More "debate" idiocy

[Derec]

We have discussed the downfall of college debate before, where the topic does not even have to be addressed to win.

Now you can get disqualified for quoting sources the judges don't like. And what makes it very Orwellian is that the judges accuse Shapiro and Peterson of being 'white supremacists' when it was actually the opposing team who was actually being racist.
High School Students Disqualified From Debate After Quoting Ben Shapiro, Jordan Peterson

A pair of Utah high school seniors lost a debate round because they read quotes from Daily Wire Editor-in-Chief Ben Shapiro and clinical psychologist Dr. Jordan Peterson, who were deemed “white supremacists” by the judge.

Which is ridiculous.

Instead of arguing in the affirmative, Moreno told The Daily Wire, the other team read a “slam poem” about how terms like “legal” and “illegal” are dehumanizing. In documents provided to The Daily Wire, these students quoted from numerous professors critical of assimilation and the notion that immigrants must act American to live “the good life.”

Again we have the instance of debate participants refusing to debate the topic and get rewarded for it.

The other team, during the cross-examination section of the debate, said Moreno and his partner could not talk about fairness because they were “white males.”

Moreno said he then speed-read through quotes from Shapiro and Peterson pertaining to identity politics. He specifically cited comments Shapiro made at the University of Connecticut on January 24, 2018, where he said: ‘Evil things are still evil even if I’m a white well-off religious man and good things are still good even if I’m a white well-off religious man …. My identity has nothing to do with what is right or wrong.”

Moreno also quoted Peterson saying, “It goes along with this idea of class guilt; Because your group membership is the most important thing, if your group at some point in the past did something reprehensible – which of course every group has done – then you’re de facto responsible for that.”

What's wrong with either of these quotes? Much less "racist" or "white supremacist"?
And yet these boys were disqualified, but the actual racists who refused to address the topic assigned were rewarded. It's utter idiocy inspired by identity politics.

These debates have become a joke since at least 2014. Arguments do not matter, only your "identity".

 

[Koyaanisqatsi]

It was a high school debate. In fucking Utah. Why do you give any shit at all about a completely inconsequential high school debate round in fucking Utah?

Let me rephrase that. Why have you been programmed to pretend to give a shit about a completely inconsequential high school debate round in fucking Utah?

Did you compete in forensics in high school? Do you have any idea at all what you're railing against? There are some fifty thousand such debate rounds (likely many many more, but that's a good estimate for these purposes) that are conducted every weekend in every state in America in the lead-up to the respective State finals and then everyone that wins those goes to one host high school in some random State for the big Nationals tournament (that for most of the participants resembles a post pubescent hormone fest ala the Olympic Village only for smart kids).

During those fifty thousand + debate rounds all over the country, the debaters are making hundreds of arguments in every round, so we're talking about something on the order of 5,000,000 arguments (most of them crap) being made every year--once again, from high school kids desperately trying to prove themselves in countless local high school classrooms on weekends in the further hope that they might touch a breast or meet a boy--in front of "judges" who are usually just hyper-intelligent local graduate students with "jailbait" issues.

The stage of the round in question isn't even noted. The description of the round and why ANY legitimate news organization would think it's at ALL important to detail it is laughable at best.

This isn't even a story that the local high school newspaper would right about, much less publish.

Again, these are high school students in fucking Utah. This is identical to taking an electron microscope to a piece of dog shit, blowing up the picture to the size of a gym wall and then pointing at it as if it were the grand canyon.

 

[ideologyhunter]

Just remember -- some of those Utah high school students will grow up to be self-absorbed, self-righteous, unbearably smug Utah college students -- and at that point, no one still needs to give a shit about them. (Do pity anyone who has to grow up in an intensified LDS atmosphere, tho'. On this point, I'm sincere.)

 

[Wiploc]

Now you can get disqualified for quoting sources the judges don't like.

Many courtroom judges handing life or death criminal cases are unqualified.

I don't know how you get qualified judges to judge student debates. I was roped in to judge student debates once, and had very little idea of what to do.

So my first thought is that the problem may be with an individual judge rather than with the system.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

We had an informal debate in English class on gays in the military. I was assigned con... so I went all emotional and judgmental. We won according to the class.

How can one get disqualified for citing sources? Someone should be disqualified for misquoting sources, not citing them, I mean short of justifying things using something like books by Hitler.

Regardless, as noted by the OP... has American news media devolved so low that this is considered news? Is it possible that my bullshit B in an American Literature test in college would have received Internet news media attention?

It reminds me of a juxtaposition with the recent Super Bowl and complaints that the commercials weren't that good. The US has become a nation of spoiled entitled children that want to complain about everything!

 

[Tom Sawyer]

Regardless, as noted by the OP... has American news media devolved so low that this is considered news? Is it possible that my bullshit B in an American Literature test in college would have received Internet news media attention?

