• Welcome to the new Internet Infidels Discussion Board, formerly Talk Freethought.

Not to be a bummer but ...

ryan

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 26, 2010
Messages
4,668
Location
In a McDonalds in the q space
Basic Beliefs
a little of everything
I miss living in the hospital. I had a 4 week stay, and it felt magical.

About 3 months ago, I had what felt like a 10 day panic attack only this was more painful than my usual 15 minute ones.

So I got a ton of drugs there, (and I am still on 5 different drugs per day).

I miss the hospital so much. It was honestly what I would think going to heaven is like.

I am soooo f***ed. I was going to have to check out for good. But this place helped me stay alive! I miss it there so badly though.
 
I think it's natural and not fucked up. I think this would be true even if one didn't feel that it was life-saving, either in the way you seem to imply (allowing you not to kill yourself) or any other way. On any of the few occasions I have been in hospital, I have enjoyed it (apart from the painful or worrying reasons why I am there). In a hospital, one can feel cared for, and what's not to like about that? My 4 days in hospital when I had heart palpitations was a lovely rest from the stresses and strains of work, and I was very overworked at the time.

Once, I was in a psychiatric ward for a week or three when I was in my early 20's, and there were many very pleasant aspects of that. In the non-religious sense, such places, psychiatric or general, can be sanctuaries and places of respite.
 
I think it's natural and not fucked up. I think this would be true even if one didn't feel that it was life-saving, either in the way you seem to imply (allowing you not to kill yourself) or any other way. On any of the few occasions I have been in hospital, I have enjoyed it (apart from the painful or worrying reasons why I am there). In a hospital, one can feel cared for, and what's not to like about that? My 4 days in hospital when I had heart palpitations was a lovely rest from the stresses and strains of work, and I was very overworked at the time.

Once, I was in a psychiatric ward for a week or three when I was in my early 20's, and there were many very pleasant aspects of that. In the non-religious sense, such places, psychiatric or general, can be sanctuaries and places of respite.

Thanks for the reply. I feel less alone about this.
 
You are welcome. :)

I believe many people I know might say something similar to me. I have definitely heard some people say it.

Missing it, even a lot, is totally understandable and natural, especially if you are still not 100% as well as you might be or would like to be, and if you're on 5 different drugs, I'm guessing that might apply to you. How are the drugs working for you?
 
You are welcome. :)

I believe many people I know might say something similar to me. I have definitely heard some people say it.

Missing it, even a lot, is totally understandable and natural, especially if you are still not 100% as well as you might be or would like to be, and if you're on 5 different drugs, I'm guessing that might apply to you. How are the drugs working for you?

Since I started with one (Prozac) some 20 years ago, I noticed that I started needing more and more kinds. And if I ever stop any of them, I feel worse than before I started taking them, even after the withdrawal period. I am convinced that the drugs make me worse without them, so the only choice I have is to stay on them.

But overall, I think I am better off with this drug dependency, increasing or not, than if they never existed.

And I have done lots of psychotherapies including a few different cognitive behavioural therapies (with continuing practice) . I won't give up too easily.
 
You are welcome. :)

I believe many people I know might say something similar to me. I have definitely heard some people say it.

Missing it, even a lot, is totally understandable and natural, especially if you are still not 100% as well as you might be or would like to be, and if you're on 5 different drugs, I'm guessing that might apply to you. How are the drugs working for you?

Since I started with one (Prozac) some 20 years ago, I noticed that I started needing more and more kinds. And if I ever stop any of them, I feel worse than before I started taking them, even after the withdrawal period. I am convinced that the drugs make me worse without them, so the only choice I have is to stay on them.

But overall, I think I am better off with this drug dependency, increasing or not, than if they never existed.

And I have done lots of psychotherapies including a few different cognitive behavioural therapies (with continuing practice) . I won't give up too easily.

I hear you about the dependency thing. Drugs can be a double-edged sword.

I had chronic anxiety/depression for decades (by chronic I mean ongoing, not necessarily severe, though I did have two 'breakdowns' when it was severe) between the ages of about 21 and about 48. I have also had various therapies, including Freudian-esque, for years (and I was definitely very 'attached' to the former) and CBT. I too didn't give up easily. Good on you for that.

As I got older, by my late 40's (I'm 58 now) two things happened.

First, I gradually seemed to 'relax' about certain things, mostly to do with social or confidence issues. I think this is quite common, becoming more accepting of and going easier on yourself as you imperfectly are and not worrying so much what others might think or judging yourself by anyone else's or society's standards, or what you sometimes mistakenly think are their opinions and standards, because they say there are no normal people, only some that you don't know very well.

