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My life as a climate lukewarmer - Matt Ridley

Axulus

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He makes some interesting points, if true. How strong is the evidence of the "dangerous climate warming" vs. the lukewarmer case?

I am a climate lukewarmer. That means I think recent global warming is real, mostly man-made and will continue but I no longer think it is likely to be dangerous and I think its slow and erratic progress so far is what we should expect in the future. That last year was the warmest yet, in some data sets, but only by a smidgen more than 2005, is precisely in line with such lukewarm thinking.

...

I was not always a lukewarmer. When I first started writing about the threat of global warming more than 26 years ago, as science editor ofThe Economist, I thought it was a genuinely dangerous threat. Like, for instance, Margaret Thatcher, I accepted the predictions being made at the time that we would see warming of a third or a half a degree (Centigrade) a decade, perhaps more, and that this would have devastating consequences.

Gradually, however, I changed my mind. The failure of the atmosphere to warm anywhere near as rapidly as predicted was a big reason: there has been less than half a degree of global warming in four decades — and it has slowed down, not speeded up. Increases in malaria, refugees, heatwaves, storms, droughts and floods have not materialised to anything like the predicted extent, if at all. Sea level has risen but at a very slow rate — about a foot per century.

Also, I soon realised that all the mathematical models predicting rapid warming assume big amplifying feedbacks in the atmosphere, mainly from water vapour; carbon dioxide is merely the primer, responsible for about a third of the predicted warming. When this penny dropped, so did my confidence in predictions of future alarm: the amplifiers are highly uncertain.

Another thing that gave me pause was that I went back and looked at the history of past predictions of ecological apocalypse from my youth – population explosion, oil exhaustion, elephant extinction, rainforest loss, acid rain, the ozone layer, desertification, nuclear winter, the running out of resources, pandemics, falling sperm counts, cancerous pesticide pollution and so forth. There was a consistent pattern of exaggeration, followed by damp squibs: in not a single case was the problem as bad as had been widely predicted by leading scientists. That does not make every new prediction of apocalypse necessarily wrong, of course, but it should encourage scepticism.

What sealed my apostasy from climate alarm was the extraordinary history of the famous “hockey stick” graph, which purported to show that today’s temperatures were higher and changing faster than at any time in the past thousand years. That graph genuinely shocked me when I first saw it and, briefly in the early 2000s, it persuaded me to abandon my growing doubts about dangerous climate change and return to the “alarmed” camp.

Then I began to read the work of two Canadian researchers, Steve McIntyre and Ross McKitrick. They and others have shown, as confirmed by the National Academy of Sciences in the United States, that the hockey stick graph, and others like it, are heavily reliant on dubious sets of tree rings and use inappropriate statistical filters that exaggerate any 20th-century upturns.

What shocked me more was the scientific establishment’s reaction to this: it tried to pretend that nothing was wrong. And then a flood of emails was leaked in 2009 showing some climate scientists apparently scheming to withhold data, prevent papers being published, get journal editors sacked and evade freedom-of-information requests, much as sceptics had been alleging. That was when I began to re-examine everything I had been told about climate change and, the more I looked, the flakier the prediction of rapid warming seemed.

I am especially unimpressed by the claim that a prediction of rapid and dangerous warming is “settled science”, as firm as evolution or gravity. How could it be? It is a prediction! No prediction, let alone in a multi-causal, chaotic and poorly understood system like the global climate, should ever be treated as gospel. With the exception of eclipses, there is virtually nothing scientists can say with certainty about the future. It is absurd to argue that one cannot disagree with a forecast. Is the Bank of England’s inflation forecast infallible?

Incidentally, my current view is still consistent with the “consensus” among scientists, as represented by the reports of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change. The consensus is that climate change is happening, not that it is going to be dangerous. The latest IPCC report gives a range of estimates of future warming, from harmless to terrifying. My best guess would be about one degree of warming during this century, which is well within the IPCC’s range of possible outcomes.

Yet most politicians go straight to the top of the IPCC’s range and call climate change things like “perhaps the world’s most fearsome weapon of mass destruction” (John Kerry), requiring the expenditure of trillions of dollars. I think that is verging on grotesque in a world full of war, hunger, disease and poverty. It also means that environmental efforts get diverted from more urgent priorities, like habitat loss and invasive species.

