Snowflakes in action: the actual reality of "snowflakes" in the world and the consequences

[laughing dog]

Black Lives Matter is no more political speech than "Eat Subway Sandwichs" is.

Oh please, that's utterly ridiculous.

Not only that, but I'll bet that such commercial messages are also a problem.

Let me ask you, if a swimmer showed up with a "Stars and Bars" emblazoned on her swimsuit, or MAGA, would you agree that's not political speech?
Tom

MAGA is a slogan for a political campaign, so it clearly political speech. I have no idea what “Stars and Bars” means or refers to.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Of course racism created it, I don't see anyone denying that. That doesn't mean you can fix the problem by removing the racism, or that the continued existence of the problem shows the racism is continuing.

You're the doctor in the ER prescribing a seat belt for a broken arm.

I'm a Dr in the ER prescribing fixing the damn roads, removing the drug war, ending prison slavery, and improving educational funding specifically to the lowest performing schools.

You know, pulling the bone inside the flesh, setting it correctly, etc.

People against measures that correct the enduring condition are saying "well, we can't fix the old fracture, it healed like that!" Pretending that you can't rebreak and reset a badly set bone... Yeah it'll suck, but living with a badly set break is worse.

Fixing the roads, ending the drug war etc will not fix the broken arm in front of you.

And the broken arm I happened to have in mind had nothing to do with roads, drugs or the like. I'm picturing the woman that had her two kids standing up in the back seat when she ran a red light and hit my father. No substantial injuries to those with belts, one of her kids broke their arm flying into the back of the front seat.

 

[Trausti]

It you’re gonna hold that there’s persistent systemic racism, ya need to do better than could.

True. Just like if you are going to hold there isn’t, you have to better than meaningless graphs.

Hitchens’s Razor.

 

[laughing dog]

It is incredibly simplistic thinking that showing Asian are top earners is convincing evidence of a lack of systemic racism favoring Whites. Systematic racism make be systematic against certain ethnic or racial groups, not all of them. Moreover, systematic racism could simply hinder earnings of non-whites but still allow them to earn more than whites.

All I am saying is that graph does not provide convincing support for your argument. In fact, since it shows that Black and Hispanic earn less than White, it is consistent with the opposite of what you claim.

Asians used to be heavily discriminated against. Yet they're running away with that chart--what singled them out to succeed when other races continued to fare badly?

Hint: Culture! Asians strongly favor education. That's why they're pulling away from the pack.

Apparently you do not understand what “hinder the growth” means.

 

[laughing dog]

It you’re gonna hold that there’s persistent systemic racism, ya need to do better than could.

True. Just like if you are going to hold there isn’t, you have to better than meaningless graphs.

Hitchens’s Razor.

Then why did you post that graph?

 

[TomC]

Asians used to be heavily discriminated against. Yet they're running away with that chart--what singled them out to succeed when other races continued to fare badly?

Hint: Culture! Asians strongly favor education. That's why they're pulling away from the pack.

Education is a big part. But not all of the story.
Asian culture also prioritizes working hard/smart. Duty. Delayed Gratification. There's a bunch of cultural reasons Asian Americans out perform other race based cultural groups around here.
Tom

 

[TomC]

Black Lives Matter is no more political speech than "Eat Subway Sandwichs" is.

Oh please, that's utterly ridiculous.

Not only that, but I'll bet that such commercial messages are also a problem.

Let me ask you, if a swimmer showed up with a "Stars and Bars" emblazoned on her swimsuit, or MAGA, would you agree that's not political speech?
Tom

MAGA is a slogan for a political campaign, so it clearly political speech. I have no idea what “Stars and Bars” means or refers to.

Your ability to make fine distinctions when it suits you is remarkable. I consider BLM a political group. Let me know if they stop making political statements.
Tom

ETA~Stars and Bars is commonly referred to as Rebel Flag~

 

[Trausti]

Then why did you post that graph?

You are the proponent of a claim that something exists. The burden of proof is on you. The graph is inconsistent with your claim. And you’ve offered nothing but conjecture in response.

 

[Gospel]

Man, I better brush up on my Asian American slave history. what two centuries was that again?

 

[TomC]

Man, I better brush up on my Asian American slave history. what two centuries was that again?

You don't need to go that far back. The ugliness of imported Chinese laborers treatment was mostly a 19th century thing.
Tom

 

[laughing dog]

You are the proponent of a claim that something exists. The burden of proof is on you. The graph is inconsistent with your claim. And you’ve offered nothing but conjecture in response.

I made no claim. I pointed out your graph (which is conjecture) does not show what you claim. My comments are valid whether or not there is systematic racism.

On the other hand, you made a claim. The burden of proof is on you. To date, you have failed miserably.

 

[ZiprHead]

It is incredibly simplistic thinking that showing Asian are top earners is convincing evidence of a lack of systemic racism favoring Whites. Systematic racism make be systematic against certain ethnic or racial groups, not all of them. Moreover, systematic racism could simply hinder earnings of non-whites but still allow them to earn more than whites.

