I have now met a real life creationist.

[DrZoidberg]

The video you posted is an excellent example. This is actually something I like about Jehovas witnesses. They've accepted that the Bible is out of date, and they've created a companion piece to it. An update.

Is there something in their literature that says so? Please point me to it.

"Studies in the Scriptures"

I've actually read it. I joined a Jehova's witness on-line study group once. That was a bizarre experience. At no point were academic studies referenced. I mean... Charles Taze Russel wasn't an academic. He was just any random guy off the street. His views were just what was trendy at the end of the 19'th century, but utterly lacking in any support by serious Biblical scholars. There were so many preposterous interpretations that I thought went right against what it says in the actual Biblical text. Did they have any explanation for it? No. It was that way because Russel had said it was.

Russel's study guide, literally, would be just as good as any Biblical study guide written by anybody. That's what I like about it. It doesn't really care about the source material. Russel just decided what he thought the Bible should say, and left it at that. I think that's a healthy attitude.

What you don't realize is that JWs is a totally united community. What do you think contributes to that? If each person entertained his own interpretation of the scriptures and practiced such, that phenomenal unity would be shattered.

I think the main contributor is that JW is a brainwashing sect. It's not just any sect. It's one of the most extreme and evil one out there. I think the term evil fits JW just perfectly. A bunch of very good people motivated by doing good, but end up doing evil. I've met people shunned by their parents for wanting to make their own decisions in life.

Anyway... any organisation not encouraging their members to think for themselves is evil in my opinion.

The first centuries of Christianity the Bible was a living work. Continually getting books added.

That is flat out false! A bible canon exists and it effectively prevents any new additions.

What have you been smoking? You make it sound like you don't know the first thing about the Bible. The early Bibles couldn't even agree on how many gods there were. Are you aware if the Apocrypha? And that's just the books that were deemed sane enough. The majority of early Bibles were sold to a fireworks factory in the 18'th century. But even so, plenty of the more weird Bibles have survived.

Yes, there exists a Biblical canon. But it was assembled pretty arbitrarily by Athanasius of Alexandria. Purely for practical purposes. And then it sort of just stuck. I don't see why it can't be updated. What makes that version so special? It's called the "Vulgate Bible" which in itself is a clue. When it was first assembled it existed alongside a bunch of other Christian Bibles.

How would you know? Can you tell what is of pagan origin and still practiced in Christendom?

It's all pagan origin. Christianity is the fusion of pagan Greek philosophy and Judaism, a pagan religion. We even know the guy who fused them together, Philo of Alexandria. He didn't know it at the time, but he created Christianity.

For a Christian, you seem awfully ignorant about the origins of your own religion. I'm not even Christian. I've just read up on this because I'm curious about religion generally. For somebody who claims to belong to the fan club, you don't seem to be particularly enthusiastic about God.

If you think that the bible needs something, tell us what it is.

How about less justification of slavery? How about a Bible without misogyny? How about a chapter in the Bible on how to cope with the Internet and social media. Perhaps a mention about that driving cars is very dangerous and people should wear seat belts. Or a bit about the importance of going to the doctor instead of using faith healing. And certainly something about Jehovas Witnesses being allowed to get blood transfusions. That will save lives.

Or why just one? Why not many Bibles. They way Christianity used to be before the Roman emperor put his nose in Christian liturgy.

What changes to NT Christianity did Rome make?

The council of Nicea agreed to use Athanasius of Alexandria's canon. A little detail from history is that after the bishops had argued for days without being able to agree, Constantine said that he'd execute the lot of them unless they agreed on a canon. I'd say that was quite the subtle piece of Roman diplomacy.

And once that canon was in place Constantine ordered all other canons destroyed. Which was most of them. Most Christian congregations had their own weird version. They differed a lot. Constantine used his army to make that happen.

But you're a Christian!!! None of this should be news to you!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Schisms_in_Christianity

 

[wilson]

Give me and example, from Confucius' philosophy, that could benefit me and the rest of humanity.

That's not the point.

That is very much the point! Since you cannot recommend any part of the philosophy as of redeeming value, why continue to advocate and endorse it? How have YOU benefitted from it?