The policies being proposed to combat climate change, far from being a modest insurance policy, are proving ineffective, expensive, harmful to poor people and actually bad for the environment: we are tearing down rainforests to grow biofuels and ripping up peat bogs to install windmills that still need fossil-fuel back-up. These policies are failing to buy any comfort for our wealthy grandchildren and are doing so on the backs of today’s poor. Some insurance policy.

To begin with, after I came out as a lukewarmer, I would get genuine critiques from scientists who disagreed with me and wanted to exchange views. I had long and time-consuming email exchanges or conversations with several such scientists.

Yet I grew steadily more sceptical as, one by one, they failed to answer my doubts. They often resorted to meta-arguments, especially the argument from authority: if the Royal Society says it is alarmed, then you should be alarmed. If I want argument from authority, I replied, I will join the Catholic Church. “These are just standard denialist talking points” scoffed another prominent scientist, unpersuasively, when I raised objections — as if that answered them.

My experience with sceptical scientists, many of them distinguished climatologists at leading universities, was different. The more I probed, the better their data seemed. They did not resort to the argument from authority. Sometimes I disagreed with them or thought they went too far. I have yet to be convinced, for example, that changes in the output of the sun caused the warming of the 1980s and 1990s — an idea that some espouse. So for the most part, I found myself persuaded by the middle-of-the-road, “lukewarm” argument – that CO2-induced warming is likely but it won’t be large, fast or damaging.

http://www.rationaloptimist.com/blog/my-life-as-a-climate-lukewarmer.aspx
 
huh, he does not mention that 90% of the excess heat stored now is in the ocean. We are in an El Nino year and the oceans will give back some of that heat.

We have satellites that can measure the infrared being blocked from leaving the earth by increased CO2 and methane. The numbers match well.

CO2 and water block different (some is the same) spectrum of infrared, so increased CO2 will have that effect as a minimum for radiation balance.

Basically, the CO2 release we are doing now is a ramp transient that will have an effect in a timeline that should be somewhat predictable. Arrhenius did some of this in 1896 - worked on steady state solutions of various amounts of CO2 in the atmosphere.

The big picture is that we are tapping into long term storage of carbon that absolutely dwarfs the ability of natural processes to draw down in a time frame as fast as it it coming.
 
huh, he does not mention that 90% of the excess heat stored now is in the ocean. We are in an El Nino year and the oceans will give back some of that heat.

We have satellites that can measure the infrared being blocked from leaving the earth by increased CO2 and methane. The numbers match well.

CO2 and water block different (some is the same) spectrum of infrared, so increased CO2 will have that effect as a minimum for radiation balance.

Basically, the CO2 release we are doing now is a ramp transient that will have an effect in a timeline that should be somewhat predictable. Arrhenius did some of this in 1896 - worked on steady state solutions of various amounts of CO2 in the atmosphere.

The big picture is that we are tapping into long term storage of carbon that absolutely dwarfs the ability of natural processes to draw down in a time frame as fast as it it coming.

If the oceans are storing more heat, then you would expect to see increased cyclone activity, and a longer cyclone season. I won't believe it until we start seeing Coral Sea cyclones in July.

Oh, wait.

Shit.
 
idiot quoted in OP said:
Another thing that gave me pause was that I went back and looked at the history of past predictions of ecological apocalypse from my youth – population explosion, oil exhaustion, elephant extinction, rainforest loss, acid rain, the ozone layer, desertification, nuclear winter, the running out of resources, pandemics, falling sperm counts, cancerous pesticide pollution and so forth.
  • population explosion (true, the max sustainable population appears to be higher than originally thought)
  • oil exhaustion (oil was how much before fracking?)
  • elephant extinction (yes and the efforts to help prevent this had absolutely nothing to do with the elephant not becoming extinct)
  • rainforest loss (so public awareness had no affect in trying to reduce tropical rainforest destruction?)
  • acid rain (environmental efforts were put forth to help reduce sulfur emissions
  • the ozone layer (we banned the use of the chemical that caused the depletion!)
  • desertification (to be seen)
  • nuclear winter (is he actually complaining that we haven't used the nukes yet?)
  • the running out of resources (coming wars in certain areas will be over water in Africa)
  • pandemics (umm?)

This guy is an idiot! Reminds me of Dennis Prager saying Heterosexual AIDS was over blown. As if the massive awareness campaign didn't have any affect on trying to prevent the transmission of AIDS among heterosexuals. These idiots would be in a car accident and had their life saved because of wearing a seat belt and then they'd say seat belt use is unnecessary, look at how low car accident fatalities are historically.
 
good points, Jimmy.



