If You Are Certain God Exists Why Prove It?

[Wiploc]

I believe remez last posted fifteen days ago.

I hope he'll be back. He said early on that he is busy, and there might be delays between his posts.

I hope to as well. So sorry for an avoidable delay at this season in life.
You have been great.

You've been great too. Reminds me of the good old days.

 

[arnoldo]

I don't need proof.

 

[Keith&Co.]

I don't need proof.

That's not the question. Not asking if you need proof, the question is for those who offer it.
Have you ever posted an attempt to provide nonbelievers with a reason to accept God, gods, Jesus, The Divine, or Darwin's desthbed conversion?

 

[DBT]

I'm sure that most people want evidence/proof, deeds, value, performance of shares, etc, when it comes to parting with their hard earned money.....

 

[arnoldo]

I don't need proof.

That's not the question. Not asking if you need proof, the question is for those who offer it.
Have you ever posted an attempt to provide nonbelievers with a reason to accept God, gods, Jesus, The Divine, or Darwin's desthbed conversion?

No,

 

[Keith&Co.]

I don't need proof.

That's not the question. Not asking if you need proof, the question is for those who offer it.
Have you ever posted an attempt to provide nonbelievers with a reason to accept God, gods, Jesus, The Divine, or Darwin's desthbed conversion?

No,

Okay.

 

[Keith&Co.]

I'm sure that most people want evidence/proof, deeds, value, performance of shares, etc, when it comes to parting with their hard earned money.....

Study after study seems to show the opposite. Once thry've given money, they resist any evidence that thrry fell for a scam.

 

[DBT]

I'm sure that most people want evidence/proof, deeds, value, performance of shares, etc, when it comes to parting with their hard earned money.....

Study after study seems to show the opposite. Once thry've given money, they resist any evidence that thrry fell for a scam.

Is there a distinction to be made between those who are given money, or acquired it easily, and those who earned it the hard way?

 

[Keith&Co.]

I'm sure that most people want evidence/proof, deeds, value, performance of shares, etc, when it comes to parting with their hard earned money.....

Study after study seems to show the opposite. Once thry've given money, they resist any evidence that thrry fell for a scam.

Is there a distinction to be made between those who are given money, or acquired it easily, and those who earned it the hard way?

Not really. More important, most are brought up in the faith and invested in the rituals before they could possibly question them.
After that, they give and defend the need to give.

 

[DBT]

Is there a distinction to be made between those who are given money, or acquired it easily, and those who earned it the hard way?

Not really. More important, most are brought up in the faith and invested in the rituals before they could possibly question them.
After that, they give and defend the need to give.

Which seems to suggest that people are, generally speaking, irrational creatures?

 

[skepticalbip]

Is there a distinction to be made between those who are given money, or acquired it easily, and those who earned it the hard way?

Not really. More important, most are brought up in the faith and invested in the rituals before they could possibly question them.
After that, they give and defend the need to give.

Which seems to suggest that people are, generally speaking, irrational creatures?

Suggest? I thought it was well accepted that people are irrational. Rationality only comes with concerted effort and, even then, not always successfully.

 

[DBT]

Which seems to suggest that people are, generally speaking, irrational creatures?

Suggest? I thought it was well accepted that people are irrational. Rationality only comes with concerted effort and, even then, not always successfully.

The overall state of the world, our economic systems and society is a testament to how rational we are....not.

 

[Keith&Co.]

Is there a distinction to be made between those who are given money, or acquired it easily, and those who earned it the hard way?

Not really. More important, most are brought up in the faith and invested in the rituals before they could possibly question them.
After that, they give and defend the need to give.

Which seems to suggest that people are, generally speaking, irrational creatures?

What's Trump's popularity among people most directly harmed by his policies?

 

[DBT]

Which seems to suggest that people are, generally speaking, irrational creatures?

What's Trump's popularity among people most directly harmed by his policies?

Yep, hard to argue against that.

 

[Aesthete]

The nature of faith means that you don't need evidence to support your conviction, that don't need to prove your belief. You just believe.

