France latest country to ban use of excessively thin models

[credoconsolans]

Isn't that like saying, "Hey, you've been an accountant all your life and in order to keep your job, you now have to work 365 days a year and if you don't...well, you're not entitled to earn a living as an accountant."

No, it's not. Model is not a job that I just decide I want to be and the money flows in for the rest of my life. Models are in demand because they look a certain way. If you can't make a living as a model based on the way you look that puts you in company with pretty much 99.99% of people in the world.

You are not entitled to work as an accountant or a model if no one wants to hire you because they don't think you are a fit for the job.

You don't "just decide" to become a model either. You have to meet certain physical criteria and image. You don't walk into a modeling agency and they sign you up like a temp agency.

Then they get a career modeling, that's what they do, that is their profession, they buy a house and car, and suddenly you're telling them, because the criteria for keeping their job has become medically dangerous, that their job wasn't anything anyway and they just need to quit.

Easier said than done when you have a mortgage and bills to pay and expect a certain level of income.

 

[ronburgundy]

2) Modeling is no one's "only vocation". No one is entitled to earn a living as a model.

Isn't that like saying, "Hey, you've been an accountant all your life and in order to keep your job, you now have to work 365 days a year and if you don't...well, you're not entitled to earn a living as an accountant."

No, this ban is actually just like what you describe above. It is a ban on thin people prohibiting them from working as a model. The only skill that models have worked at is looking like a model that gets hired, which for most current models means very thin. This ban says "You've been an model your whole working life and worked hard to have a look that gets you work, but now we are saying you can no longer be a model even if someone wants to hire you. At minimum, you must change your entire lifestyle and body type, and then you probably still won't get work as a model, because your thinness was the main reason you were hired in the first place."

Having to look a certain way and be thin is what models went into their profession knowing, expecting, and preparing for. You are the one advocating pulling the rug out from them and coercing them to meet your expectations for their BMI under coercive threat of unemployment.

At the very least, such a law should be phased over a decade or so, such that current models don't get tossed out on their skinny asses overnight.

 

[credoconsolans]

Isn't that like saying, "Hey, you've been an accountant all your life and in order to keep your job, you now have to work 365 days a year and if you don't...well, you're not entitled to earn a living as an accountant."

No, this ban is actually just like what you describe above. It is a ban on thin people prohibiting them from working as a model. The only skill that models have worked at is looking like a model that gets hired, which for most current models means very thin. This ban says "You've been an model your whole working life and worked hard to have a look that gets you work, but now we are saying you can no longer be a model even if someone wants to hire you. At minimum, you must change your entire lifestyle and body type, and then you probably still won't get work as a model, because your thinness was the main reason you were hired in the first place."

Having to look a certain way and be thin is what models went into their profession knowing, expecting, and preparing for. You are the one advocating pulling the rug out from them and coercing them to meet your expectations for their BMI under coercive threat of unemployment.

At the very least, such a law should be phased over a decade or so, such that current models don't get tossed out on their skinny asses overnight.

The thinness is a matter of degree. Instead of working with their employees, they force them into unsafe practices.

 

[ronburgundy]

No, this ban is actually just like what you describe above. It is a ban on thin people prohibiting them from working as a model. The only skill that models have worked at is looking like a model that gets hired, which for most current models means very thin. This ban says "You've been an model your whole working life and worked hard to have a look that gets you work, but now we are saying you can no longer be a model even if someone wants to hire you. At minimum, you must change your entire lifestyle and body type, and then you probably still won't get work as a model, because your thinness was the main reason you were hired in the first place."

Having to look a certain way and be thin is what models went into their profession knowing, expecting, and preparing for. You are the one advocating pulling the rug out from them and coercing them to meet your expectations for their BMI under coercive threat of unemployment.

At the very least, such a law should be phased over a decade or so, such that current models don't get tossed out on their skinny asses overnight.

The thinness is a matter of degree. Instead of working with their employees, they force them into unsafe practices.

They are not "forced" by any reasonable meaning of the term. That are not even coerced in the sense of using threats of force. At worst, they are persuaded with $ and fame to get thinner, just like many if not most employees are persuaded to things they otherwise would not, much of which is harmful to them (even if just via stress).
Those thinness standards are known before the choose to entry that highly select profession for which their are countless alternatives. Also, there are likely women already that thin who are not models. This ban means they are forced out of the modelling as an employment option.

The only actual use of "force" here is that being used by the government in their ban, which like all laws is a threat of use of physical force (disobedience is always ultimately enforced by forced incarceration, regardless of whether fines are the initial punishment).
They are using force against companies which translates into force used to make models alter their current body type, prevent current models from continuing in their profession, and prohibit overly thin people from having modelling as a career option.

Look, people do unethical shit, often in the name of business and profit. But not all unethical acts should be illegal. Emotional manipulation in persuation, whether in commercials or political campaigns is unethical. Should it be illegal to appeal to people's emotions? When the people "harmed" are adults who have the ability to control their own actions and decisions and say "no" to those persuations and choose alternatives, then that where a protective ban becomes paternalistic fascism that erodes the principle of personal liberty. People must be free to make bad choices. We can and should use social and consumer pressure against those who prey on people and try to get them to make self-destructive choices. But we should not use the force of government (which again is the only true "force" here) because there are way too many shades of grey and opportunities for authoritarianism once the government starts preventing people from making choices to "protect" them.

 

[Arctish]

Those thinness standards are known before the choose to entry that highly select profession for which their are countless alternatives. Also, there are likely women already that thin who are not models. This ban means they are forced out of the modelling as an employment option.

Not at all.

The law applies to all models working in France. Every model working professionally must meet a minimum standard of BMI or other measure of healthy weight. Dangerously underweight models will have to gain a few pounds but they are not prevented from working. The only ones who might be out of a job are those with severe medical or psychological conditions that prevent them from achieving the minimum (still skinny) requirement. In those cases, they should be under a doctor's care, and they should be given the help they need to put on weight and get healthy.

 

[Axulus]

Those thinness standards are known before the choose to entry that highly select profession for which their are countless alternatives. Also, there are likely women already that thin who are not models. This ban means they are forced out of the modelling as an employment option.

Not at all.

The law applies to all models working in France. Every model working professionally must meet a minimum standard of BMI or other measure of healthy weight. Dangerously underweight models will have to gain a few pounds but they are not prevented from working. The only ones who might be out of a job are those with severe medical or psychological conditions that prevent them from achieving the minimum (still skinny) requirement. In those cases, they should be under a doctor's care, and they should be given the help they need to put on weight and get healthy.

This idea that there is a bright line of "dangerously underweight" is a farce. Maybe they should be required to pass an annual physical - if the doctor says their weight is not dangerously low, I don't understand the government's case to ban it.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Not at all.

The law applies to all models working in France. Every model working professionally must meet a minimum standard of BMI or other measure of healthy weight. Dangerously underweight models will have to gain a few pounds but they are not prevented from working. The only ones who might be out of a job are those with severe medical or psychological conditions that prevent them from achieving the minimum (still skinny) requirement. In those cases, they should be under a doctor's care, and they should be given the help they need to put on weight and get healthy.

This idea that there is a bright line of "dangerously underweight" is a farce. Maybe they should be required to pass an annual physical - if the doctor says their weight is not dangerously low, I don't understand the government's case to ban it.

They would find a friendly doctor in this case.

A definite standard for underweight is a good idea, it's just BMI isn't a good enough standard.