http://www.politico.com/story/2014/04/american-troops-eastern-europe-ukraine-russia-105910.html
What could possibly go wrong?
What could possibly go wrong?
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Features
U.S. sending troops to Eastern Europe
- Thread starter ksen
- Start date
Besides the crap that the governments are doing, on the ground there is a real divide in Ukraine between people that think of themselves as Russian and those that think of themselves as Ukranian. We agitate, they agitate, but the base fact is there is Something There to Agitate with.
It's like if all the Republicans Moved to South and North Carolina and then decided to secede....oh wait....
Or all the pot heads moved to Colorado and then decided ....to do nothing : )
It's like if all the Republicans Moved to South and North Carolina and then decided to secede....oh wait....
Or all the pot heads moved to Colorado and then decided ....to do nothing : )
Obama tried an approach ofreconciliation with Putin and got played over canceling the EastEuropean missile defense system. It was worth the try.
Moving troops and planes into theBaltic NATO states is the right thing to do.
Putin can make similar historicalclaims to other areas as with Crimea.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithuania
'...Poland and Russia were theterritories of the Grand Duchy. With the Lublin Union of 1569,Lithuania and Poland formed a voluntary two-state union, thePolish–Lithuanian Commonwealth. The Commonwealth lasted more thantwo centuries, until neighboring countries systematically dismantledit from 1772–95, with the Russian Empire annexing most ofLithuania's territory....
As World War I neared its end,Lithuania's Act of Independence was signed on 16 February 1918,declaring the establishment of a sovereign State of Lithuania.Starting in 1940, Lithuania was occupied first by the Soviet Unionand then by Nazi Germany. As World War II neared its end in 1944 andthe Germans retreated, the Soviet Union reoccupied Lithuania. On 11March 1990, a year before formal break-up of the Soviet Union,Lithuania became the first Soviet republic to declare the restorationof independent State of Lithuania....
Several sizable minorities exist, suchas Poles (6.6%), Russians (5.8%), Belarusians (1.2%) and Ukrainians(0.5%).[1]...'
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poland
'...The Commonwealth gradually ceasedto exist in the years 1772–1795, when the Polish territory waspartitioned among Prussia, the Russian Empire, and Austria. Polandregained its independence (as the Second Polish Republic) at the endof World War I, in 1918.
Two decades later, in September 1939,World War II started with the invasions of Poland by Nazi Germany andthe Soviet Union (as part of the Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact). Morethan six million Polish citizens died in the war.[11][12][13][14] In1944, a Soviet-backed Polish provisional government was formed,which, after a period of conflict, falsified referendum andelections, has given rise to a satellite state[15] of the SovietUnion, Polish Republic (Rzeczpospolita Polska), renamed to thePeople's Republic of Poland (Polska Rzeczpospolita Ludowa) in 1952.During the Revolutions of 1989, Poland's Marxist-Leninist governmentwas overthrown and Poland adopted a new constitution establishingitself as a democracy under the name Rzeczpospolita Polska, oftenreferred to as the "Third Polish Republic" (IIIRzeczpospolita)....
The Sanacja movement controlled Polanduntil the start of World War II in 1939, when Nazi Germany's andSlovakia Invasion of Poland (1939) on 1 September and the Sovietinvasion of Poland on 17 September, which followed the breaking ofthe Soviet–Polish Non-Aggression Pact, occurred. Warsaw capitulatedon 28 September 1939. As agreed in the Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact,Poland was split into two zones, one occupied by Nazi Germany whilethe Kresy, or Borderlands, fell under the control of the SovietUnion. In 1939–1941, the Soviets had moved hundreds of thousands ofPoles across the Soviet Union, and the Soviet secret police, NKVD,had executed thousands of Polish prisoners of war (inter alia Katynmassacre)...
The explicit rhetoric from Russia wouldsay they are just waiting for the right incident to move into Ukrainein force. A repeat of Georgia.
Putin clearly stated he thought thefailure of the Soviets was the greatest tradgey of the century. Putinis a nationalist and a product of the Soviet system.
I'd say the Poles and Lithuanians dohave valid fears.
What could go wrong? At this point notpresenting a sufficient military deterrent to Putin such that hethinks twice about his next move.
Moving troops and planes into theBaltic NATO states is the right thing to do.