Well, it's the Daily Wire. Is that considered part of the American news media or is it just some kind of clickbait site which is drawing in people looking for something to get angry about? I honestly don't know. It's not necessarily the case that this is actually part of the conversation the US is having as a nation.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Regardless, as noted by the OP... has American news media devolved so low that this is considered news? Is it possible that my bullshit B in an American Literature test in college would have received Internet news media attention?

Well, it's the Daily Wire. Is that considered part of the American news media or is it just some kind of clickbait site which is drawing in people looking for something to get angry about? I honestly don't know. It's not necessarily the case that this is actually part of the conversation the US is having as a nation.

But we are talking about it. It was reported, if by some third rate site. And Derec got upset over it.

 

[repoman]

Did they say shaclackclack? That would have gotten them to 2nd place

 

[Koyaanisqatsi]

Regardless, as noted by the OP... has American news media devolved so low that this is considered news? Is it possible that my bullshit B in an American Literature test in college would have received Internet news media attention?

Well, it's the Daily Wire. Is that considered part of the American news media or is it just some kind of clickbait site which is drawing in people looking for something to get angry about? I honestly don't know. It's not necessarily the case that this is actually part of the conversation the US is having as a nation.

But we are talking about it. It was reported, if by some third rate site. And Derec got upset over it.

Because of his TDS. Judging from just about everything he's ever posted, he is apparently programmed to push anything his "news" groups tell him to. He's like a human bot, mindlessly regurgitating non-issues like this precisely because others want to escalate them into bigger issues (or, barring that, pointless distractions). I.e., making mountains (or trying to anyway) out of mole hills so that google ranks them higher.

That kind of thing. Apparently.

 

[Keith&Co.]

Regardless, as noted by the OP... has American news media devolved so low that this is considered news? Is it possible that my bullshit B in an American Literature test in college would have received Internet news media attention?

Is it really 'devolved,' though?
I mean, when media was limited to paper, then someone had to make a conscious decision of what to include on valuable paper space. There's no telling how many story ideas might have been suggested about stuff like this back in the day, but discounted unless they needed filler.
When media expanded to television, the limits were even more critical. The paper could add pages if necessary, the TV had half an hour, no more, no matter what.

Now, there's no real limit to the amount of space available for yet another story. And as long as someone clicks on it, even if only for long enough to say, "this is bullshit" and leave, they did click. And that justifies the ad revenue they charge.

 

[repoman]

Regardless, as noted by the OP... has American news media devolved so low that this is considered news? Is it possible that my bullshit B in an American Literature test in college would have received Internet news media attention?

Is it really 'devolved,' though?
I mean, when media was limited to paper, then someone had to make a conscious decision of what to include on valuable paper space. There's no telling how many story ideas might have been suggested about stuff like this back in the day, but discounted unless they needed filler.
When media expanded to television, the limits were even more critical. The paper could add pages if necessary, the TV had half an hour, no more, no matter what.

Now, there's no real limit to the amount of space available for yet another story. And as long as someone clicks on it, even if only for long enough to say, "this is bullshit" and leave, they did click. And that justifies the ad revenue they charge.

good points

 

[laughing dog]

The OP rant is based on report on a website that is based on what the alleged "victim" says and a video that starts HALFWAY through the debate. One wonders why the video was started HALFWAY through the debate and what actually happened before the start of the video.

 

[Derec]

It was a high school debate. In fucking Utah. Why do you give any shit at all about a completely inconsequential high school debate round in fucking Utah?

Why do we give a shit about a C-list actor possibly getting attacked in Chicago? Or some E-list comedian being asked for ID close to the Mexico border? Both of these are threads on page 1 in PD. I do not recall you complaining about those.

And I have already said why it has significance - it is a continuation of the "identity politics über alles" nonsense that has led to a completely content free rambling "winning" the collegiate debate a few years ago.

 

[laughing dog]

It was a high school debate. In fucking Utah. Why do you give any shit at all about a completely inconsequential high school debate round in fucking Utah?

Why do we give a shit about a C-list actor possibly getting attacked in Chicago? Or some E-list comedian being asked for ID close to the Mexico border?

What's with this "we"?

And I have already said why it has significance - it is a continuation of the "identity politics über alles" nonsense that has led to a completely content free rambling "winning" the collegiate debate a few years ago.

You'd have a point if the OP is based on disinterested information instead of a video posted by the "victim that starts half way through the debate.

 

[thebeave]

Yeah, its a bit ridiculous how much attention a bunch of random, nobody high school kids are getting just for a frickin' debate. I mean, geez, next thing you know a bunch of high school kids from Bumfuck, Kentucky are going to make the national news for just standing around and grinning on a field trip to the nation's capital.