How did human language originate?

[fromderinside]

Talk about reaching for moon beams. Firs, most sensory information is processed as another category or categories as it is made meaningful so that's nothing special. Using just that to make an argument for genetically defined language structure goes way beyond the data. Hell, even Mountcastle et. al. in 1957 showed how information was initially parsed in cortex by different parts of the brain for different purposes. It's in that group's discovery of 6 cell vertical column associated with place of touch. fully two years before by the work in vision by Ratliff and Hartline.

At last count there were at least 20 different analyses in differing parts of the cortex of the same visual information being carried on by the human brain for most any input.

Unbounded combination is a standard feature of most information processing channels in the human brain. That plus association, differientation, and physical plasticity, are among the most widely known aspects of human brain functional organizing principles.

 

[untermensche]

...At last count there were at least 20 different analyses in differing parts of the cortex of the same visual information being carried on by the human brain for most any input....

You're merely showing how far we are from understanding the underlying workings of the brain.

That humans have a language capacity is not derived from finding some specific part of the brain, although there are well known language areas of the brain.

The capacity is derived from observing how much people can get from so little data, and how similar the capacity is across all people.

 

[DrZoidberg]

The point being made is that Turing has proofs for relational databases being used to develop infinite hierarchies on a computer. You demur saying |not talking about computers ...talking about humans". Actually bilby provided the example of relational databases doing hierarchical infinities using databases after a Turing mathematical proof where you claim only man can do that because Chomsky sez so. Chairs are meant to have more than one leg sir. When you stand on a one legged one you are going to fall. Oh wait. Chairs are meant to have more than one leg sir. When you stand on a one legged one you are going to fall. There fixed it so you will understand.

The coolest thing about Turing is that he made it all up in his head. Not only did he come up with the theory for a workable computer. He came up with how to program them. He wrote workable and accurate computer programes with nothing but pen and paper. I used to work as a computer programmer, and I can barely do it with context support. He figured out and solved so many problems with progamming in binary code that I never stop being amazed by that man.

Yes, this is a derail. Just a spontaneous fan-gush. It often emerges when I see Turings name.

 

[fromderinside]

...continuing the derail for a moment to report a memory .... did some programming on a DEC 12 back in the day. Machine and assembly forms. Had to visualize drop through routine to capture flags set by actions and human responses in less than 80 microseconds* to assure humans wouldn't see or feel changes in patterns delivered by the computer through my program. Managed to visualize steps and actions in machine language. Things were a lot different then when a few machine cycles could interfere with human perception. No visual or auditory feedback. A thrill.

Now back to the discussion.

*^{_{machine cycles were 1.2 microseconds and instructions took up to three cycles. Go1 40 instructions maximum required for flag check, about 68 microseconds result}}.

 

[fromderinside]

Gee. Information thresholds. Consider reading cybernetics or other such research publications. The hearing system can respond to one angstrom displacement of the basilar membrane and the visual system to as few as four photons. I'm guessing the information processing system can respond (discriminate) something in the neighborhood of two or three bits. Maybe Chomsky should have read a bit more on Shannon and Fletcher.