Putin can make similar historicalclaims to other areas as with Crimea.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lithuania
'...Poland and Russia were theterritories of the Grand Duchy. With the Lublin Union of 1569,Lithuania and Poland formed a voluntary two-state union, thePolish–Lithuanian Commonwealth. The Commonwealth lasted more thantwo centuries, until neighboring countries systematically dismantledit from 1772–95, with the Russian Empire annexing most ofLithuania's territory....
As World War I neared its end,Lithuania's Act of Independence was signed on 16 February 1918,declaring the establishment of a sovereign State of Lithuania.Starting in 1940, Lithuania was occupied first by the Soviet Unionand then by Nazi Germany. As World War II neared its end in 1944 andthe Germans retreated, the Soviet Union reoccupied Lithuania. On 11March 1990, a year before formal break-up of the Soviet Union,Lithuania became the first Soviet republic to declare the restorationof independent State of Lithuania....
Several sizable minorities exist, suchas Poles (6.6%), Russians (5.8%), Belarusians (1.2%) and Ukrainians(0.5%).[1]...'
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poland
'...The Commonwealth gradually ceasedto exist in the years 1772–1795, when the Polish territory waspartitioned among Prussia, the Russian Empire, and Austria. Polandregained its independence (as the Second Polish Republic) at the endof World War I, in 1918.
Two decades later, in September 1939,World War II started with the invasions of Poland by Nazi Germany andthe Soviet Union (as part of the Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact). Morethan six million Polish citizens died in the war.[11][12][13][14] In1944, a Soviet-backed Polish provisional government was formed,which, after a period of conflict, falsified referendum andelections, has given rise to a satellite state[15] of the SovietUnion, Polish Republic (Rzeczpospolita Polska), renamed to thePeople's Republic of Poland (Polska Rzeczpospolita Ludowa) in 1952.During the Revolutions of 1989, Poland's Marxist-Leninist governmentwas overthrown and Poland adopted a new constitution establishingitself as a democracy under the name Rzeczpospolita Polska, oftenreferred to as the "Third Polish Republic" (IIIRzeczpospolita)....
The Sanacja movement controlled Polanduntil the start of World War II in 1939, when Nazi Germany's andSlovakia Invasion of Poland (1939) on 1 September and the Sovietinvasion of Poland on 17 September, which followed the breaking ofthe Soviet–Polish Non-Aggression Pact, occurred. Warsaw capitulatedon 28 September 1939. As agreed in the Molotov–Ribbentrop Pact,Poland was split into two zones, one occupied by Nazi Germany whilethe Kresy, or Borderlands, fell under the control of the SovietUnion. In 1939–1941, the Soviets had moved hundreds of thousands ofPoles across the Soviet Union, and the Soviet secret police, NKVD,had executed thousands of Polish prisoners of war (inter alia Katynmassacre)...
The explicit rhetoric from Russia wouldsay they are just waiting for the right incident to move into Ukrainein force. A repeat of Georgia.
Putin clearly stated he thought thefailure of the Soviets was the greatest tradgey of the century. Putinis a nationalist and a product of the Soviet system.
I'd say the Poles and Lithuanians dohave valid fears.
What could go wrong? At this point notpresenting a sufficient military deterrent to Putin such that hethinks twice about his next move.
dystopian
Veteran Member
600 troops isn't going to cut it, though.
I *do* think it's possible that Putin is actually crazy enough to try the whole thing again; first in eastern ukraine or transnistria, and then who knows where. He's basically been shown that he can get away with it. Whether he's crazy enough to try the same thing with a member of NATO or the EU though, is a very different matter. Unless the conflict goes nuclear, there's no way in hell Russia could win against the EU, much less the whole of NATO. Surely he must know this. Then again, he might seriously believe that he could force the west around the negotiating table if he strikes fast enough for them to counter a landgrab in a EU/NATO country.
I *do* think it's possible that Putin is actually crazy enough to try the whole thing again; first in eastern ukraine or transnistria, and then who knows where. He's basically been shown that he can get away with it. Whether he's crazy enough to try the same thing with a member of NATO or the EU though, is a very different matter. Unless the conflict goes nuclear, there's no way in hell Russia could win against the EU, much less the whole of NATO. Surely he must know this. Then again, he might seriously believe that he could force the west around the negotiating table if he strikes fast enough for them to counter a landgrab in a EU/NATO country.