Biblically, the definition of faith is assurance, or confidence. Abraham is the example of faith in the Bible because he knew God's promises by direct, personal knowledge. God told Abraham that He would multiply his seed so that it would be as the number of stars, and He also told Abraham that in Isaac shall his seed be called. Therefore, when God commanded Abraham to offer up Isaac as a sacrifice, Abraham obeyed out of faith. That is, Abraham obeyed God because he accounted that God was able to raise his son, his "only son," from the dead. Now, this was written long before Jesus Christ, but it is clearly a picture, a foreshadowing, of Jesus Christ, and that God raised His only Son from the dead.

We understand, assuredly, that God created the heavens and the earth because it is evident from what has been created that there is a Creator. By faith, therefore, we believe that God is, and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him.

 

[abaddon]

We understand, assuredly, that God created the heavens and the earth because it is evident from what has been created that there is a Creator.

That's a trick of words. You assume the universe is "created" and the assumption necessitates a "creator". First you'd have to prove it's created before saying it's "evident" that there's a Creator.

By faith, therefore, we believe that God is, and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him.

And that's a rephrasing of how confirmation bias works. Look for what will confirm the belief and ignore what doesn't confirm it, and that way your beliefs will seem confirmed. It's just the valorization of cognitive bias.

 

[Aesthete]

We understand, assuredly, that God created the heavens and the earth because it is evident from what has been created that there is a Creator.

That's a trick of words. You assume the universe is "created" and the assumption necessitates a "creator". First you'd have to prove it's created before saying it's "evident" that there's a Creator.

By faith, therefore, we believe that God is, and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him.

And that's a rephrasing of how confirmation bias works. Look for what will confirm the belief and ignore what doesn't confirm it, and that way your beliefs will seem confirmed. It's just the valorization of cognitive bias.

I say this as someone who was an atheist for 14 years, and with over a thousand archived posts on this site. But I don't know how you could so much as look into the mirror and not see design. And the more that is discovered about life, the more complex it looks. It's quite a marvel. And even if life could arise by itself, we would not have consciousness if that were not also specially created. We'd be walking, talking globs of slime with no actual inner experiences, much like robots.

No, I don't believe we just "evolved" from slime. So if there's design, we're certain there is a Designer. "Faith" is not intellectually blind at all; but we walk by faith and not by sight because we walk in accordance with the things unseen of which we are persuaded.

 

[ruby sparks]

And even if life could arise by itself, we would not have consciousness if that were not also specially created. We'd be walking, talking globs of slime with no actual inner experiences, much like robots.

Unfortunately, there's no good basis or evidence for saying any of that. By far the most plausible explanation is that consciousness evolved alongside everything else that evolved.

I know consciousness makes you feel really special, me too, but rats and chimpanzees almost certainly have it, albeit in a less sophisticated way.

 

[T.G.G. Moogly]

That's a trick of words. You assume the universe is "created" and the assumption necessitates a "creator". First you'd have to prove it's created before saying it's "evident" that there's a Creator.


And that's a rephrasing of how confirmation bias works. Look for what will confirm the belief and ignore what doesn't confirm it, and that way your beliefs will seem confirmed. It's just the valorization of cognitive bias.

I say this as someone who was an atheist for 14 years, and with over a thousand archived posts on this site. But I don't know how you could so much as look into the mirror and not see design. And the more that is discovered about life, the more complex it looks. It's quite a marvel. And even if life could arise by itself, we would not have consciousness if that were not also specially created. We'd be walking, talking globs of slime with no actual inner experiences, much like robots.

No, I don't believe we just "evolved" from slime. So if there's design, we're certain there is a Designer. "Faith" is not intellectually blind at all; but we walk by faith and not by sight because we walk in accordance with the things unseen of which we are persuaded.

This is the classic example of the great contradiction among creationists, unless, that is, you can convincingly argue or evidence where designers and creators come from. I only ask because they would seem bound by the same observations and experiences we all have. Correct?

But if designers and creators have magic powers then I understand your claim as being no different than Santa's reindeer being able to fly.

 

[LoAmmo]

No, I don't believe we just "evolved" from slime.

That's because we didn't. If there are other things you are confused about, we may be able to help.