what language hurts, and avoid it in favor of lannguage that doesn’t hurt. Hooray for Politically Correct norms.

And I’ll keep thinking this next week, when I watch the bullies again posture and preen with their displays of mocking and disdain, their acts of dominance-seeking where they try to knock others down so they can feel strong and worthwhile. And I’ll keep thinking, “how sad is that. They have to work so hard to feel worthwhile. They never feel content and loved. Gotta shove people to the ground so they can feel tall. No one taught them how to build to feel big, they only learned how to destroy others. And they don’t even realize that no one looks at that display and thinks they are powerful. Or - maybe they do know that, but they only know one way to feel powerful and they just have to keep using it, even while they know it doesn’t work.”


I know this and other posts will continue to sprout up. Mock the caring, disdain cooperative aspirations. Try to sell dominance as the only virtue. Beat the chest. Howl the monkey howls.

The dogs bark, but the caravan goes on.

I am sure your heart is in the right place but it is not the people ridiculing wokeism that are the bullies. It is the virtue signaling, cancel culture, de-platforming wokesters that are the bullies. It is virtue signaling wokesters that have "flame purification" ceremonies, i.e. burning books deemed "problematic". It is wokesters that kick up a fuss about Dr Seuss books and bully publishers and distributors. It is the wokesters that are knocking books out people's hands "you can't read that, it's "problematic". It's the wokesters tearing down statues etc.
 

Trausti

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This style of mocking and holier-than-thou antipathy towards the idea of being “woke” to the needs, concerns and pain of others is interesting to behold. It is a repeated poke-poke-poke to agitate and keep agitated to make sure that those who care about justice and the well being of others know that they are mocked and disdained by a few dominance-fetishers who think care is a weakness. It’s the equivalent of the schoolyard bully who constantly bumps and pushes those they deem “weaker” and calls them “fag” or “pussy.”

It manifests here on TFT as this constant barrage of posts by a very small number of posters repeating the same shallow insults over and over. “Wokester.” “Virtue Signaling.” It used to include “PC” as an insult. See how I disdain your care for others. See how weak I think you are. See how I can knock your schoolbooks out of your hand onto the hallway floor and you won’t do it back to me? That means I’m powerful. That means I’m alpha. In my head, anyway.


When a discussion in one of these threads directs towards why compassion is valuable, and why being aware and supportive of the lived experiences of others is not something people are ashamed of, the schoolyard-style bullies keep name-calling for a while, then drop it, and go start another thread with their current mocking words; they run to another student and knock over their books and stand around with their chest out thinking everyone admires their “strength” and dominance.


So - yeah yeah yeah. Wokester. Virtue Signalling. PC run amok.


I am **GLAD** to be awake to the realities of others. I was insulated for so long not realizing what my world was like for others.
I am **GLAD** to signal to others what virtues I find important; among them care, concern, justice
I am **GLAD** to know what language hurts, and avoid it in favor of lannguage that doesn’t hurt. Hooray for Politically Correct norms.

And I’ll keep thinking this next week, when I watch the bullies again posture and preen with their displays of mocking and disdain, their acts of dominance-seeking where they try to knock others down so they can feel strong and worthwhile. And I’ll keep thinking, “how sad is that. They have to work so hard to feel worthwhile. They never feel content and loved. Gotta shove people to the ground so they can feel tall. No one taught them how to build to feel big, they only learned how to destroy others. And they don’t even realize that no one looks at that display and thinks they are powerful. Or - maybe they do know that, but they only know one way to feel powerful and they just have to keep using it, even while they know it doesn’t work.”


I know this and other posts will continue to sprout up. Mock the caring, disdain cooperative aspirations. Try to sell dominance as the only virtue. Beat the chest. Howl the monkey howls.

The dogs bark, but the caravan goes on.

I am sure your heart is in the right place but it is not the people ridiculing wokeism that are the bullies. It is the virtue signaling, cancel culture, de-platforming wokesters that are the bullies. It is virtue signaling wokesters that have "flame purification" ceremonies, i.e. burning books deemed "problematic". It is wokesters that kick up a fuss about Dr Seuss books and bully publishers and distributors. It is the wokesters that are knocking books out people's hands "you can't read that, it's "problematic". It's the wokesters tearing down statues etc.

The Woke are the church ladies of yesteryear.
 

WAB

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Wow. Life does exist outside Television and the internet ya know. Christians and Atheists for example mingle with each other offline and off-air on a daily basis without any of this hyperbole you just mentioned. You need to go outside bruh.