The point is that his philosophy has stood the test of time.

Wicked and inadequate rulership has also "stood the test of time." That's no recommendation! If it was, then all that humanity can expect is more of the same.

It's created a long lasting and stable empire that puts anything Christians have come up with to shame. Confucius still strongly influences Chinese society. Christian philosophy, arguably, stopped informing western society and ethical codes sometime in the 1700-hundreds.

If you want a lecture on the benefits of Confucian philosophy, I suggest talking to a Confucian.

YOU'RE the one recommending it - not any Confucian.

I'm not. He's certainly a pithy meme goldmine. Said things like this

Our greatest glory is not in never falling, but in rising every time we fall.

Where's the wisdom in that? If you are pursuing a wrong course of action, "rising every time you fall" does not change the motive nor the result of your pursuit.

Then, maybe you can tell me why the philosophy remains largely confined to the Far East.

It isn't.

It is very much so! It is suitable for people of that region and quite objectionable to other societies. The same goes for Hinduism, Judaism, Shintoism and Islam.

Shoppenhaur introduced eastern philosophy into Western and created a blend of the two. Changed the world. Everything after Shoppenhaur is strongly influenced by Confucius. That includes Nietzsche, Heidegger, Sartre, Derrida and so on. His philosophy and ideas are today ubiquitous and so accepted in the west that we don't realise the source. We just think they are common sense now.

In what way is the world a better place because of these philosophies? Have they been able to solve the more important issues plaguing mankind? Issues involving justice, fair distribution of the world's commodities, warfare, violence, racism, prejudice, crime, terrorism, etc.?

The west has a long history of taking ideas from the "colonies" and re-branding them as western. Confucius is no exception.

But the problems remain.

But that is not, in any way, true. Christianity, of the biblical kind, argues for doing things because they are right - not because of might.
Example:
“. . .For those rulers are an object of fear, not to the good deed, but to the bad. Do you want to be free of fear of the authority? Keep doing good, and you will have praise from it; 4 for it is God’s minister to you for your good. But if you are doing what is bad, be in fear, for it is not without purpose that it bears the sword. It is God’s minister, an avenger to express wrath against the one practicing what is bad. 5 There is therefore compelling reason for you to be in subjection, not only on account of that wrath but also on account of your conscience. 6 That is why you are also paying taxes; for they are God’s public servants constantly serving this very purpose. 7 Render to all their dues: to the one who calls for the tax, the tax; to the one who calls for the tribute, the tribute; to the one who calls for fear, such fear; to the one who calls for honor, such honor.” (Romans 13:3-7)
This is about the law of the land, not about the power of God.

It doesn't argue for shit.

I find your language objectionable! Do that again and I will not respond to your posts anymore.

It's just commands.

Then, obviously, you don't understand it. Christians are advised to obey the law of the land, not out of fear of punishment, but because it is right. And this will remove the fear of their authority. Refusing to do so brings down their wrath, as an avenger, and they have the power to execute those doing wrong.

Also, terrible advice.

I don't think so! We choose to live according to the law because this is what Jehovah our God wants us to do. We have and obligation to pass on to others the good things we have learned about the coming kingdom of God and we cannot do so as criminals.

This is how you perpetuate tyranny.

You can go fight the law if you like, but we will not join you in doing that.

It looks to me like you've been so brainwashed by this that you can't see a divine command when it hits you in the face?

No need for your adverse criticism. That is the way we choose to live and, as the text says, we get commendation/praise for doing so.

There's a reason pagan philosophy is required reading when studying philosophy today. None of the Christian theologians are.

You have given no example of pagan philosophy that should be emulated.

I don't think you understand what a philosopher is.

I have no need of them. They don't know about the ways of peace.

A philosopher organises thoughts. They put the correct labels on things to make them easier to talk about. Socrates was one of the greatest geniuses who ever have lived. I wouldn't recommend anybody to emulate his example. The guy lived like a dirty beggar in the street, harassing and annoying his fellow Athenians. If everybody followed his example nobody would get anything done. Doesn't diminish his thought or genius.

