Is the frame "Income Inequality" gonna fly?

[dismal]

Costco argues you can. But it requires competitors pay less than Costco.

Still not getting your point. No one has argued that companies can't differentiate themselves by paying higher wages than their competitors.

You actually don't understand why the strategy of getting better employees by paying more than others is not something everyone can do?

Think about it for a while.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

Still not getting your point. No one has argued that companies can't differentiate themselves by paying higher wages than their competitors.

You actually don't understand why the strategy of getting better employees by paying more than others is not something everyone can do?

Think about it for a while.

Can WalMart do it?

 

[ksen]

Still not getting your point. No one has argued that companies can't differentiate themselves by paying higher wages than their competitors.

You actually don't understand why the strategy of getting better employees by paying more than others is not something everyone can do?

Think about it for a while.

Ok, I get what you're saying now.

As long as the employees are making enough to live on I don't care if companies can use higher wages to differentiate themselves. They'll have to figure out another way.

 

[Canard DuJour]

I'm glad you have finally seen the beauty of the Labor Theory of Value.

The problem with the labor theory of value is that it puts the cart before the horse.

The labor that goes into something says nothing about it's value. The labor that goes into something says what it's minimum price will be. Absent a monopoly the market will force the price down to this value + a reasonable profit margin.

That is entirely compatible with most LTOVs including Marx's. None put cart before horse in the way you imagine.

The big difference is that Marx ignores the demand side of things--if the price people are willing to pay for it is less than the cost to produce the price doesn't come down, the product simply isn't on the market, or is only on the market as a specialty item for those few willing to pay the cost.

Nope, nothing to do with Marx - as a fair few here will have read enough to know.

 

[dismal]

You actually don't understand why the strategy of getting better employees by paying more than others is not something everyone can do?

Think about it for a while.

Ok, I get what you're saying now.

As long as the employees are making enough to live on I don't care if companies can use higher wages to differentiate themselves. They'll have to figure out another way.

OK, but the point still is that you can't bring up what Costco does implying everyone can do it because the reason Costco does it is to gain an advantage over those who do not do it.

- - - Updated - - -

You actually don't understand why the strategy of getting better employees by paying more than others is not something everyone can do?

Think about it for a while.

Can WalMart do it?

Walmart has a different strategy. They appeal to a different customer.

 

[ksen]

Ok, I get what you're saying now.

As long as the employees are making enough to live on I don't care if companies can use higher wages to differentiate themselves. They'll have to figure out another way.

OK, but the point still is that you can't bring up what Costco does implying everyone can do it because the reason Costco does it is to gain an advantage over those who do not do it.

I don't think I brought up Costco's wage/salary policies as an example of how they can differentiate themselves from their competitors. My point was that big retailers don't have to pay rock bottom wages to remain competitive and profitable.

You, or someone else, brought up that Costco's customers and markets are more upscale than Walmart's normal customers and markets therefore Costco can afford to pay its employees more. But that ignores 1) Costco's margin, posted by Axulus earlier, is 2 percentage points lower than Walmarts and it is still a successful business, and 2) Walmart has recently announced it is raising it's payscale for the bottom tier employees by a significant amount. So it appears the different scale of clients and markets weren't the real reason Walmart was paying unlivable wages.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

Ok, I get what you're saying now.

As long as the employees are making enough to live on I don't care if companies can use higher wages to differentiate themselves. They'll have to figure out another way.

OK, but the point still is that you can't bring up what Costco does implying everyone can do it because the reason Costco does it is to gain an advantage over those who do not do it.

- - - Updated - - -

You actually don't understand why the strategy of getting better employees by paying more than others is not something everyone can do?

Think about it for a while.

Can WalMart do it?

Walmart has a different strategy. They appeal to a different customer.

I know WalMart has a different strategy. That's why I asked can they do it instead of stating that they do it. Can they do it? Do they make enough money to compensate that their employees better?

 

[ronburgundy]

I'm not sure the Dems are gonna do themselves any favors pushing income inequality or class warfare.
.,
Here are the gallop numbers http://www.gallup.com/poll/1675/most-important-problem.aspx

The gap between the rich and poor is only important to 3%, up from 2%.

