Renewable energy becoming economically competitive -- the New York Times

[lpetrich]

Solar and Wind Energy Start to Win on Price vs. Conventional Fuels - NYTimes.com

The cost of providing electricity from wind and solar power plants has plummeted over the last five years, so much so that in some markets renewable generation is now cheaper than coal or natural gas.

Utility executives say the trend has accelerated this year, with several companies signing contracts, known as power purchase agreements, for solar or wind at prices below that of natural gas, especially in the Great Plains and Southwest, where wind and sunlight are abundant.

Those prices were made possible by generous subsidies that could soon diminish or expire, but recent analyses show that even without those subsidies, alternative energies can often compete with traditional sources.

From a study by investment banking firm Lazard:

What	Cost (cents/kWh)
Solar	5.6
Solar (no subsidy)	7.2
Wind	1.4
Wind (no subsidy)	3.7
Natural Gas	6.1
Coal	6.6

This is utility-scale solar.

A big problem for wind and solar is that they are not dispatchable -- one has to use it when the wind is blowing and the Sun is not obstructed. The article did not mention the issue of storage, something that will help get around that problem.

Supporters of wind and solar want to keep subsidies and tax credits going for them, but I think that they ought to accept eventually phasing them out. That will put them in a much better position to attack fossil-fuel subsidies.

 

[TV and credit cards]

Five years this took. I can only imagine where the world may be were it not for the political obstructions. Really, if they would let the technology bloom, I do not see the need for centralized power generation and a grid, at least not on the scale we have today. Further, this would negate the concerns over large scale cyber attacks on that grid.

Solar energy can be stored in molten salt. Called an Andasol Plant, they use a molten salt/water heat exchanger to produce steam at night. Scientific American has numerous articles on renewables. Here's a good jumping off point if you'd like to read more: SA Solar Article

I believe we have past the tipping point on renewables. My concern now lies in the politics of it, particularly the obstructions to allowing the individual homeowner produce their own power. More than just taking away incentives, the utilities want a surcharge for grid upkeep.
But the politics of it are inappropriate here so I'll sully your thread no more.

 

[Juma]

Who is preventing homeowners to generate their own power???

 

[TV and credit cards]

Who is preventing homeowners to generate their own power???

Some cities have ordinances that they can only be on the portion of the roof facing the back of the house. There is permission from the power utility. Permits from the city. Not outright preventing but placing enough of a burden to make most homeowners give up on the idea.
The article I linked speaks of the utilities and their grid maintenance surcharge.

 

[NobleSavage]

Five years this took. I can only imagine where the world may be were it not for the political obstructions. Really, if they would let the technology bloom, I do not see the need for centralized power generation and a grid, at least not on the scale we have today. Further, this would negate the concerns over large scale cyber attacks on that grid.

Solar energy can be stored in molten salt. Called an Andasol Plant, they use a molten salt/water heat exchanger to produce steam at night. Scientific American has numerous articles on renewables. Here's a good jumping off point if you'd like to read more: SA Solar Article

I believe we have past the tipping point on renewables. My concern now lies in the politics of it, particularly the obstructions to allowing the individual homeowner produce their own power. More than just taking away incentives, the utilities want a surcharge for grid upkeep.
But the politics of it are inappropriate here so I'll sully your thread no more.

There is also pumped storage. We have a big one in my state. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pumped-storage_hydroelectricity

Pumped storage is the largest-capacity form of grid energy storage available, and, as of March 2012, the Electric Power Research Institute (EPRI) reports that PSH accounts for more than 99% of bulk storage capacity worldwide, representing around 127,000 MW.[1] PSH reported energy efficiency varies in practice between 70% and 80%,[1][2][3][4] with some claiming up to 87%

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

I heard somewhere that batteries the size of trucks are under development - not on paper but actually being produced. These would be great for people off the grid who do solar or wind. And of course people on the grid would benefit as well.

 

[NobleSavage]

I heard somewhere that batteries the size of trucks are under development - not on paper but actually being produced. These would be great for people off the grid who do solar or wind. And of course people on the grid would benefit as well.

Just wire a ton of small batteries together in parallel...Boom big battery. That's basically all Tesla does. It' gonna be EXPENSIVE though.