A perfectly lousy example. What he needed was a job!
Christians are advised:
“. . .“If anyone does not want to work, neither let him eat.” 11 For we hear that some are walking disorderly among you, not working at all, but meddling with what does not concern them. 12 To such people we give the order and exhortation in the Lord Jesus Christ that they should work quietly and eat food they themselves earn.” (2 Thessalonians 3:10-12)
“. . .Make it your aim to live quietly and to mind your own business and to work with your hands, just as we instructed you, 12 so that you may walk decently in the eyes of people outside and not need anything.” (1 Thessalonians 4:11, 12)

Here is an example; see if you can spot the foolishness:
“. . .There is one whose work is to cut down cedars. He selects a certain type of tree, an oak, And he lets it grow strong among the trees of the forest. He plants a laurel tree, and the rain makes it grow. 15 Then it becomes fuel for a man to make fires. He takes part of it to warm himself; He builds a fire and bakes bread. But he also makes a god and worships it. He makes it into a carved image, and he bows down before it. 16 Half of it he burns up in a fire; With that half he roasts the meat that he eats, and he is satisfied. He also warms himself and says: “Ah! I am warm as I watch the fire.” 17 But the rest of it he makes into a god, into his carved image. He bows down to it and worships it. He prays to it and says: “Save me, for you are my god.” 18 They know nothing, they understand nothing, Because their eyes are sealed shut and they cannot see, And their heart has no insight. 19 No one reflects in his heart Or has knowledge or understanding, saying: “Half of it I burned up in a fire, And on its coals I baked bread and roasted meat to eat. Should I, then, make the rest of it into a detestable thing? Should I worship a block of wood from a tree?” 20 He feeds on ashes. His own deluded heart has led him astray. He cannot save himself, nor does he say: “Is there not a lie in my right hand?”” (Isaiah 44:14-20)

1. This is from the Bible, so it's obviously a straw man.
2. In what way is this philosophy?

Idolatry is a philosophy. Sorry you couldn't see it.

3. This is just a description of Christians, but with an alternative fetish.

Really? Now you should make the connection. Show us what part of the Christian scriptures command, advocate or tolerates idolatry of any kind.

This critique is equally valid against Christians.

Please show us how.

Praying to gods is an equally worthless activity for both pagans and Christians.

Isn't that just your opinion?

Well - I showed you why I reject paganism. Now, you show me why I should adopt it.

Who had said anything about adopting anything.

I did! You advocate it, so, if I listen to you, I would adopt it.

I'm not arguing for you to become a pagan. I'm an atheist. Why would I try to convert you to anything?

That is exactly what you're trying to do; but you don't know which way to go yourself. You condemn things as evil without knowing what evil is.

Ovid's Metamorphoses is about human change. How we grow and evolve. It goes through the weird and wonderful sex lives of humans. It explores a whole host of themes. And it's a work that is still relevant today. The Bible has been completely thrown out by all psychology departments and institutions as complete garbage. It teaches us that we should be able to put a lid on our sexuality and be something we're not. No, shit that isn't working out.

Since that philosophy accepts sexual immorality, I have all the more reason to reject it. The lies and unfaithfulness that accompany it is clearly not worth it to us. Applying Christian principles works wonderfully for us. We are free from the guilt and sense of worthlessness that comes with the life style, as testified by many who lived it:
https://www.jw.org/en/publications/...https://www.jw.org/en/bible-teachings/family/

 

[funinspace]

Well, following the moral guidelines of the bible works well for us and you don't find any of those practicing loose conduct among us.
Maybe it doesn't work for Catholics and Protestants, but it certainly works for us.
These are the kinds of strong families you find in our ranks:
https://www.jw.org/en/bible-teachings/family/couples-parents/
https://www.jw.org/en/bible-teachings/family/

I dunno, maybe raping children isn't what wilson considers "loose conduct", but it certainly a horrible form of sexual deviancy. And how about those elders that shield sexual predators, I guess they are made of extra strong stuff. And no, I'm not suggesting that JWs have an extra helping of sexual predators, I'm just saying JWs are human and their close knit societies act much like everyone else.
https://www.revealnews.org/article/...1st-amendment-to-hide-child-sex-abuse-claims/

For Jose Lopez, it took almost three decades to find some semblance of justice after he’d been molested – when he was 7 – by a predator who’d operated within a congregation of Jehovah’s Witnesses in San Diego.