I think that because AGW is somewhat complicated and technical the actual idiocy of this guy is difficult to see. Maybe it is more like someone talking about old cars (pre computer era) and he says something that betrays that he is full of shit and has no real knowledge. It takes a bit of effort to acquaint oneself with info on global warming. Many don't have the inclination to do it.

I like this quote about the topic:

Leslie Graham Sol R Nova • 4 days ago
Just insane garbage.

2015 is - so far- already the hottest year by far. 2014 was the previous hottest year on record - just ahead of 2010 which in turn was just ahead of 2005.

Every year of the 21st century has been one of the hottest on record with the single exception of the Super El Nino outlier year of 1998. You know - the year that the Denial Industry start all their ''cooling' graphs from.

The denier's legerdemain of selecting the failing RSS sattelite atmospheric column-temps only graph and then cherry picking the very peak temperature month of the Super El Nino year of 1998 as the start point for a statisticaly meaningless time period is a transparently obvious attempt to mislead the public..,.... and I mean really?

Really?!

Do you really seriously believe that the bulk of the world's people are so moronic they are going to fall for THAT!

It's just insulting.
And even though the Earth had been slowly cooling for since the Holocene Climatic Optimum some 7000 years ago until the industrial revolution you can rest assured that there is now absolutely no chance whatsoever of an end to the current interglacial for at least 20,000 years now. Stop parroting these denierblog myths that you don't even understand. You are doing yourself a diservice by making a complete fool of yourself.
In short - you have no idea what you are talking about - and whatsmore it's just obvious that you don't

from here:
http://ecowatch.com/2015/06/23/heat-waves-hit-planet/
 
He makes some interesting points, if true. How strong is the evidence of the "dangerous climate warming" vs. the lukewarmer case?

Evidence ? Who needs evidence ? "Global warming" is now an article of faith. If the earth's climate does not follow the global warming prediction, if there is a pause, a slowdown or a "hiatus" for example, then the models are are rejigged and voila ! The sky is still falling. (well heating up).
 
He makes some interesting points, if true. How strong is the evidence of the "dangerous climate warming" vs. the lukewarmer case?

I am a climate lukewarmer. That means I think recent global warming is real, mostly man-made and will continue but I no longer think it is likely to be dangerous and I think its slow and erratic progress so far is what we should expect in the future. That last year was the warmest yet, in some data sets, but only by a smidgen more than 2005, is precisely in line with such lukewarm thinking.

If "lukewarm thinking" refers to "thinking" that shows your piss-brain stupid, then he's right that his "observation" is quite in line with that type of thinking.

He is comparing 2 data (2014 to 2015) points and concluding that since one is only slightly higher than the other from 10 years ago that their is only a weak small effect.

No one remotely capable of statistical reasoning would present that observation as any form of "evidence", unless they were deliberately trying to lie to their audience.

Evidence relevant to the hypothesis only exists at the level of trends involving multiple data point comparisons. The 3 hottest years are in the last 5 years, and the 4 hottest in the last 10. The probability of that is staggeringly low unless a very real and significant upward trend exists. Also, the impact has little to do with high temps in a single year, but cumulative exponential effects of clustered warmer than typical years, even if broken up by individual mild years where the effects of a prior warm year don't have time to return to baseline.

In sum, his "thinking" is that of a barely literate undergrad taking his first college course on climate, who arrogantly thinks he found a "flaw" that thousands of scientists overlooked.
 
Not to mention the growing acidity of the oceans due to higher average temperatures. That's measurable.
 
Not to mention the growing acidity of the oceans due to higher average temperatures. That's measurable.
Lies, it is all lies. The radio tells me it is lies. The Internet told me it is lies. The cable news channel told me it is lies. That is three sources! Good luck finding three or more sources that say otherwise. You can't dispute radio, cable news, and the Internet!
 
idiot quoted in OP said:
Another thing that gave me pause was that I went back and looked at the history of past predictions of ecological apocalypse from my youth – population explosion, oil exhaustion, elephant extinction, rainforest loss, acid rain, the ozone layer, desertification, nuclear winter, the running out of resources, pandemics, falling sperm counts, cancerous pesticide pollution and so forth.
  • population explosion (true, the max sustainable population appears to be higher than originally thought)
  • oil exhaustion (oil was how much before fracking?)
  • elephant extinction (yes and the efforts to help prevent this had absolutely nothing to do with the elephant not becoming extinct)
  • rainforest loss (so public awareness had no affect in trying to reduce tropical rainforest destruction?)
  • acid rain (environmental efforts were put forth to help reduce sulfur emissions
  • the ozone layer (we banned the use of the chemical that caused the depletion!)
  • desertification (to be seen)
  • nuclear winter (is he actually complaining that we haven't used the nukes yet?)
  • the running out of resources (coming wars in certain areas will be over water in Africa)
  • pandemics (umm?)

