Atlanta-area police shoot dead unarmed, naked African-American man

[Jarhyn]

I suggest we wait for the outcome of the investigation. It may be justified or unjustified based on exact circumstances. What is undeniable is that crazy naked people can still pose a threat. Just look at that berserker naked guy in that surveillance video.

Posing a "threat" is not the same as posing an imminent lethal threat. But, I'll wait for the investigation when all the copophiles and racists stop automatically defending the gunning down of unarmed black people and smearing the victim before the relevant facts come in.

I wouldn't call myself a copophile, but I do think that "at least doing a slightly better job of keeping the peace is a good enough expectation for cops". That said, a cop who shoots a naked, unarmed guy instead of using his nightstick or a taser, or grappling or any of the other hundreds of things he could have done that were not pulling out a gun and shooting are probably evidence enough that this cop needs either to find a new career path or get some serious retraining. Possibly within a designated correctional facility. Probably, even. Either way, it's unacceptance behavior.

And I say it the way I do because retributive 'justice' is about as unethical as a thing can be.

 

[Nexus]

That said, a cop who shoots a naked, unarmed guy instead of using his nightstick or a taser, or grappling or any of the other hundreds of things he could have done that were not pulling out a gun and shooting are probably evidence enough that this cop needs either to find a new career path or get some serious retraining.

I wonder if our resident cop defenders ever question why bouncers aren't shooting 1000s of people a year to protect themselves from the violent people they deal with while on the job.

 

[Malintent]

Black cop shoots unarmed white male to death:
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news...ert-collar-killed-by-black-cop-trev/?page=all

Unarmed white male killed by black cop:
http://www.youngcons.com/unarmed-white-man-was-killed-by-a-black-cop-look-how-the-media-responds/

Yet another innocent white male gunned down by racist black copper:
http://www.westernjournalism.com/uh...ed-white-man-wheres-riot/#cyx2vIt3fH4ADVWF.97

Innocent White war hero shot dead by evil black cops:
http://www.texasgopvote.com/issues/...te-veteran-orange-tx-over-racial-slur-0057061

Black people are more racist and violent than white people, apparently. Media fears reporting of black on white killings due to social networking lash-back.

 

[laughing dog]

Black cop shoots unarmed white male to death:
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news...ert-collar-killed-by-black-cop-trev/?page=all

Unarmed white male killed by black cop:
http://www.youngcons.com/unarmed-white-man-was-killed-by-a-black-cop-look-how-the-media-responds/

Yet another innocent white male gunned down by racist black copper:
http://www.westernjournalism.com/uh...ed-white-man-wheres-riot/#cyx2vIt3fH4ADVWF.97

Innocent White war hero shot dead by evil black cops:
http://www.texasgopvote.com/issues/...te-veteran-orange-tx-over-racial-slur-0057061

Black people are more racist and violent than white people, apparently. Media fears reporting of black on white killings due to social networking lash-back.

<snip>

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

The race should only matter when it is a part of the problem. The first case cited appears to be another typical, quick to fire case.

The second case not quite as bad, but certainly doesn't look great. Third link is the same case.

Now the irony here is that this doesn't appear to be race related, ie why it isn't reported. Let's not forget that the white teenager who was shot by the white police officers is getting virtually no coverage either, and that has the cute white girl angle working for her. It seems people only take notice of police overstepping with violence if it involves blacks. Of which, we probably should be thankful. Police violence, regardless of race, is an issue.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Black cop shoots unarmed white male to death:
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news...ert-collar-killed-by-black-cop-trev/?page=all

Unarmed white male killed by black cop:
http://www.youngcons.com/unarmed-white-man-was-killed-by-a-black-cop-look-how-the-media-responds/

Yet another innocent white male gunned down by racist black copper:
http://www.westernjournalism.com/uh...ed-white-man-wheres-riot/#cyx2vIt3fH4ADVWF.97

Innocent White war hero shot dead by evil black cops:
http://www.texasgopvote.com/issues/...te-veteran-orange-tx-over-racial-slur-0057061

Black people are more racist and violent than white people, apparently. Media fears reporting of black on white killings due to social networking lash-back.