Can this dog hunt?

3% is as high or higher than 45 of the 55 specific issues on those lists, including crime, taxes, race relations, foreign policy, wars, and most specific issues that both parties spend lots of time talking about.

Also, those numbers are only the % who spontaneously mention that specific topic when asked about "the most important problem". Many more than 3% care about it enough for it to be worth talking about.

OTOH, it wouldn't surprise me if most Americans don't understand how income inequality greatly impacts many of the other economic and social issues they claim to care about from corporate corruption, pollution, and wars, to crime and the deficit. However, that only means it needs to be talked about more in relation to all the things people care about, in particular that income inequality = political power inequality = policies that are harmful to all but the rich.

 

[ZiprHead]

OK, but the point still is that you can't bring up what Costco does implying everyone can do it because the reason Costco does it is to gain an advantage over those who do not do it.

I don't think I brought up Costco's wage/salary policies as an example of how they can differentiate themselves from their competitors. My point was that big retailers don't have to pay rock bottom wages to remain competitive and profitable.

You, or someone else, brought up that Costco's customers and markets are more upscale than Walmart's normal customers and markets therefore Costco can afford to pay its employees more. But that ignores 1) Costco's margin, posted by Axulus earlier, is 2 percentage points lower than Walmarts and it is still a successful business, and 2) Walmart has recently announced it is raising it's payscale for the bottom tier employees by a significant amount. So it appears the different scale of clients and markets weren't the real reason Walmart was paying unlivable wages.

I don't think Walmart and Costco are comparable. WalMart and Sam's Club would be comparable.

 

[dismal]

OK, but the point still is that you can't bring up what Costco does implying everyone can do it because the reason Costco does it is to gain an advantage over those who do not do it.

I don't think I brought up Costco's wage/salary policies as an example of how they can differentiate themselves from their competitors. My point was that big retailers don't have to pay rock bottom wages to remain competitive and profitable.

You, or someone else, brought up that Costco's customers and markets are more upscale than Walmart's normal customers and markets therefore Costco can afford to pay its employees more. But that ignores 1) Costco's margin, posted by Axulus earlier, is 2 percentage points lower than Walmarts and it is still a successful business, and 2) Walmart has recently announced it is raising it's payscale for the bottom tier employees by a significant amount. So it appears the different scale of clients and markets weren't the real reason Walmart was paying unlivable wages.

I thought we had made some progress. Maybe not.

Paying more than the completion as a strategy can work because you can get some benefits from paying more.

Not everyone can pay more than their competitors. (this is tautological)

Not everyone pursues the same strategy. Some target customers interested in the lowest possible price and tolerate the consequences that come along with paying their employees less.

 

[ksen]

I don't think I brought up Costco's wage/salary policies as an example of how they can differentiate themselves from their competitors. My point was that big retailers don't have to pay rock bottom wages to remain competitive and profitable.

You, or someone else, brought up that Costco's customers and markets are more upscale than Walmart's normal customers and markets therefore Costco can afford to pay its employees more. But that ignores 1) Costco's margin, posted by Axulus earlier, is 2 percentage points lower than Walmarts and it is still a successful business, and 2) Walmart has recently announced it is raising it's payscale for the bottom tier employees by a significant amount. So it appears the different scale of clients and markets weren't the real reason Walmart was paying unlivable wages.

I don't think Walmart and Costco are comparable. WalMart and Sam's Club would be comparable.

Walmart and Sam's Club are owned by the same parent company so I don't see how that would be useful at all.

- - - Updated - - -

I don't think I brought up Costco's wage/salary policies as an example of how they can differentiate themselves from their competitors. My point was that big retailers don't have to pay rock bottom wages to remain competitive and profitable.

You, or someone else, brought up that Costco's customers and markets are more upscale than Walmart's normal customers and markets therefore Costco can afford to pay its employees more. But that ignores 1) Costco's margin, posted by Axulus earlier, is 2 percentage points lower than Walmarts and it is still a successful business, and 2) Walmart has recently announced it is raising it's payscale for the bottom tier employees by a significant amount. So it appears the different scale of clients and markets weren't the real reason Walmart was paying unlivable wages.