This guy is an idiot! Reminds me of Dennis Prager saying Heterosexual AIDS was over blown. As if the massive awareness campaign didn't have any affect on trying to prevent the transmission of AIDS among heterosexuals. These idiots would be in a car accident and had their life saved because of wearing a seat belt and then they'd say seat belt use is unnecessary, look at how low car accident fatalities are historically.

I had a similar reaction to his lit of failed calamities.

Many items on his list represent real problems that were mitigated through deliberate action; acid rain and the ozone layer are great examples.

Does he then propose that since acid rain was addressed by reducing emissions of sulfur that climate change will just take care of itself?

Great, we reduced mortality rates enough in elephants that they haven't gone extinct. Therefore we should do nothing about carbon emissions because these things just take care of themselves.
 
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I really like the nuclear winter example.

Has there been a nuclear war that I missed?

Scientific prediction was that there'd be a nuclear winter if we blew up enough nukes to put a bunch of dust in the stratosphere and shade the planet. Prediction hasn't been tested that I am aware so I don't understand how that makes his list of blown or exaggerated scientific predictions.
 
It isn't just the explosion of nukes: it's the destruction of cities with nukes. Setting off a nuke in a city will produce more ash and other volatile particles than setting off one in a desert. We've spent an awful lot of effort to accumulate stuff in our cities, and a lot of it is chemically...interesting.
 
This "lukewarmism" is just the latest round of attempting to salvage global warming denial.

First, it was "There is no global warming, so we don't need to do anything."
Then, it was "Okay, there is global warming, but humans have nothing to do with it, so we don't need to do anything."
Then, it became "Okay, there is global warming, and humans contribute, but they're not a significant contributor, so we don't need to do anything."
Now, it seems to be "Okay, there is global warming, humans are the main actor in it, but it's not actually going to change our lives, so we don't need to do anything."

"We don't need to do anything" is the important part of the argument, the rest is tacked on top to rationalize it.

Edit: yeah yeah I know, the thread was old. Cut me a break, I've been away for a long time and forgot to check the dates.
 
Dear oh dear, is Matt Ridley now being trotted out as a global warming Pollyanna? His career as a free market Pollyanna kinda fizzled out after Northern Rock. I think someone's credibility needs a bailout.

[YOUTUBE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EUOap5TLkqY[/YOUTUBE]
 
I really like the nuclear winter example.

Has there been a nuclear war that I missed?

Scientific prediction was that there'd be a nuclear winter if we blew up enough nukes to put a bunch of dust in the stratosphere and shade the planet. Prediction hasn't been tested that I am aware so I don't understand how that makes his list of blown or exaggerated scientific predictions.

There is evidence of at least one ice ball earth and there is evidence of conditions leading to it taking place. Reading the record is evidence of a sort, the sortwe are now using to predict and name 'man made global climate change'.
 
I think that the sun is too luminous now for another snowball earth to ever happen again.

http://www.snowballearth.org/could.html

Huh, they say there that:

If a preponderance of tropical continents made the globe cold (see What caused the snowball earths?), the present geography with its enlarged boreal and subtropical land areas should have made it relatively warm. Before the ongoing intervention by our own species, this this was not the case. A likely explanation is that the rate of global CO2 emission from volcanoes has declined. Dan Schrag at Harvard University in Cambridge, USA suggests that this is because there is little carbonate sediment on the floor of the Pacific Ocean and therefore little CO2 release from volcanoes of the Pacific "ring of fire". He predicts that when subduction switches to the carbonate-rich Atlantic Ocean, the globe will warm again.
 
good points, Jimmy.



I think that because AGW is somewhat complicated and technical the actual idiocy of this guy is difficult to see. Maybe it is more like someone talking about old cars (pre computer era) and he says something that betrays that he is full of shit and has no real knowledge. It takes a bit of effort to acquaint oneself with info on global warming. Many don't have the inclination to do it.

I like this quote about the topic:

Leslie Graham Sol R Nova • 4 days ago
Just insane garbage.

