The Brian Schweitzer for Pres thread

[NobleSavage]

I really like this guy and I think he could beat Hilary. I've been seeing him more and more on cable news giving his opinion on various things.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brian_Schweitzer

 

[wufwugy]

Hillary's team when the Schweitzman announces his candidacy

Hillary's team after the Schweitzman gains on her like Obama did

The Schweitzman riding into their first debate

Hillary after the Schweitzman wins the first debate

Hillary goes to the media, saying she's being bullied

The media sinking their teeth into it

Nobody cares

Hillary's team prepping for the second debate

But the Schweitzman smokes her even harder

Hillary finally breaks down

The Schweitzman lets her go peacefully

The country says goodbye to the presidency that never was

 

[Cheerful Charlie]

In an interview on Democracy Now today, Bernie Sanders has announced he is considering running.

http://www.thenation.com/blog/178717/bernie-sanders-i-am-prepared-run-president-united-states#

 

[NobleSavage]

In an interview on Democracy Now today, Bernie Sanders has announced he is considering running.

http://www.thenation.com/blog/178717/bernie-sanders-i-am-prepared-run-president-united-states#

As much as I like Sanders I don't consider him to be much of a real contender.

 

[boneyard bill]

Hillary's team when the Schweitzman announces his candidacy

Hillary's team after the Schweitzman gains on her like Obama did

The Schweitzman riding into their first debate

Hillary after the Schweitzman wins the first debate

Hillary goes to the media, saying she's being bullied

The media sinking their teeth into it

Nobody cares

Hillary's team prepping for the second debate

But the Schweitzman smokes her even harder

Hillary finally breaks down

The Schweitzman lets her go peacefully

The country says goodbye to the presidency that never was

Too bad Schweitzman isn't running. How do you think Sweitzer will do?

 

[wufwugy]

Too bad Schweitzman isn't running. How do you think Sweitzer will do?

Probably as well as Sweazter would do

 

[boneyard bill]

As much as I like Sanders I don't consider him to be much of a real contender.

And you think Schweitzer is? Who ever heard of him outside of Montana? At least they've heard of Bernie Sanders in New Hampshire and Massachusetts. And what is he going to do for money? Do you think Hillary will even bother to debate him?

I Hillary doesn't run, then there might be a slim chance for him against Joe Biden.

 

[wufwugy]

Those who don't realize Obama was as unknown at this point are doomed to repeat the same mistake

There will always be a primary. It doesn't matter how unknown the contender is because he'll become fully known eventually

 

[boneyard bill]

Those who don't realize Obama was as unknown at this point are doomed to repeat the same mistake

There will always be a primary. It doesn't matter how unknown the contender is because he'll become fully known eventually

But Obama WASN'T unknown. He was being mentioned as a possible presidential candidate from the time he gave the keynote speech at the Democrat convention in '04 when he was still a State Senator. Hillary had ducked the '04 race so her inevitability was not widely accepted like it is today. And Obama was elected from the state of Illinois which gave him a considerably larger head state in electoral votes than Schweitzer will get from Montana. More importantly, Obama was immediately able to tap into big money contributors.

 

[NobleSavage]

And you think Schweitzer is? Who ever heard of him outside of Montana? At least they've heard of Bernie Sanders in New Hampshire and Massachusetts. And what is he going to do for money? Do you think Hillary will even bother to debate him?

I Hillary doesn't run, then there might be a slim chance for him against Joe Biden.

The problem I see with Sanders is that he has aligned himself with the word "socialist".

 

[ksen]

And that he's about 300 years old.

 

[Derec]

And you think Schweitzer is? Who ever heard of him outside of Montana? At least they've heard of Bernie Sanders in New Hampshire and Massachusetts. And what is he going to do for money? Do you think Hillary will even bother to debate him?

How well known was Bill Clinton in April 1990 outside of Arkansas? Face it, at this point Hillary is much more like Bush 41 than Bill Clinton.

I Hillary doesn't run, then there might be a slim chance for him against Joe Biden.

Joe Biden is just a foil to make Hillary appear less ancient by comparison. If Hillary doesn't run there is no reason for Joe to run either. It's not like he'd do any better than in 2008.

 

[Cheerful Charlie]

And that he's about 300 years old.

He's 72. Reagan was 69 when he was elected in 1980.