Second, I landed, luckily, on Citalopram, an SSRI which seemed to work, and I have been on it daily for about 10 years and have no problem whatsoever with staying on it until I die of old age and yes I am glad that there are drugs that can be tried and taken, though I do appreciate that they are not a silver bullet and that it seems very difficult for many people to find the right one or right combination.

I think that for me, both those things coincided.

They say a combo of drugs and talk therapies is the most effective. There again, talk therapy can be expensive. But if you can afford at least some, even infrequently, then as one therapist said to me, what else would you want to spend your money on? If it helps, what's more important than your health and potential happiness, or at least alleviation of pain, or even just coping with it a bit better, because let's face it, talk therapy is often just assistance rather than a cure.
 
Last edited:
Are others in here as f***ed up as I?

Yes and no.
Yes - lots of folks have struggles (crosses to bear)
No - that's not effed up. That's life. :rub:

Your post about hospital really made me think. In one way I was sad for you but then happy that you found a safe respite. Please post more updates if you can. :)

In the bible story of the Good Samaritan, the beaten and robbed man is allegorically likened to humankind. And the dangerous Road to Jericho is likened to the 'road' we call life. The beaten, robbed man gets taken to an Inn and has his wounds bandaged, which early church fathers saw as likening the Inn to a hospital.

...no doubt you can imagine the suggested allegorical significance of the man having his hospital bills paid by the Good Samaritan.
 
You are welcome. :)

I believe many people I know might say something similar to me. I have definitely heard some people say it.

Missing it, even a lot, is totally understandable and natural, especially if you are still not 100% as well as you might be or would like to be, and if you're on 5 different drugs, I'm guessing that might apply to you. How are the drugs working for you?

Since I started with one (Prozac) some 20 years ago, I noticed that I started needing more and more kinds. And if I ever stop any of them, I feel worse than before I started taking them, even after the withdrawal period. I am convinced that the drugs make me worse without them, so the only choice I have is to stay on them.

But overall, I think I am better off with this drug dependency, increasing or not, than if they never existed.

And I have done lots of psychotherapies including a few different cognitive behavioural therapies (with continuing practice) . I won't give up too easily.

I hear you about the dependency thing. Drugs can be a double-edged sword.

I had chronic anxiety/depression for decades (by chronic I mean ongoing, not necessarily severe, though I did have two 'breakdowns' when it was severe) between the ages of about 21 and about 48. I have also had various therapies, including Freudian-esque, for years (and I was definitely very 'attached' to the former) and CBT. I too didn't give up easily. Good on you for that.

As I got older, by my late 40's (I'm 58 now) two things happened.

First, I gradually seemed to 'relax' about certain things, mostly to do with social or confidence issues. I think this is quite common, becoming more accepting of and going easier on yourself as you imperfectly are and not worrying so much what others might think or judging yourself by anyone else's or society's standards, or what you sometimes mistakenly think are their opinions and standards, because they say there are no normal people, only some that you don't know very well.

Second, I landed, luckily, on Citalopram, an SSRI which seemed to work, and I have been on it daily for about 10 years and have no problem whatsoever with staying on it until I die of old age and yes I am glad that there are drugs that can be tried and taken, though I do appreciate that they are not a silver bullet and that it seems very difficult for many people to find the right one or right combination.

I think that for me, both those things coincided.

They say a combo of drugs and talk therapies is the most effective. There again, talk therapy can be expensive. But if you can afford at least some, even infrequently, then as one therapist said to me, what else would you want to spend your money on? If it helps, what's more important than your health and potential happiness, or at least alleviation of pain, or even just coping with it a bit better, because let's face it, talk therapy is often just assistance rather than a cure.

Yeah I want to try a Freudian type therapy. I am on a wait list though because it's expensive for the government, and I can't afford something like that.

The problem underlying everything wrong with me is death. I can't accept it, even though I have been tempted with the idea of ending it all.

So I am just going to keep on truckin til I die (that's me being self-defeating to my goal of immortality).
 
Are others in here as f***ed up as I?

Yes and no.
Yes - lots of folks have struggles (crosses to bear)
No - that's not effed up. That's life. :rub:

Your post about hospital really made me think. In one way I was sad for you but then happy that you found a safe respite. Please post more updates if you can. :)

In the bible story of the Good Samaritan, the beaten and robbed man is allegorically likened to humankind. And the dangerous Road to Jericho is likened to the 'road' we call life. The beaten, robbed man gets taken to an Inn and has his wounds bandaged, which early church fathers saw as likening the Inn to a hospital.

...no doubt you can imagine the suggested allegorical significance of the man having his hospital bills paid by the Good Samaritan.

I love the teachings of the Bible. I studied the New Testament about 15 years ago, lots of good stuff in there.

Oh, thanks for the hug :).
 