When his case against the Witnesses concluded in October, a judge awarded Lopez $13.5 million, a remarkably large sum in an era of frequent payouts in abuse cases. The decision rested in part on the Witnesses’ refusal to hand over documents in the case, prompting the frustrated judge to ban the organization from making a defense.

The Lopez case was remarkable for another reason. It forced the Witnesses into a rare admission: Somewhere within the organization, there is a trove of documents with the names and whereabouts of known child sexual abusers in its U.S. congregations.

Or JWs in Australia:
Australian Jehovah’s Witnesses protected over a thousand members accused of child abuse, report says

 

[DrZoidberg]

That is very much the point! Since you cannot recommend any part of the philosophy as of redeeming value, why continue to advocate and endorse it? How have YOU benefitted from it?

This is very confused conversation. The point is that the Bible is a standard work in a genre called wisdom literature. It's nothing special.

The equivalent today would be people posting inspirational graphic meme-quotes on their Facebook.

You're trying somehow to make a claim that the Bible has stood the test of time. Well... so has Confusianism. Confusianism is still influential. Christian philosophy seems to have died out completely in the 17'th century. Protestantism I think should be considered a wholly new religion.
But even Catholicism reformed after the reformation.

The point is that his philosophy has stood the test of time.

Wicked and inadequate rulership has also "stood the test of time." That's no recommendation! If it was, then all that humanity can expect is more of the same.

Great that we seem to agree. The fact that something is old, doesn't mean it's valuable. Great to see that you've come our as an atheist.

Shoppenhaur introduced eastern philosophy into Western and created a blend of the two. Changed the world. Everything after Shoppenhaur is strongly influenced by Confucius. That includes Nietzsche, Heidegger, Sartre, Derrida and so on. His philosophy and ideas are today ubiquitous and so accepted in the west that we don't realise the source. We just think they are common sense now.

In what way is the world a better place because of these philosophies? Have they been able to solve the more important issues plaguing mankind? Issues involving justice, fair distribution of the world's commodities, warfare, violence, racism, prejudice, crime, terrorism, etc.?

I think truth is a worthwhile goal in itself. I don't see the point in Christian willfull delusion. Why do they pretend to believe things that are patently absurd? Does it really matter that the truth is less comforting? It's true. That should be reason enough to believe it.

The west has a long history of taking ideas from the "colonies" and re-branding them as western. Confucius is no exception.

But the problems remain.

No, they don't. When we abandoned Christianity we got democracy and the greatest wealth and equality the world has ever seen. We have peace and the lowest prevalence of violent crime in history.

You're like a guy who got the weakest hand at the poker table, but still think you won.

Also, terrible advice.

I don't think so! We choose to live according to the law because this is what Jehovah our God wants us to do. We have and obligation to pass on to others the good things we have learned about the coming kingdom of God and we cannot do so as criminals.

So might makes right? You seem awfully confused about the terminology. Either you have an ethical argument based on logic or you fall back on power. Power is just the threat or violence.

This is how you perpetuate tyranny.

You can go fight the law if you like, but we will not join you in doing that.

Well, evil is evil. I'm going to fight it no matter how powerful the evil is. I'd rather die than live the life of a slave.

3. This is just a description of Christians, but with an alternative fetish.

Really? Now you should make the connection. Show us what part of the Christian scriptures command, advocate or tolerates idolatry of any kind.

You're a loony. No, I won't use the Bible as an authoritative text. Guess why? Because it isn't one. It's just any random book like any other.

Praying to gods is an equally worthless activity for both pagans and Christians.

Isn't that just your opinion?

It's actually backed up by science.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16569567

The amounts of money been put into this by religious groups in order to prove the efficacy of prayer is absurd. It's preposterous amounts of money. All the experiments are a total failure. No matter how they're posed. But the research will continue no doubt. This is faith in action. No brains. Just faith.