2015 is - so far- already the hottest year by far. 2014 was the previous hottest year on record - just ahead of 2010 which in turn was just ahead of 2005.

Every year of the 21st century has been one of the hottest on record with the single exception of the Super El Nino outlier year of 1998. You know - the year that the Denial Industry start all their ''cooling' graphs from.

The denier's legerdemain of selecting the failing RSS sattelite atmospheric column-temps only graph and then cherry picking the very peak temperature month of the Super El Nino year of 1998 as the start point for a statisticaly meaningless time period is a transparently obvious attempt to mislead the public..,.... and I mean really?

Really?!

Do you really seriously believe that the bulk of the world's people are so moronic they are going to fall for THAT!

It's just insulting.
And even though the Earth had been slowly cooling for since the Holocene Climatic Optimum some 7000 years ago until the industrial revolution you can rest assured that there is now absolutely no chance whatsoever of an end to the current interglacial for at least 20,000 years now. Stop parroting these denierblog myths that you don't even understand. You are doing yourself a diservice by making a complete fool of yourself.
In short - you have no idea what you are talking about - and whatsmore it's just obvious that you don't

from here:
http://ecowatch.com/2015/06/23/heat-waves-hit-planet/


You obviously didn't read a word of what he was saying. He in no way disputes these are the warmest years on record. What he challenges is the idea that the warming is so rapid that 8t will lead to catastrophe, the 4 degreewarming amount that the IPCC considers to be dangerous.
 
I am a climate lukewarmer. That means I think recent global warming is real, mostly man-made and will continue but I no longer think it is likely to be dangerous and I think its slow and erratic progress so far is what we should expect in the future. That last year was the warmest yet, in some data sets, but only by a smidgen more than 2005, is precisely in line with such lukewarm thinking.

If "lukewarm thinking" refers to "thinking" that shows your piss-brain stupid, then he's right that his "observation" is quite in line with that type of thinking.

He is comparing 2 data (2014 to 2015) points and concluding that since one is only slightly higher than the other from 10 years ago that their is only a weak small effect.

No one remotely capable of statistical reasoning would present that observation as any form of "evidence", unless they were deliberately trying to lie to their audience.

Evidence relevant to the hypothesis only exists at the level of trends involving multiple data point comparisons. The 3 hottest years are in the last 5 years, and the 4 hottest in the last 10. The probability of that is staggeringly low unless a very real and significant upward trend exists. Also, the impact has little to do with high temps in a single year, but cumulative exponential effects of clustered warmer than typical years, even if broken up by individual mild years where the effects of a prior warm year don't have time to return to baseline.

In sum, his "thinking" is that of a barely literate undergrad taking his first college course on climate, who arrogantly thinks he found a "flaw" that thousands of scientists overlooked.

If it is so obviouly stupid thinking, then why don't you tell us more precisely the average amount of warming per decade this recent data suggests tather than speaking in generalities? Matt Ridley suggests the warming trend is about .1 C/decade, while the dangerous scenario would require around .33 C/decade (per the IPCC's own metric of 4 degrees of warming being dangerous).
 
huh, he does not mention that 90% of the excess heat stored now is in the ocean. We are in an El Nino year and the oceans will give back some of that heat.

We have satellites that can measure the infrared being blocked from leaving the earth by increased CO2 and methane. The numbers match well.

CO2 and water block different (some is the same) spectrum of infrared, so increased CO2 will have that effect as a minimum for radiation balance.

Basically, the CO2 release we are doing now is a ramp transient that will have an effect in a timeline that should be somewhat predictable. Arrhenius did some of this in 1896 - worked on steady state solutions of various amounts of CO2 in the atmosphere.

The big picture is that we are tapping into long term storage of carbon that absolutely dwarfs the ability of natural processes to draw down in a time frame as fast as it it coming.

If the oceans are storing more heat, then you would expect to see increased cyclone activity, and a longer cyclone season. I won't believe it until we start seeing Coral Sea cyclones in July.

Oh, wait.

Shit.

So how much warming is it? The dispute is the quantity of the warming. Is the last 20 years of data consistent with .33 C average warming per decade? I see nothing but generalities in yours and repoman's posts. No one sane disputes warming is occurring.
 
Not to mention the growing acidity of the oceans due to higher average temperatures. That's measurable.

Is no one bothering to read the OP? The author does not dispute that warming is occurring or that the recent years are the hottest on record.
 
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