I have yet to actually be admitted to the hospital since I was a little kid, although I was in the ER a couple of weeks ago due to a kidney stone. I must be odd because I didn't like the morphine they gave me.
 
Are others in here as f***ed up as I?

Yes and no.
Yes - lots of folks have struggles (crosses to bear)
No - that's not effed up. That's life. :rub:

Your post about hospital really made me think. In one way I was sad for you but then happy that you found a safe respite. Please post more updates if you can. :)

In the bible story of the Good Samaritan, the beaten and robbed man is allegorically likened to humankind. And the dangerous Road to Jericho is likened to the 'road' we call life. The beaten, robbed man gets taken to an Inn and has his wounds bandaged, which early church fathers saw as likening the Inn to a hospital.

...no doubt you can imagine the suggested allegorical significance of the man having his hospital bills paid by the Good Samaritan.

I love the teachings of the Bible. I studied the New Testament about 15 years ago, lots of good stuff in there.

Oh, thanks for the hug :).



God bless you ryan
I hope you find peace.
"...and the voice said Daddy there's a million pigeons waiting to be hooked on new religions"

Rest in peace SDJ and ALF

[YOUTUBE]https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=K3hRaxQPy88[/YOUTUBE]
 
Last edited:
Yeah I want to try a Freudian type therapy. I am on a wait list though because it's expensive for the government, and I can't afford something like that.

At least you are on a waiting list, which is good. I hope your turn comes around. It's the same here. Waiting lists for talk therapies of all sorts, unfortunately.

One thing I would say, having really wanted it myself, is that it wasn't a silver bullet, but then nothing is. But it was certainly interesting, and helpful, and when I was really bad, it helped just to have someone to talk to (and I do mean to, not with, because she said very little, lol, as per the freudian way) to help me get through the week (when it was weekly) or even the month (when it was monthly).

Here, there are all sorts of therapists and counsellors and some that aren't as expensive and happy to see you once a month only. I wonder if you could afford that? They aren't as expensive as fully-trained psychotherapists. Failing that, is there a support group anywhere near you where you could go along with other people who might also be in a similar boat? Worth checking out. Group therapy is cheaper.

I found it was difficult to chat to friends and family. Family, well my parents, were too invested and in my case (as in many) part of the problem. If anyone in your boat has a good friend willing to listen, especially on a regular basis, then that's highly unusual. I mostly didn't open up to friends. My girlfriend was very supportive, but you may not be in a relationship at this time.

All in all, I favoured talking with/to 'complete strangers' as in professionals because I knew or felt that I wasn't burdening them, that they were only doing their job, a bit like a nurse or what have you. Neutrality in other words. Obviously, some therapists are better than others and ideally it's good to find a good one and one that suits you, but often people don't have much choice in real terms, so if you find one and he or she is not a quack then you can still get something no matter what. Sometimes it's just about getting little things to keep you hanging on.

So I am just going to keep on truckin til I die (that's me being self-defeating to my goal of immortality).

I hope you don't mind if I say that you seem as if you might be... prone....to negative thoughts, about yourself. So was I. So is almost everyone with similar conditions. It's arguably a defining symptom. As is self-sabotage. I had that in spades. And you won't need me to tell you they're not helpful because you'll already know that. I found it EXTREMELY hard to switch them off in favour of more positive ones, to 'change my script' as it were. As I said, I never gave up, kept pecking away, maybe got older and a bit lucky with medication or whatever, but in the end, I beat the bastard (though in some ways at least it might be better to say that I accepted it).

As for 'self help' books and stuff, I never found one that made a huge difference. I don't know if you've tried any. Some feel they're useful. Personally, I think they're useful for getting the odd helpful snippet or two, so I definitely wouldn't knock them and looking back I think they did help me cope. Eventually, I stopped reading them. Then, recently, I bought 'The Subtle Art of Not Giving a Fuck'. Lol. It was ok. I liked some of the ideas. One of them was that by always trying to be happy (which was what I'd spent more than half my life trying and failing miserably to achieve) we are at the same time constantly reminding ourselves and reinforcing to ourselves that we are not happy and telling yourself all the time that you are not happy is in some ways counter productive and adding pressure and a sense of failure if you don't 'magically' get happy. The suggestion was to not give as much of a fuck about certain things. It's not a self-help book as such or certainly not for someone with specific mental health conditions. But no book can tell you what to do. In the end, you have to slowly and very gradually and with a lot of effort find your own way. Small steps and all that.

Obviously, as an atheist, I personally am not going to recommend the bible. :) . But if it gives anyone solace (and parts of it can) then that's ok, imo. Take from it what you feel you need, the good parts, which would go for any book, therapy or advice, imo. Heck, go to church. If you can find a fairly modern liberal one, there are plenty of nice, caring people in churches and a sense of community. Quakers are quite good, imo, at least the ones we have here. Church of England (or Ireland, here) too. Hopefully, you have an equivalent.