I thought we had made some progress. Maybe not.

Well, then you should try harder to keep up.

Paying more than the completion as a strategy can work because you can get some benefits from paying more.

Not everyone can pay more than their competitors. (this is tautological)

Not everyone pursues the same strategy. Some target customers interested in the lowest possible price and tolerate the consequences that come along with paying their employees less.

And?

 

[dismal]

OK, but the point still is that you can't bring up what Costco does implying everyone can do it because the reason Costco does it is to gain an advantage over those who do not do it.

- - - Updated - - -

You actually don't understand why the strategy of getting better employees by paying more than others is not something everyone can do?

Think about it for a while.

Can WalMart do it?

Walmart has a different strategy. They appeal to a different customer.

I know WalMart has a different strategy. That's why I asked can they do it instead of stating that they do it. Can they do it? Do they make enough money to compensate that their employees better?

They could but as I understand it they are attempting to maximize their profits.

 

[Crazy Eddie]

Sure, stripping them of dignity and paying all that welfare is expensive and hard work relative to a more livable wage, but I don't want to spend $2 on a hamburger.

Am I to understand you live in a place where hamburgers cost less than $2???

 

[AthenaAwakened]

OK, but the point still is that you can't bring up what Costco does implying everyone can do it because the reason Costco does it is to gain an advantage over those who do not do it.

- - - Updated - - -

You actually don't understand why the strategy of getting better employees by paying more than others is not something everyone can do?

Think about it for a while.

Can WalMart do it?

Walmart has a different strategy. They appeal to a different customer.

I know WalMart has a different strategy. That's why I asked can they do it instead of stating that they do it. Can they do it? Do they make enough money to compensate that their employees better?

They could but as I understand it they are attempting to maximize their profits.

so why are they raising wages across all US store to a base of $9? Could paying people more actually increase profits?

 

[dismal]

OK, but the point still is that you can't bring up what Costco does implying everyone can do it because the reason Costco does it is to gain an advantage over those who do not do it.

- - - Updated - - -

You actually don't understand why the strategy of getting better employees by paying more than others is not something everyone can do?

Think about it for a while.

Can WalMart do it?

Walmart has a different strategy. They appeal to a different customer.

I know WalMart has a different strategy. That's why I asked can they do it instead of stating that they do it. Can they do it? Do they make enough money to compensate that their employees better?

They could but as I understand it they are attempting to maximize their profits.

so why are they raising wages across all US store to a base of $9? Could paying people more actually increase profits?

It can, yes. Particularly if you can't attract and retain enough people at something less. This is why a tiny percentage of jobs pay minimum wage, you know.

 

[KeepTalking]

Sure, stripping them of dignity and paying all that welfare is expensive and hard work relative to a more livable wage, but I don't want to spend $2 on a hamburger.

Am I to understand you live in a place where hamburgers cost less than $2???

As long as he lives near a McDonalds (and who doesn't?), cheeseburgers are on the $1 menu. It is one of the crappiest cheeseburgers you can imagine, but still less than $2.

 

[ksen]

This is why a tiny percentage of jobs pay minimum wage, you know.

How tiny of a percentage? I'm curious because in raising the MW threads I hear all sorts of talk about how raising the wages for this tiny percentage of workers will lead to massive job losses and business closings.

 

[Axulus]

This is why a tiny percentage of jobs pay minimum wage, you know.

How tiny of a percentage? I'm curious because in raising the MW threads I hear all sorts of talk about how raising the wages for this tiny percentage of workers will lead to massive job losses and business closings.

Job losses for those subject to the minimum wage (the very people the law is intended to help) - not massive losses for the economy as a whole.

 

[ksen]

What about the businesses closing part?

 

[dismal]

This is why a tiny percentage of jobs pay minimum wage, you know.

How tiny of a percentage? I'm curious because in raising the MW threads I hear all sorts of talk about how raising the wages for this tiny percentage of workers will lead to massive job losses and business closings.

I think it used to be around 2% but going up some with the minimum wage increases of late. You'll have to sort through the problems of what your imagination does to your recollections of minimum wage discussions on your own.