It you’re gonna hold that there’s persistent systemic racism, ya need to do better than could.

 

[laughing dog]

Black Lives Matter is no more political speech than "Eat Subway Sandwichs" is.

Oh please, that's utterly ridiculous.

Not only that, but I'll bet that such commercial messages are also a problem.

Let me ask you, if a swimmer showed up with a "Stars and Bars" emblazoned on her swimsuit, or MAGA, would you agree that's not political speech?
Tom

MAGA is a slogan for a political campaign, so it clearly political speech. I have no idea what “Stars and Bars” means or refers to.

Your ability to make fine distinctions when it suits you is remarkable.

I consider BLM a political group. Let me know if they stop making political statements.
Tom

ETA~Stars and Bars is commonly referred to as Rebel Flag~

Your inability to think critically when it suits you is also remarkable.

The BLM group is a political group. Black Lives Matter is a statement that may not be a political statement - context matters.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Except you are equating potential preference in race on an application with what was wealth seizure/prevention over several generations post slavery. We aren't simply talking about some black guy just had to go get a job somewhere else in 1911. Several generations of blacks, post slavery, endured intentional attempts to seize or restrict access to wealth, whether through actual theft of property/land, race riots destroying property, to laws/covenants/lining which impeded blacks from growing wealth through property and loans, that was intentionally aimed at ensuring blacks didn't get what they deserved, making it exponentially harder to develop family wealth with subsequent generations.

Equating the two is ignorant. AA, even after decades, hasn't even remotely scratched the surface in dealing with the wealth seizure/prevention.

Nothing can help that black guy in 1911. Giving a different black guy now a hand up does nothing to the past wrong.

That different black guy is at a substantial disadvantage due to the financial crimes committed against blacks over generations. We aren't giving that different black guy a "hand up". He is too far down for us to do that. We are providing an opportunity for him to just be "not quite as far down".

We need to make things right going forward.

It'd probably cost something that starts with a big B or T to do that.

The past is the past, we can't change it, it has basically no bearing on the situation.

It has every bearing on the situation today. Blacks have much less wealth today than whites because of the 'in the wide open' conspiracy to see as such.

 

[Trausti]

You are the proponent of a claim that something exists. The burden of proof is on you. The graph is inconsistent with your claim. And you’ve offered nothing but conjecture in response.

I made no claim. I pointed out your graph (which is conjecture) does not show what you claim. My comments are valid whether or not there is systematic racism.

On the other hand, you made a claim. The burden of proof is on you. To date, you have failed miserably.

Oh, okay. So you don’t think there is persistent systemic racism favoring Whites. Clears that up.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Man, I better brush up on my Asian American slave history. what two centuries was that again?

Technically, near slave wage labor for the Chinese got us the western portion of the Transcontinental Railroad. And then there was the Japanese Internment in WWII. Not quite as bad, but there were issues.

 

[Jimmy Higgins]

Black Lives Matter is no more political speech than "Eat Subway Sandwichs" is.

Regardless of what you think, the people running the swim meet disagreed with your interpretation.

It's a political movement. Not being for any particular candidate doesn't change that.

A political movement that states 'Please stop killing us'.

 

[TomC]

Black Lives Matter is no more political speech than "Eat Subway Sandwichs" is.

Oh please, that's utterly ridiculous.

Not only that, but I'll bet that such commercial messages are also a problem.

Let me ask you, if a swimmer showed up with a "Stars and Bars" emblazoned on her swimsuit, or MAGA, would you agree that's not political speech?
Tom

MAGA is a slogan for a political campaign, so it clearly political speech. I have no idea what “Stars and Bars” means or refers to.

Your ability to make fine distinctions when it suits you is remarkable.

I consider BLM a political group. Let me know if they stop making political statements.
Tom

ETA~Stars and Bars is commonly referred to as Rebel Flag~

Your inability to think critically when it suits you is also remarkable.

The BLM group is a political group. Black Lives Matter is a statement that may not be a political statement - context matters.

Same with MAGA and Stars and Bars. Might not be a political statement.
Tom

 

[Trausti]

Black Lives Matter is no more political speech than "Eat Subway Sandwichs" is.

Regardless of what you think, the people running the swim meet disagreed with your interpretation.

It's a political movement. Not being for any particular candidate doesn't change that.

A political movement that states 'Please stop killing us'.

All Lives Matter.

 

[laughing dog]

You are the proponent of a claim that something exists. The burden of proof is on you. The graph is inconsistent with your claim. And you’ve offered nothing but conjecture in response.

I made no claim. I pointed out your graph (which is conjecture) does not show what you claim. My comments are valid whether or not there is systematic racism.

On the other hand, you made a claim. The burden of proof is on you. To date, you have failed miserably.

Oh, okay. So you don’t think there is persistent systemic racism favoring Whites. Clears that up.

Didn’t say any of that.