Of their phallic worship, archaeologist W.*F.*Albright observes that: “At its worst, .*.*. the erotic aspect of their cult must have sunk to extremely sordid depths of social degradation.”—Archaeology and the Religion of Israel, 1968, pp.*76, 77

Added to their other degrading practices was that of child sacrifice.
According to Merrill F.*Unger:
“Excavations in Palestine have uncovered piles of ashes and remains of infant skeletons in cemeteries around heathen altars, pointing to the widespread practice of this cruel abomination.” (Archaeology and the Old Testament, 1964, p.*279)

I think it is anti-pagan propaganda. In a society where most children die, it makes no sense to sacrifice them. Everybody would of course always try their best to keep them alive. All ritual centers where childrens corpses have been found there's no evidence they weren't dead already when brought there.

“Canaanites worshipped, by immoral indulgence, as a religious rite, in the presence of their gods; and then, by murdering their first-born children, as a sacrifice to these same gods. It seems that, in large measure, the land of Canaan had become a sort of Sodom and Gomorrah on a national scale. .*.*. Did a civilization of such abominable filth and brutality have any right longer to exist? .*.*. Archaeologists who dig in the ruins of Canaanite cities wonder that God did not destroy them sooner than he did.”—Vol.*1, p.*739. (Halley’s Bible Handbook (1964, p.*161)

It's typical in propaganda to make out an openent as immoral. That is especially true if the goal is just to raid them and steal their stuff, without any good justification. It's more likely that the Jews made all this shit up in order to justify thievery.

These are the kinds of strong families you find in our ranks:
https://www.jw.org/en/bible-teachings/family/couples-parents/
https://www.jw.org/en/bible-teachings/family/

Lol. Any children who manage to escape that hellish cult invariably hates it. It just acts to break apart and destroy families. Your claims are patently absurd.

 

[wilson]

This is very confused conversation. The point is that the Bible is a standard work in a genre called wisdom literature. It's nothing special.

The equivalent today would be people posting inspirational graphic meme-quotes on their Facebook.

You're trying somehow to make a claim that the Bible has stood the test of time. Well... so has Confusianism. Confusianism is still influential. Christian philosophy seems to have died out completely in the 17'th century. Protestantism I think should be considered a wholly new religion.
But even Catholicism reformed after the reformation.

The point is that his philosophy has stood the test of time.

Wicked and inadequate rulership has also "stood the test of time." That's no recommendation! If it was, then all that humanity can expect is more of the same.

Great that we seem to agree. The fact that something is old, doesn't mean it's valuable. Great to see that you've come our as an atheist.

Shoppenhaur introduced eastern philosophy into Western and created a blend of the two. Changed the world. Everything after Shoppenhaur is strongly influenced by Confucius. That includes Nietzsche, Heidegger, Sartre, Derrida and so on. His philosophy and ideas are today ubiquitous and so accepted in the west that we don't realise the source. We just think they are common sense now.

In what way is the world a better place because of these philosophies? Have they been able to solve the more important issues plaguing mankind? Issues involving justice, fair distribution of the world's commodities, warfare, violence, racism, prejudice, crime, terrorism, etc.?

I think truth is a worthwhile goal in itself. I don't see the point in Christian willfull delusion. Why do they pretend to believe things that are patently absurd? Does it really matter that the truth is less comforting? It's true. That should be reason enough to believe it.

The west has a long history of taking ideas from the "colonies" and re-branding them as western. Confucius is no exception.

But the problems remain.

No, they don't. When we abandoned Christianity we got democracy and the greatest wealth and equality the world has ever seen. We have peace and the lowest prevalence of violent crime in history.

You're like a guy who got the weakest hand at the poker table, but still think you won.

Also, terrible advice.

I don't think so! We choose to live according to the law because this is what Jehovah our God wants us to do. We have and obligation to pass on to others the good things we have learned about the coming kingdom of God and we cannot do so as criminals.

So might makes right? You seem awfully confused about the terminology. Either you have an ethical argument based on logic or you fall back on power. Power is just the threat or violence.

This is how you perpetuate tyranny.

You can go fight the law if you like, but we will not join you in doing that.

Well, evil is evil. I'm going to fight it no matter how powerful the evil is. I'd rather die than live the life of a slave.

