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Legal definition of woman is based on biological sex, UK supreme court rules

seanie said:
Well, the issue is that sex is a well defined category across a vast array of plants and animals.

And when it comes to trans rights activism there has been a concerted effort to deny the reality of sex.

That it’s a spectrum, a Victorian/colonial invention, that it’s incredibly complex, undefinable, “INTERSEX!”, “CLOWNFISH!!!!”

And that’s all ideological horseshit.
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Do you believe that sex and gender are the same thing?
 
ZiprHead said:
seanie said:
Well, the issue is that sex is a well defined category across a vast array of plants and animals.

And when it comes to trans rights activism there has been a concerted effort to deny the reality of sex.

That it’s a spectrum, a Victorian/colonial invention, that it’s incredibly complex, undefinable, “INTERSEX!”, “CLOWNFISH!!!!”

And that’s all ideological horseshit.
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Do you believe that sex and gender are the same thing?
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I'm certain that one big problem here is that seanie and I and people like us can and do distinguish between sex and gender.

It's the people who refuse to distinguish between sex and gender that are creating the problems for the rest of us. Seanie and I get the difference. Does @laughing dog?
Tom
 
I have a clear understanding what sex is, that is a material objective reality.

Gender?

A person’s subjective sense of who they are?

Fine.

But in some situations a person’s sex does actually matter. And in those circumstances, a person’s deep conviction that they are not the sex that actually are, is irrelevant.

They should still be afforded dignity, respect, and be free from harassment. But males who identify as women are still men.
 
The choice is not between Tulsa and Dachau.

It’s accepting that in some circumstances sex does actually matter, and it’s legitimate to discriminate on the basis of sex.
 
And what does gender mean without reference to socially constructed stereotypes?

In what way are sex and gender different?

Define your terms.
 
TomC said:
ZiprHead said:
seanie said:
Well, the issue is that sex is a well defined category across a vast array of plants and animals.

And when it comes to trans rights activism there has been a concerted effort to deny the reality of sex.

That it’s a spectrum, a Victorian/colonial invention, that it’s incredibly complex, undefinable, “INTERSEX!”, “CLOWNFISH!!!!”

And that’s all ideological horseshit.
Click to expand...
Do you believe that sex and gender are the same thing?
Click to expand...
I'm certain that one big problem here is that seanie and I and people like us can and do distinguish between sex and gender.

It's the people who refuse to distinguish between sex and gender that are creating the problems for the rest of us. Seanie and I get the difference. Does @laughing dog?
Tom
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Which do you believe plays more importance in people's lives? Sex or gender?
 
We’ve been offered in this thread, that anyone who considers themselves a woman is a woman.

That’s insane.

Absolutely batshit crazy.

And it was a comment made with very little pushback.

The IIDB forum has always been predominantly male. And it’s unsurprising that they’ve not given much thought to/not given a shit, about an issue that overwhelming affects females negatively.

Because most men are conditioned to be misogynistic without even realising it.
 
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Gender is parasitic upon sex: gender presupposes the existence of sex. And sex is binary: there are only two sexes. Gender terms are sex terms.

Trans activists want to sever gender from sex and use it to refer to some sort of mental state. Looks like a recipe for disaster to me.
 
Does a person’s sex or gender matter much in everyday life?

Not much.

Should a convicted double rapist be sent to a women’s prison because he considers himself to be a woman?

Fuck off with that bullshit.
 
seanie said:
ZiprHead said:
Which do you believe plays more importance in people's lives? Sex or gender?
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That depends on the circumstances.

And you’ve yet to explain what gender means.
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I accept your definition, with one small caveat. "A person’s subjective sense of who they are (and who they are attracted to sexually)". Do you agree?

What circumstances did you have in mind?
 
Ahab said:
Gender is parasitic upon sex: gender presupposes the existence of sex. And sex is binary: there are only two sexes. Gender terms are sex terms.

Trans activists want to sever gender from sex and use it to refer to some sort of mental state. Looks like a recipe for disaster to me.
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What sex are your genitals attracted to?
 
When you say who they are attracted to sexually, what do you mean?

Same sex attraction, or same gender attraction?

If sex and gender are different things?
 
ZiprHead said:
Which do you believe plays more importance in people's lives? Sex or gender?
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Obviously, that depends on the person, the context, and a few other things.

Lemme tell you a true story.
A dear friend of mine from highschool and I stayed friends way into adulthood, until she was killed by cancer. She was quite the social animal, often having parties at home and getting groups together to out for dinner. She had a friend, nicknamed "Kit".

I didn't like Kit. Not because she was lesbian, much less female. Because I considered her an acerbic bitch. I didn't like being around her.
One time I mentioned that to my friend, while we were in private. Here's what she told me (paraphrasing due to the decades since).
"I understand why you don't like Kit. And I normally wouldn't tell anybody this, because it is not my place to do so. But Kit had a horrible childhood. Her step father started renting her out to his buddies for drug and booze money when she was in middle school. She ran away before she was 16. She was homeless for years, until she was old enough to get a job and rent a place of her own. She hates men. When there are no men around she's a completely different person. You'll never know that Kit because you are a man."

It kinda freaked me out at the time. But I got it. I can sympathize with women who absolutely do not want a man in the grocery store restroom with them.

No matter how much other people tell them that they are being irrational and mean.
Tom
 
seanie said:
When you say who they are attracted to sexually, what do you mean?

Same sex attraction, or same gender attraction?

If sex and gender are different things?
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Beauty in in the eye of the beholder, so it could be both, neither, or more.
 
ZiprHead said:
Beauty in in the eye of the beholder, so it could be both, neither, or more.
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No, they are your words, so what do you mean by them?

If sex and gender are different, how do we distinguish between same sex and same gender attracted people?

Because they are different classes.

Define your terms.
 
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