Sometimes, reading helpful books which are to do with your specific condition is nice, because there are reminders that you are far, far from alone, that there are many many many other people with similar problems (even if none of them are exactly the same). Which there definitely are. It's an open secret. Part of the human condition for many. It's just invisible most of the time. There is nothing 'wrong' (as in 'bad' or freaky) with you in that sense. You are just somewhere on the normal/typical human condition bell curve at this time, and you may not always be there. If anyone says otherwise to you, politely tell them to fuck off. No maybe that's a bit rude. :)
 
Last edited:
Are others in here as f***ed up as I?

You're no more fucked up than the rest of us. We all need to do what we need to do to cling to life. Life is hard. Well done for listening to yourself and doing what you need to do to pull through.

Good luck
 
Are others in here as f***ed up as I?
What, in liking the hospital?
That's not fucked up.

contrary to the standard response, my blood pressure actually lowers when I enter a doctor's office. Even the office of the guy that pokes needles in my eyes once a month (Which allows me to turn down meetings on those dates by saying "I'd rather have a needle poked in my eye. I have an appointment at 1500 for exactly that!").

The hospital is a nice place. Well-meaning people checking on you regularly, orderly existence, structured routines, strict meal times, and I don't have to remember to take my blood sugar. Someone else will remember to take care of that.

My biggest stay was 2 1/2 weeks for a dead gall bladder and it was pretty nice. Except for the pain, of course, and the asshole roommates. Most of them were assholes. One guy had brain damage, and was reduced to a vocabulary of Yes, No and Fuck. After 20 years in the military, I got along great with him. "Good morning!" "Fuck!" "Right, right."
The others were all assholes, though.

But, no, you're not fucked up. Anyone tells you that you are? THEY are fucked up. You can tell them I said so.
 
Hospitals. A big ugh-ugh. How can you not react negatively to....
1, the Susie Sunbeam nurses?
2, the Marine Corps nurses? (My favorite line from one of these tough dames was when she told me, 'Strip down to your socks.' Believe me, I did.)
3, your consulting MD stopping by your bed and asking how you're doing this morning -- then checking your chart -- leaving within 60 seconds -- all of this appearing on your bill as 'Consultation $150'. (I'm guessing at the price. It's probably worse, but I wouldn't dare guess how much worse. Check out what they charge for a single Tylenol.)
4, the fooooooood. Macaroni and cheese on a green plastic tray, room-temp. Yum yum.
 
3, your consulting MD stopping by your bed and asking how you're doing this morning -- then checking your chart -- leaving within 60 seconds -- all of this appearing on your bill as 'Consultation $150'. (I'm guessing at the price. It's probably worse, but I wouldn't dare guess how much worse. Check out what they charge for a single Tylenol.)
Three In Hospital visits from one doc on my bill:

$187.94
$218.62
$110.72

I THINK the $110 was the day I was discharged. The $218 was the day I puked on him... $31 cannot be the dry-cleaning bill..
 
Hospitals. A big ugh-ugh. How can you not react negatively to....
1, the Susie Sunbeam nurses?
2, the Marine Corps nurses? (My favorite line from one of these tough dames was when she told me, 'Strip down to your socks.' Believe me, I did.)
3, your consulting MD stopping by your bed and asking how you're doing this morning -- then checking your chart -- leaving within 60 seconds -- all of this appearing on your bill as 'Consultation $150'. (I'm guessing at the price. It's probably worse, but I wouldn't dare guess how much worse. Check out what they charge for a single Tylenol.)
4, the fooooooood. Macaroni and cheese on a green plastic tray, room-temp. Yum yum.

As for #3--ER visit (kidney stone). I think I saw the guy three times over the course of the morning. Billed, $1,396.50. Allowed, $165. I don't actually object to the high price of the Tylenol--it's not the pill you're paying for, but the pharmacist's time to dispense one pill and the nurse's time to bring it. Strangely enough, everything they actually did to me in the ER got adjusted down to zero, I have no idea why. Unless something changes all I'm going to have to pay is the doc and the lab that did the bloodwork. (Plus a couple hundred for the CAT done in the urgent care before they sent me over to the ER.)
 
My dad had to have coronary bypass surgery a few years before he died. His doctor told him flat out that he *would* die without it; but he still came very close to refusing it, simply because he hated the idea of staying in the hospital so much. Finally my brother convinced him to do it for the sake of my mom. He'd keep his doctor's appointments without more than grumbling, but the idea of spending the night anywhere but in his own house and bed was total anathema to him. Funny how different reactions to hospitalization are.
 
Back
Top Bottom