Seriously?
I'm a gay non-theist from a conservative Catholic family, living in southern Indiana(practically Mike Pence's hometown).
I am very much aware of all this. But not everyone is.
Tom

I can't tell if you're trying to rebuke or make a pass at me.

Well, that was silly.
 
Last edited:

Trausti

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Angry Floof

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This style of mocking and holier-than-thou antipathy towards the idea of being “woke” to the needs, concerns and pain of others is interesting to behold. It is a repeated poke-poke-poke to agitate and keep agitated to make sure that those who care about justice and the well being of others know that they are mocked and disdained by a few dominance-fetishers who think care is a weakness. It’s the equivalent of the schoolyard bully who constantly bumps and pushes those they deem “weaker” and calls them “fag” or “pussy.”

It manifests here on TFT as this constant barrage of posts by a very small number of posters repeating the same shallow insults over and over. “Wokester.” “Virtue Signaling.” It used to include “PC” as an insult. See how I disdain your care for others. See how weak I think you are. See how I can knock your schoolbooks out of your hand onto the hallway floor and you won’t do it back to me? That means I’m powerful. That means I’m alpha. In my head, anyway.


When a discussion in one of these threads directs towards why compassion is valuable, and why being aware and supportive of the lived experiences of others is not something people are ashamed of, the schoolyard-style bullies keep name-calling for a while, then drop it, and go start another thread with their current mocking words; they run to another student and knock over their books and stand around with their chest out thinking everyone admires their “strength” and dominance.


So - yeah yeah yeah. Wokester. Virtue Signalling. PC run amok.


I am **GLAD** to be awake to the realities of others. I was insulated for so long not realizing what my world was like for others.
I am **GLAD** to signal to others what virtues I find important; among them care, concern, justice
I am **GLAD** to know what language hurts, and avoid it in favor of lannguage that doesn’t hurt. Hooray for Politically Correct norms.

And I’ll keep thinking this next week, when I watch the bullies again posture and preen with their displays of mocking and disdain, their acts of dominance-seeking where they try to knock others down so they can feel strong and worthwhile. And I’ll keep thinking, “how sad is that. They have to work so hard to feel worthwhile. They never feel content and loved. Gotta shove people to the ground so they can feel tall. No one taught them how to build to feel big, they only learned how to destroy others. And they don’t even realize that no one looks at that display and thinks they are powerful. Or - maybe they do know that, but they only know one way to feel powerful and they just have to keep using it, even while they know it doesn’t work.”


I know this and other posts will continue to sprout up. Mock the caring, disdain cooperative aspirations. Try to sell dominance as the only virtue. Beat the chest. Howl the monkey howls.

The dogs bark, but the caravan goes on.

Great post.
 

J842P

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Why do we need warnings?

I remember when Boston had a severe movie rating committee. They banned a couple of good films. After that, even movies that hadn't come to the attention of Bostonian prudes put "Banned in Boston" on their posters, because it was good for ticket sales.

Similarly, putting "Parental Advisory" warnings on music CDs helped boost sales.
Warning labels, like many other things, don't always have the effects intended.
Tom

"Has content your parents don't want you to see because prudery and conflicting generational understandings of propriety" is completely different from "has problematic and insulting viewpoints expressed".

At any rate, it removes the plausible deniability as to the nature of the content and the excuse for those using it and referencing it to say they didn't know.

No, it seems pretty much the exact same thing to me. What is the relevant difference in your mind?
 

Jarhyn

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Why do we need warnings?

I remember when Boston had a severe movie rating committee. They banned a couple of good films. After that, even movies that hadn't come to the attention of Bostonian prudes put "Banned in Boston" on their posters, because it was good for ticket sales.

Similarly, putting "Parental Advisory" warnings on music CDs helped boost sales.
Warning labels, like many other things, don't always have the effects intended.
Tom

"Has content your parents don't want you to see because prudery and conflicting generational understandings of propriety" is completely different from "has problematic and insulting viewpoints expressed".

At any rate, it removes the plausible deniability as to the nature of the content and the excuse for those using it and referencing it to say they didn't know.

No, it seems pretty much the exact same thing to me. What is the relevant difference in your mind?

One says "you're not allowed because 'reasons'" that were never actually good nor valid in the first place. Curse words. Words that mean poop and pee and "having sex" oh no! Honestly, "damn it" is pretty fucking bad, now that I think about it. Well, we have religion to thank for that disgusting idea...