<snip>

What about the shooting in Texas, where the white teen female is shot by the white cops. They have the entire incident on tape. Yet the press coverage of that is hard to find as well. Seems white people are fine with people being shot by cops in general... or at least that is how the press seems to make it look.

 

[Derec]

Posing a "threat" is not the same as posing an imminent lethal threat.

Use of lethal force by cops does not require quite the "imminent lethal threat" threshold. But whether of not the legal threshold is met or not will be determined through the investigation.

But, I'll wait for the investigation when all the copophiles and racists stop automatically defending the gunning down of unarmed black people and smearing the victim before the relevant facts come in.

1. In other words, you are not willing to wait for the outcome of the investigation.
2. On the other hand, you are more than willing to label people who disagree as "racist".
3. Who is smearing him? Quoting his tweets to offer some explanation as to why this tragedy happened is not smearing.

 

[Derec]

The problem is virtually every shooting involving an officer ends up being "justified" by the police.

DeKalb is a majority black county run by a black CEO and a black chief of police (Cedric not the Entertainer). They are not very likely to cover up a white cop shooting a black guy if there is really some wrongdoing on the cop's part.

This stuff is becoming more and more public and the problem that has developed is that people simply aren't trusting them.

The problem is that hyperbolically every instance of police shooting somebody is being labeled as "murder" without waiting for the facts to come in and the dead person is hagiographied with labels like "gentle giant" etc. and history of criminal activity ignored.

Yeah, they can be trouble, which is why large burly men work at Hospitals for those inflicted with serious mental illness.

Not all cops are "large burly men". Also, these orderlies are specifically trained to deal with these types of patients and deal with them on the regular basis. They also function in a relatively controlled environment. Neither of these things applies to cops.
Now a case could be made that police officers need better training for dealing with mentally ill people. But that would make the problem more systemic and doesn't mean the cop in this instance committed an unlawful homicide. Of course, it doesn't mean he didn't either. Let's wait and see.

The question is, did the officer resort to the gun too quickly and compromise his own position. Were there other alternatives? The lack of injury to the officer indicates he wasn't in imminent danger to his life.

Neither police officers nor civilians for that matter are required to sustain injury before being allowed to respond with deadly force, although injuries can certainly bolster their case.

 

[Derec]

I'm with Howard Stern, "I wish I had a stereotype like that."

Might not be very accurate, at least not where it matters. From what I understand the racial difference in penis size is most pronounced with flaccid size and largely disappears when erect (i.e. more blacks are showers, more whites growers). Most heterosexual men encounter other men's penises at gym showers and the like and so tend to see other men when flaccid. And in porn of course, but that is hardly a representative sample...
Also such a stereotype sets up high expectations. Better to be a well hung Chinese man than a smallish black man.

But if the stereotype applies to Hill, I wonder if he is an organ donor.
South Africans perform first 'successful' penis transplant

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

DeKalb is a majority black county run by a black CEO and a black chief of police (Cedric not the Entertainer). They are not very likely to cover up a white cop shooting a black guy if there is really some wrongdoing on the cop's part.

Well there you have it.

This stuff is becoming more and more public and the problem that has developed is that people simply aren't trusting them.

The problem is that hyperbolically every instance of police shooting somebody is being labeled as "murder" without waiting for the facts to come in and the dead person is hagiographied with labels like "gentle giant" etc. and history of criminal activity ignored.

Great point! This is exactly the same level headed thinking that has helped get murder convictions of people innocent of the actual murder, but hell, they committed a crime in the past so it works logically.

Yeah, they can be trouble, which is why large burly men work at Hospitals for those inflicted with serious mental illness.