3. This is just a description of Christians, but with an alternative fetish.

Really? Now you should make the connection. Show us what part of the Christian scriptures command, advocate or tolerates idolatry of any kind.

You're a loony. No, I won't use the Bible as an authoritative text. Guess why? Because it isn't one. It's just any random book like any other.

Praying to gods is an equally worthless activity for both pagans and Christians.

Isn't that just your opinion?

It's actually backed up by science.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16569567

The amounts of money been put into this by religious groups in order to prove the efficacy of prayer is absurd. It's preposterous amounts of money. All the experiments are a total failure. No matter how they're posed. But the research will continue no doubt. This is faith in action. No brains. Just faith.

Of their phallic worship, archaeologist W.*F.*Albright observes that: “At its worst, .*.*. the erotic aspect of their cult must have sunk to extremely sordid depths of social degradation.”—Archaeology and the Religion of Israel, 1968, pp.*76, 77

Added to their other degrading practices was that of child sacrifice.
According to Merrill F.*Unger:
“Excavations in Palestine have uncovered piles of ashes and remains of infant skeletons in cemeteries around heathen altars, pointing to the widespread practice of this cruel abomination.” (Archaeology and the Old Testament, 1964, p.*279)

I think it is anti-pagan propaganda. In a society where most children die, it makes no sense to sacrifice them. Everybody would of course always try their best to keep them alive. All ritual centers where childrens corpses have been found there's no evidence they weren't dead already when brought there.

“Canaanites worshipped, by immoral indulgence, as a religious rite, in the presence of their gods; and then, by murdering their first-born children, as a sacrifice to these same gods. It seems that, in large measure, the land of Canaan had become a sort of Sodom and Gomorrah on a national scale. .*.*. Did a civilization of such abominable filth and brutality have any right longer to exist? .*.*. Archaeologists who dig in the ruins of Canaanite cities wonder that God did not destroy them sooner than he did.”—Vol.*1, p.*739. (Halley’s Bible Handbook (1964, p.*161)

It's typical in propaganda to make out an openent as immoral. That is especially true if the goal is just to raid them and steal their stuff, without any good justification. It's more likely that the Jews made all this shit up in order to justify thievery.

These are the kinds of strong families you find in our ranks:
https://www.jw.org/en/bible-teachings/family/couples-parents/
https://www.jw.org/en/bible-teachings/family/

Lol. Any children who manage to escape that hellish cult invariably hates it. It just acts to break apart and destroy families. Your claims are patently absurd.

It is a pity that I don't have the time to deal with all these issues. I have a business to run.
But I am fully capable of debunking all of them.
That being the case, my responses have to come few and far apart.
Try not to hold people is such contempt just because they choose to believe something that you reject.

 

[Keith&Co.]

It is a pity that I don't have the time to deal with all these issues. I have a business to run.
But I am fully capable of debunking all of them.

Wow. THat's so new. I've never heard a creationist or a religion apologist claim they had the ability to 100% debunk any and all issues, but they were far, far too busy to actually put their money where their mouth is.

Try not to hold people is such contempt just because they choose to believe something that you reject.

How about for being braggarts? For putting on airs and doing sweet fuck-all to support that smug superiority? Can we contempt them for that?

 

[none]

What is it with these people?
"I can refute all your claims, trust me... but I don't have time..."
Another threat, what else can we expect from these trolls?
I bet you can't refute anything and that is the reason you try to rationalize your nonsense not having any justification as a problem of "I'm just to busy"
Retarded
"The answer is just too hard to explain", but "trust me"
Cry me a river

 

[Keith&Co.]

Anyone ever go to a concert that tells you the group is over the hill? Some band that was beyond superpopular when you were little, when you had no money for concerts, and now they're making a Last Gap tour? Or not even the band, maybe the lead singer has a couple new back-up members and is trading on the reputation they used to have?
And they suck? Even nostalgia can't make the concert NOT be a letdown.

These sort of apologists make me think of them...

According to the Books, god used to have a kick-ass road show. Men of Renown. Miracles, lightning, she-bears, widespread slaughter, rules broken, kings uneasy on their thrones, people willing to die JUST to prepare for His coming...