 

[boneyard bill]

How well known was Bill Clinton in April 1990 outside of Arkansas? Face it, at this point Hillary is much more like Bush 41 than Bill Clinton.


Joe Biden is just a foil to make Hillary appear less ancient by comparison. If Hillary doesn't run there is no reason for Joe to run either. It's not like he'd do any better than in 2008.

Bill Clinton was as well known as his competitors in 1992. They were called the "six pack" by the media because no one had heard of any of them.

Biden will have been VP for eight years. He's spent most of that time on the "cold pea and rubber chicken" circuit giving speeches and helping local and state parties raise money. He has way more contacts around the country and way more contacts with establishment people as well than he had in '08. That's why VP's are usually good prospects to win their party's nomination.

 

[Derec]

Bill Clinton was as well known as his competitors in 1992. They were called the "six pack" by the media because no one had heard of any of them.

I said 1990. It's 2014 still. Besides, there has been talk about Schweitzer as a dark horse for a while now, so he is not quite as obscure as you imply.

Biden will have been VP for eight years. He's spent most of that time on the "cold pea and rubber chicken" circuit giving speeches and helping local and state parties raise money. He has way more contacts around the country and way more contacts with establishment people as well than he had in '08. That's why VP's are usually good prospects to win their party's nomination.

Last VP to be nominated by their party was Al Gore in 2000, when he was 52. Last man elected president who was VP before was the elder Bush in 1988 and he was 64. Furthermore, Al Gore mounted a formidable presidential campaign of his own in 1988 coming 3rd overall carrying 7 states and 13.5% of the popular vote. Likewise, elder Bush ran in 1980 finishing second with 6 states and 24% of the vote. Contrary to that when Joe Biden ran in 1988 (shows just how over the hill he is!) he withdrew due to a plagiarism scandal. When he ran again in 2008 he withdrew after Iowa because he got less than 1%. In other words, he has no independent appeal and the VP stint will not miraculously conjure it up either and neither will rubber chicken dinners. Besides, he is really really old.

 

[Derec]

He's 72. Reagan was 69 when he was elected in 1980.

Which would make him 74 in 2016, 2 years older than even McCain and full five years older than Reagan.
And Reagan was the very oldest person elected president. There have only been three presidents that were "senior citizens" (>=65) at their first inauguration - Ronald Reagan (almost 70), William Henry Harrison (68, died a month after inauguration) and James Buchanan (almost 66), with elder Bush being an honorable mention at 64 and a half. So really only 1 in the last century and two in mid 19th century.

I do not get this obsession with old candidates for Democrats. We have "heiress apparent" Hillary (69), Joe Biden (73) and now Sanders (74). I heard Jerry Brown (78) and John Kerry (72) being mentioned as well. Very uncharacteristic for the party who gave us Obama (47), (Bill) Clinton (46) and Kennedy (43).

 

[boneyard bill]

I said 1990. It's 2014 still. Besides, there has been talk about Schweitzer as a dark horse for a while now, so he is not quite as obscure as you imply.

Last VP to be nominated by their party was Al Gore in 2000, when he was 52. Last man elected president who was VP before was the elder Bush in 1988 and he was 64. Furthermore, Al Gore mounted a formidable presidential campaign of his own in 1988 coming 3rd overall carrying 7 states and 13.5% of the popular vote. Likewise, elder Bush ran in 1980 finishing second with 6 states and 24% of the vote. Contrary to that when Joe Biden ran in 1988 (shows just how over the hill he is!) he withdrew due to a plagiarism scandal. When he ran again in 2008 he withdrew after Iowa because he got less than 1%. In other words, he has no independent appeal and the VP stint will not miraculously conjure it up either and neither will rubber chicken dinners. Besides, he is really really old.

Oh, I'm not a big fan of Joe Biden. Still, the Vice-Presidency comes equipped with a lot of advantages. Sometimes, though, certain candidates don't have the capacity to capitalize on those advantage (e.g. Dan Quayle), and I'll readily concede that Biden might be in that category. I thought he was a puzzling choice for Obama in the first place.

Nonetheless, he has many advantages over Schweitzer. In my view, Schweitzer's best chance would be if we have an economic melt-down before 2016. And frankly, I think we will. If that happens then fringe candidates will suddenly become more acceptable. People will be looking for someone who seems to have answers, and the business-as-usual guys will be seen to have NOT had the answers. So some of Schweitzer's more populist ideas might go over. But then again, he will face competition from a lot of people in that category.