Not all cops are "large burly men".

Oh for fuck sakes.

Also, these orderlies are specifically trained to deal with these types of patients and deal with them on the regular basis. They also function in a relatively controlled environment. Neither of these things applies to cops.

Agreed. These officers weren't trained to do shit it seems.

Now a case could be made that police officers need better training for dealing with mentally ill people.

Add typical people to the list and I think that is a good start.

The question is, did the officer resort to the gun too quickly and compromise his own position. Were there other alternatives? The lack of injury to the officer indicates he wasn't in imminent danger to his life.

Neither police officers nor civilians for that matter are required to sustain injury before being allowed to respond with deadly force, although injuries can certainly bolster their case.

You apparently don't understand the actual role of an officer do you? But I'm glad you decided to indicate that civilians don't have to sustain injury before killing someone. Shot 'em all! Damned the torpedoes, set it on auto honey.

 

[laughing dog]

Use of lethal force by cops does not require quite the "imminent lethal threat" threshold.

It should.

1. In other words, you are not willing to wait for the outcome of the investigation.

That is not what I wrote.

2. On the other hand, you are more than willing to label people who disagree as "racist".

I am quite willing to point out racists who are racists. But not everyone who disagrees (whatever that means) is a racist. 2nd straw man in a row for you.

3. Who is smearing him? Quoting his tweets to offer some explanation as to why this tragedy happened is not smearing.

Unless those tweets occurred while the police officer was entering his abode, they offer no explanation as why this tragedy happened. Why don't you practice what you preach and wait for the investigation before you smear the victim?

 

[fast]

Training officers to do what it takes to go home at night is reasonable, and maybe that's why there is shoot to kill training, but the idea that prompts that mindset shouldn't be set in stone. Sure, if the suspect is shooting at you or if the suspect has a weapon with X-file black slime in his eye, then fine, but why can't they ease up a bit and shoot em in the legs/dick depending on whether the cop is prejudice? This would be good because 1) no one dies and 2) we can tell prejudice cases from non-prejudice cases.

 

[Malintent]

The laundry called - your hood took some extra work to get clean.

What about the shooting in Texas, where the white teen female is shot by the white cops. They have the entire incident on tape. Yet the press coverage of that is hard to find as well. Seems white people are fine with people being shot by cops in general... or at least that is how the press seems to make it look.

I am white and I am more than 'fine' with people getting shot by cops. If you are the kind of people that can bring themselves to get physical with a cop, then yes, please get shot and die.

 

[ksen]

1/10

 

[Derec]

I am white and I am more than 'fine' with people getting shot by cops. If you are the kind of people that can bring themselves to get physical with a cop, then yes, please get shot and die.

This is going too far in the other direction. Even when a shooting is justified it is not the preferred outcome - apprehending a suspect alive would have been better for all involved.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

What about the shooting in Texas, where the white teen female is shot by the white cops. They have the entire incident on tape. Yet the press coverage of that is hard to find as well. Seems white people are fine with people being shot by cops in general... or at least that is how the press seems to make it look.

I am white and I am more than 'fine' with people getting shot by cops. If you are the kind of people that can bring themselves to get physical with a cop, then yes, please get shot and die.

But shouldn't the perp at least strike a cop first. Most of these cases involve preemptive force by the officer.

 

[fromderinside]

I am white and I am more than 'fine' with people getting shot by cops. If you are the kind of people that can bring themselves to get physical with a cop, then yes, please get shot and die.

Reality test. Would you be willing to say the same if you were black?

 

[Nexus]

1/10

The replies he got indicate you underrated him.

 

[ksen]

yeah, looks like it

 

[Loren Pechtel]

But shouldn't the perp at least strike a cop first. Most of these cases involve preemptive force by the officer.

Self defense, whether cop or civilian, has no such requirement. You aren't required to accept injury before acting to prevent it--you can respond to an attempt to inflict injury.