What do we get now?

Childish insults. Finger pointing. Name calling. People who cut and paste their screeds over and over and act smugly superior... They won't even martyr themselves enough to suffer through typing up a counter to the arguments against their beliefs..

It looks like God's promoter has lost a lot of pull on the circuit...

Or else, god's road show has never been more than people lke Moses hanging out saying "Ra's not real, that's self evidence! For reasons I don't have time to show you. I COULD counter your staff-to-serpent magic, but I've got a real job. Too busy."

 

[wilson]

“. . .Do not speak in the ears of the stupid one, For he will despise the wisdom of your words.” (Proverbs 23:9)
That is ever so true.

 

[Keith&Co.]

“. . .Do not speak in the ears of the stupid one, For he will despise the wisdom of your words.” (Proverbs 23:9)
That is ever so true.

OF course, if YOU'RE the stupid one, then the wise will despise your words.

So 'despicable' isn't too useful in determining who's the one slinging wisdom.

 

[funinspace]

“. . .Do not speak in the ears of the stupid one, For he will despise the wisdom of your words.” (Proverbs 23:9)
That is ever so true.

Oh gosh, insulting people is so much fun...Ain't it wilson?

The Dhammapada 5:63: A fool who knows his foolishness is wise at least to that extent, but a fool who thinks himself wise is a fool indeed.

BTW, I changed my mind, the JW NWT version is pretty lame. "stupid one"? Seriously, what a lousy translation. It is fool/foolish one.

 

[wilson]

The video you posted is an excellent example. This is actually something I like about Jehovas witnesses. They've accepted that the Bible is out of date, and they've created a companion piece to it. An update.

Is there something in their literature that says so? Please point me to it.

"Studies in the Scriptures"
I've actually read it. I joined a Jehova's witness on-line study group once. That was a bizarre experience. At no point were academic studies referenced. I mean... Charles Taze Russel wasn't an academic. He was just any random guy off the street. His views were just what was trendy at the end of the 19'th century, but utterly lacking in any support by serious Biblical scholars. There were so many preposterous interpretations that I thought went right against what it says in the actual Biblical text. Did they have any explanation for it? No. It was that way because Russel had said it was.

Russel's study guide, literally, would be just as good as any Biblical study guide written by anybody. That's what I like about it. It doesn't really care about the source material. Russel just decided what he thought the Bible should say, and left it at that. I think that's a healthy attitude.

You failed to answer the question.
Repeat: Is there something in their literature that says so? Please point me to it.

 

[Keith&Co.]

You failed to answer the question.

I do like how he's the only one who can demand an answer to a question, esp. considering how many he flat refuses to answer himself.

 

[sdelsolray]

You failed to answer the question.

I do like how he's the only one who can demand an answer to a question, esp. considering how many he flat refuses to answer himself.

Wilson is another "Do as I say not as I do" theist. He must take the Book of Job literally.

 

[funinspace]

I do like how he's the only one who can demand an answer to a question, esp. considering how many he flat refuses to answer himself.

Wilson is another "Do as I say not as I do" theist. He must take the Book of Job literally.

How else could a non-creationist creationist take Job, while non-philosophizing about his theology that he doesn't have? It is amazing how such contradictions could have arranged themselves without a maker...

 

[Cheerful Charlie]

“. . .Do not speak in the ears of the stupid one, For he will despise the wisdom of your words.” (Proverbs 23:9)
That is ever so true.

In the Bible, the New Testament, Jesus repeatedly tells us to sell all we have and give to the poor. Do you really follow the commands of Jesus? Does the Bible really mean anything to you?



Luke 14:33
In the same way, those of you who do not give up everything you have cannot be my disciples.

 

[Learner]

Hey Wilson , As close to the early Christians you can get regarding conscientious objectors. Quite admirable facing up to such persecution.