 

[boneyard bill]

Which would make him 74 in 2016, 2 years older than even McCain and full five years older than Reagan.
And Reagan was the very oldest person elected president. There have only been three presidents that were "senior citizens" (>=65) at their first inauguration - Ronald Reagan (almost 70), William Henry Harrison (68, died a month after inauguration) and James Buchanan (almost 66), with elder Bush being an honorable mention at 64 and a half. So really only 1 in the last century and two in mid 19th century.

I do not get this obsession with old candidates for Democrats. We have "heiress apparent" Hillary (69), Joe Biden (73) and now Sanders (74). I heard Jerry Brown (78) and John Kerry (72) being mentioned as well. Very uncharacteristic for the party who gave us Obama (47), (Bill) Clinton (46) and Kennedy (43).

That's the problem with being in power. The old guys get all the attention. After eight years of Reagan, Republicans gave us George H.W. Bush and Bob Dole. Now Republicans have the young guys with Rand Paul, Marco Rubio, Ted Cruz, and Paul Ryan all in their forties. Of course, there's still Jeb Bush and Mike Huckabee who are a bit older.

It's time for the old folks to get out of the way, and let a new generation take over. But it may take the Dems a little longer because all their old guys have the attention-getting jobs.

 

[Derec]

Oh, I'm not a big fan of Joe Biden. Still, the Vice-Presidency comes equipped with a lot of advantages. Sometimes, though, certain candidates don't have the capacity to capitalize on those advantage (e.g. Dan Quayle), and I'll readily concede that Biden might be in that category. I thought he was a puzzling choice for Obama in the first place.

I agree he was a puzzling choice - I did not see him as bringing much to the table.
I think you are overestimating the power of the vice-presidency. I mean sure, it can help the right guy over the top like Gore or elder Bush. But with these two you are already back 20+ years and going back further you get Mondale (lost), Ford (ascended due to resignation), Johnson (ascended due to death) and Nixon (lost then won 8 years later) and you are already back in the 50s. 6 VP candidates in 60 years and only 2 won outright.

Nonetheless, he has many advantages over Schweitzer.

Like what? As I said, he has no independent appeal. Dropped due to scandal in 88 before the primaries, dropped after Iowa in 08 because he got 0.9% of the vote. And that is before he became ancient. He is very much comparable to Dick Cheney as far as electoral chances are concerned.

In my view, Schweitzer's best chance would be if we have an economic melt-down before 2016. And frankly, I think we will. If that happens then fringe candidates will suddenly become more acceptable. People will be looking for someone who seems to have answers, and the business-as-usual guys will be seen to have NOT had the answers. So some of Schweitzer's more populist ideas might go over. But then again, he will face competition from a lot of people in that category.

I think there will be a lot of competition in the primaries and I think there is a strong likelihood someone new, a fresh face, will be nominated. An economic meltdown would favor Republicans so much they could nominate Jesus H. Christ and still lose. Likewise I do not think anything like that is necessary for someone like Schweitzer to emerge. For example Keystone XL is popular and Schweitzer has been supportive of it for a long time, while Hillary failed to approve it white SecState.

 

[Derec]

That's the problem with being in power. The old guys get all the attention. After eight years of Reagan, Republicans gave us George H.W. Bush and Bob Dole. Now Republicans have the young guys with Rand Paul, Marco Rubio, Ted Cruz, and Paul Ryan all in their forties. Of course, there's still Jeb Bush and Mike Huckabee who are a bit older.

It's time for the old folks to get out of the way, and let a new generation take over. But it may take the Dems a little longer because all their old guys have the attention-getting jobs.

I do not think this tells the whole story. HW was not just vice president but also came second in 1980 primaries and thus was a logical next in line - something Republicans love (Romney, McCain, Reagan etc. all came second in previous primaries). He was also 64 and thus not quite as old as choices being pushed right now. Dole's 1996 nomination was more like 2004 Kerry nomination where they challenged a relatively popular sitting president.
It's not like Democrats do not have younger talent, it;s that media is pushing has-beens. I still think this is part of making Hillary more attractive by comparison.