Anyway, the relevant difference is that in a library, anyone is still allowed to pick it up, open it, read the words. They don't even have to look at the advisory, though ge really it's likely to happen to be seen.

The difference is that I couldn't go to the store to buy a CD with a parental advisory at one point. The clerk would walk up to my parents, say "be advised", and then they would say "no".

There are probably pieces of media at the library like that, too, mind... The difference is that I would as soon see the advice be leveled exclusively at the seeker, not at some gatekeeping third party. That's the difference
 

DrZoidberg

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This style of mocking and holier-than-thou antipathy towards the idea of being “woke” to the needs, concerns and pain of others is interesting to behold. It is a repeated poke-poke-poke to agitate and keep agitated to make sure that those who care about justice and the well being of others know that they are mocked and disdained by a few dominance-fetishers who think care is a weakness. It’s the equivalent of the schoolyard bully who constantly bumps and pushes those they deem “weaker” and calls them “fag” or “pussy.”

It manifests here on TFT as this constant barrage of posts by a very small number of posters repeating the same shallow insults over and over. “Wokester.” “Virtue Signaling.” It used to include “PC” as an insult. See how I disdain your care for others. See how weak I think you are. See how I can knock your schoolbooks out of your hand onto the hallway floor and you won’t do it back to me? That means I’m powerful. That means I’m alpha. In my head, anyway.


When a discussion in one of these threads directs towards why compassion is valuable, and why being aware and supportive of the lived experiences of others is not something people are ashamed of, the schoolyard-style bullies keep name-calling for a while, then drop it, and go start another thread with their current mocking words; they run to another student and knock over their books and stand around with their chest out thinking everyone admires their “strength” and dominance.


So - yeah yeah yeah. Wokester. Virtue Signalling. PC run amok.


I am **GLAD** to be awake to the realities of others. I was insulated for so long not realizing what my world was like for others.
I am **GLAD** to signal to others what virtues I find important; among them care, concern, justice
I am **GLAD** to know what language hurts, and avoid it in favor of lannguage that doesn’t hurt. Hooray for Politically Correct norms.

And I’ll keep thinking this next week, when I watch the bullies again posture and preen with their displays of mocking and disdain, their acts of dominance-seeking where they try to knock others down so they can feel strong and worthwhile. And I’ll keep thinking, “how sad is that. They have to work so hard to feel worthwhile. They never feel content and loved. Gotta shove people to the ground so they can feel tall. No one taught them how to build to feel big, they only learned how to destroy others. And they don’t even realize that no one looks at that display and thinks they are powerful. Or - maybe they do know that, but they only know one way to feel powerful and they just have to keep using it, even while they know it doesn’t work.”


I know this and other posts will continue to sprout up. Mock the caring, disdain cooperative aspirations. Try to sell dominance as the only virtue. Beat the chest. Howl the monkey howls.

The dogs bark, but the caravan goes on.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with being compassionate to others. And even though you don't agree with DrZoidberg perhaps you might go halfway and at least allow for artists like Tarantino the freedom to produce content they think others might pay to consume. You don't have to go to their movies or agree with their content but just allow them their freedom of expression and first amendment rights as you would expect them to respect yours.

And above all else, don't claim to be something you really aren't. If you are woke and want to conduct your life privately as woke... that's perfect. Just don't be a big fake "woker" and pretend to be woke just for your own personal and selfish gain. Even Jesus himself knew better when he said it was better to only put a penny in the offering plate in secret than to put a $100 dollar bill in the plate and make a big public horse show over it.

Anyway I think that is what DrZoid is saying.

Sure, but I don't think woke necessarily is a conscious choice. I think the woke most often think they are good people. I think they think them making statements on social media is, a force for good. Who doesn't want to think of themselves as good people? Their virtue signalling is ego massage.

I think Wokes are less cynical than you make it sound like I am.

Its more like, the road to hell is paved with good intentions. I mean, the people of Salem didn't feel like they were murdering innocent and defensless women. They thought they were conquering evil. Ideology can be powerful and seductive in unhelpful ways.
 

Rhea

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Bearing in mind that the people you call “wokes” do not call themsleves “wokes” and thus demonstrates that your use of the worrd as a means to disdain their efforts at whatever they want to do is just a manifestation of attempted agressive dominance.