Jehovah’s Witnesses, in Germany as in the United States, had refused to fight in World War I. This stance contributed to hostility against them in a Germany still wounded by defeat in that war and fervently nationalistic, . attempting to reclaim its previous world stature. In Nazi Germany, Jehovah’s Witnesses refused to raise their arms in the “Heil, Hitler!” salute; they did not vote in elections; they would not join the army or the German Labor Front ‘(a Nazi affiliate, which all salaried employees were required to join after 1934)

In 1936 a special unit of the Gestapo (Secret State Police) began compiling a registry of all persons believed to be Jehovah’s Witnesses, and agents infiltrated Bible study meetings. By 1939, an estimated 6,000 Witnesses (including those from incorporated Austria and Czechoslovakia) were detained in prisons or camps. Some Witnesses were tortured by police in attempts to make them sign a declaration / renouncing their faith, but few capitulated.

The children of Jehovah’s Witnesses also suffered. In classrooms, teachers ridiculed children who refused to give the “Heil, Hitler!” salute or sing patriotic songs. Classmates shunned and beat up young Witnesses. Principals expelled them from schools. Families were broken up as authorities took children away from their parents and sent them to reform schools, orphanages, or private homes, to be brought up as Nazis.


taken from link
http://www.holocaust-trc.org/jehovahs-witnesses/

 

[Keith&Co.]

Quite admirable facing up to such persecution.

Meh.
They refused to fight for fascists, but they refused to fight against fascists, too.

Here's a question, how do you tell the difference between having balls and just being brainwashed?

 

[funinspace]

Admiration?

Quite admirable facing up to such persecution.

Meh.
They refused to fight for fascists, but they refused to fight against fascists, too.

Here's a question, how do you tell the difference between having balls and just being brainwashed?

Additionally, fast forward to this century, and one finds that the more conservative Christian Americans are, the more likely they were to have supported the invasion of Iraq and state (US only of course) sponsored torture.

Back in 2003:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/2827367.stm

In contrast, only 34% of Democratic women back Mr Bush's policy.

Other strongly Democrat groups, such as non-whites, are also strongly against the war, with only 35% backing military action.
<snip>
Another poll, carried out by the Pew Research Centre in mid-February, has tracked some of these differences.

It found that evangelical Protestants supported a war against Iraq much more strongly (85% in favour) than Catholics, non-evangelical Protestants and non-religious Americans.

From Dec 2014:
http://religiondispatches.org/christians-more-supportive-of-torture-than-non-religious-americans/

Remarkably, the gap between torture supporters and opponents widens between voters who are Christian and those who are not religious. Just 39% of white evangelicals believe the CIA’s treatment of detainees amounted to torture, with 53% of white non-evangelical Protestants and 45% of white Catholics agreeing with that statement. Among the non-religious, though, 72% said the treatment amounted to torture

 

[Harry Bosch]

Hey Wilson , As close to the early Christians you can get regarding conscientious objectors. Quite admirable facing up to such persecution.

Jehovah’s Witnesses, in Germany as in the United States, had refused to fight in World War I. This stance contributed to hostility against them in a Germany still wounded by defeat in that war and fervently nationalistic, . attempting to reclaim its previous world stature. In Nazi Germany, Jehovah’s Witnesses refused to raise their arms in the “Heil, Hitler!” salute; they did not vote in elections; they would not join the army or the German Labor Front ‘(a Nazi affiliate, which all salaried employees were required to join after 1934)

In 1936 a special unit of the Gestapo (Secret State Police) began compiling a registry of all persons believed to be Jehovah’s Witnesses, and agents infiltrated Bible study meetings. By 1939, an estimated 6,000 Witnesses (including those from incorporated Austria and Czechoslovakia) were detained in prisons or camps. Some Witnesses were tortured by police in attempts to make them sign a declaration / renouncing their faith, but few capitulated.

The children of Jehovah’s Witnesses also suffered. In classrooms, teachers ridiculed children who refused to give the “Heil, Hitler!” salute or sing patriotic songs. Classmates shunned and beat up young Witnesses. Principals expelled them from schools. Families were broken up as authorities took children away from their parents and sent them to reform schools, orphanages, or private homes, to be brought up as Nazis.


taken from link
http://www.holocaust-trc.org/jehovahs-witnesses/

Well, that's because they are crazy people! JW's believe that world governments and their military and police are under direct demonic control.