Brian63
Veteran Member
- Joined
- Jan 8, 2001
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- 1,639
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- Michigan
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- Basic Beliefs
- Freethinker/atheist/humanist
Lately I have been looking over some websites with various theists, especially of the fundamentalist variety, explaining why poor misguided atheists are so irrational and extremely nonsensical. What has been a bit surprising though is how often they cite some version of Pascal's Wager as a grounds for holding the beliefs they do. Basically, that argument holds that it is simply a safer bet to believe in God than to not believe in God. If you are right, eternal bliss. If you are wrong, no harm. If there is no God and you guess right, you get nothing. If you are wrong, eternal torment.
It is an extremely seductive argument just on first glance, and as long as you do not invest a lot of time thinking about it in more depth. The problems with it, both logical and ethical, are extremely numerous and it is actually one of the worst and most superficial and flimsiest arguments that a person could come up with. It is ridiculously common though. Back as a kid when I was semi-entertaining the idea that there was a god, I remember Pascal's Wager being one of the arguments that was leading me in that direction. It was not until years later that I started to realize the many faults with it. Still, it is just soooooooo extremely common to hear grown adults still expressing this argument, and it is a complete giveaway that they have not really investigated their own beliefs from any critical stance, to any kind of depth at all, despite all the assurances that they have done that.
I just wonder how ubiquitous this sort of psychological facade is in the public at large. The people who comprise the hyper-fundamenatlists religionists use it, as do the twice-a-year (Easter and Christmas) Christians, as do people all along that spectrum of religious beliefs. This is not something we can probably get any kind of statistical data on, but I am curious to know among those of you here who used to be theists of various flavors yourselves---was Pascal's Wager and the inherent betting on God to exist part of your underlying motivation for believing in God, even if you had never heard the official name for it before? It was for me, to the little extent that I ever believed there was a god. Was there anyone here who did *not* have it comprise part of your religious psyche?
As much antagonism as we feel and express towards fundamentalists on this forum, there is that part of me that also feels so sad for them, that so much of their life is based not only on a falsehood, but on an extremely shallow and ethically rotten argument that even they usually can realize after it is pointed out to them. Life can be so much better after you get rid of the junk arguments and rotten beliefs out of your worldview. Just keep the good stuff then.
Thanks,
Brian
It is an extremely seductive argument just on first glance, and as long as you do not invest a lot of time thinking about it in more depth. The problems with it, both logical and ethical, are extremely numerous and it is actually one of the worst and most superficial and flimsiest arguments that a person could come up with. It is ridiculously common though. Back as a kid when I was semi-entertaining the idea that there was a god, I remember Pascal's Wager being one of the arguments that was leading me in that direction. It was not until years later that I started to realize the many faults with it. Still, it is just soooooooo extremely common to hear grown adults still expressing this argument, and it is a complete giveaway that they have not really investigated their own beliefs from any critical stance, to any kind of depth at all, despite all the assurances that they have done that.
I just wonder how ubiquitous this sort of psychological facade is in the public at large. The people who comprise the hyper-fundamenatlists religionists use it, as do the twice-a-year (Easter and Christmas) Christians, as do people all along that spectrum of religious beliefs. This is not something we can probably get any kind of statistical data on, but I am curious to know among those of you here who used to be theists of various flavors yourselves---was Pascal's Wager and the inherent betting on God to exist part of your underlying motivation for believing in God, even if you had never heard the official name for it before? It was for me, to the little extent that I ever believed there was a god. Was there anyone here who did *not* have it comprise part of your religious psyche?
As much antagonism as we feel and express towards fundamentalists on this forum, there is that part of me that also feels so sad for them, that so much of their life is based not only on a falsehood, but on an extremely shallow and ethically rotten argument that even they usually can realize after it is pointed out to them. Life can be so much better after you get rid of the junk arguments and rotten beliefs out of your worldview. Just keep the good stuff then.
Thanks,
Brian