The word started as a term to identify caring people by those receiving the caring (it actually started before that as something else, but that is a digresssion). And here you are saying that the term is now an insult - doing your level best to damage a caring relationship between groups by mocking, disdaining and insulting the relationship itself.


Which makes you the asshole who kicks over the sandcastle. The one who will destroy the structures of others so you can feel tall yourself standing in the rubble.


When you call someone “woke,” you do it to someone who never called themselves that, and you do it with a sneer and a smug insult. It’s simply destructive, not constructive. You seek to tear down relationships. And call yourself enlightned for doing it.

It’s just a schoolyard bully, though, shoving over kids in the hallway to make himself feel powerful.
 

Jarhyn

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This style of mocking and holier-than-thou antipathy towards the idea of being “woke” to the needs, concerns and pain of others is interesting to behold. It is a repeated poke-poke-poke to agitate and keep agitated to make sure that those who care about justice and the well being of others know that they are mocked and disdained by a few dominance-fetishers who think care is a weakness. It’s the equivalent of the schoolyard bully who constantly bumps and pushes those they deem “weaker” and calls them “fag” or “pussy.”

It manifests here on TFT as this constant barrage of posts by a very small number of posters repeating the same shallow insults over and over. “Wokester.” “Virtue Signaling.” It used to include “PC” as an insult. See how I disdain your care for others. See how weak I think you are. See how I can knock your schoolbooks out of your hand onto the hallway floor and you won’t do it back to me? That means I’m powerful. That means I’m alpha. In my head, anyway.


When a discussion in one of these threads directs towards why compassion is valuable, and why being aware and supportive of the lived experiences of others is not something people are ashamed of, the schoolyard-style bullies keep name-calling for a while, then drop it, and go start another thread with their current mocking words; they run to another student and knock over their books and stand around with their chest out thinking everyone admires their “strength” and dominance.


So - yeah yeah yeah. Wokester. Virtue Signalling. PC run amok.


I am **GLAD** to be awake to the realities of others. I was insulated for so long not realizing what my world was like for others.
I am **GLAD** to signal to others what virtues I find important; among them care, concern, justice
I am **GLAD** to know what language hurts, and avoid it in favor of lannguage that doesn’t hurt. Hooray for Politically Correct norms.

And I’ll keep thinking this next week, when I watch the bullies again posture and preen with their displays of mocking and disdain, their acts of dominance-seeking where they try to knock others down so they can feel strong and worthwhile. And I’ll keep thinking, “how sad is that. They have to work so hard to feel worthwhile. They never feel content and loved. Gotta shove people to the ground so they can feel tall. No one taught them how to build to feel big, they only learned how to destroy others. And they don’t even realize that no one looks at that display and thinks they are powerful. Or - maybe they do know that, but they only know one way to feel powerful and they just have to keep using it, even while they know it doesn’t work.”


I know this and other posts will continue to sprout up. Mock the caring, disdain cooperative aspirations. Try to sell dominance as the only virtue. Beat the chest. Howl the monkey howls.

The dogs bark, but the caravan goes on.

Bearing in mind that the people you call “wokes” do not call themsleves “wokes” and thus demonstrates that your use of the worrd as a means to disdain their efforts at whatever they want to do is just a manifestation of attempted agressive dominance.

The word started as a term to identify caring people by those receiving the caring (it actually started before that as something else, but that is a digresssion). And here you are saying that the term is now an insult - doing your level best to damage a caring relationship between groups by mocking, disdaining and insulting the relationship itself.


Which makes you the asshole who kicks over the sandcastle. The one who will destroy the structures of others so you can feel tall yourself standing in the rubble.


When you call someone “woke,” you do it to someone who never called themselves that, and you do it with a sneer and a smug insult. It’s simply destructive, not constructive. You seek to tear down relationships. And call yourself enlightned for doing it.

It’s just a schoolyard bully, though, shoving over kids in the hallway to make himself feel powerful.

Bolding mine. Anyway, I'm done replying to this thread now, since its title is an insult to the truth.
 

TSwizzle

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I think you are partly correct. However;

Sure, but I don't think woke necessarily is a conscious choice. I think the woke most often think they are good people.

I think there is a difference between people who are “woke”, the unhinged type that see being white or not particularly supportive of BLM automatically makes them racist and most people who have their heart in the right place and thumbs/like some twaddle on Facebook or post a pithy quote or meme.

The “woke” (and CRT and BLM proponents) are professional agitators and it takes a conscious choice to be part of that.
 
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