Putin says Russia beefing up nuclear arsenal

[Harry Bosch]

The US has been provoking Russia (and China), but maybe only as a means to stop them emerging as rivals. they would like to isolate Russia, particularly from Europe, as this will help keep America's dominant position globally. What America doesn't want is a nuclear confrontation. They are game enough to push things as far as they can without having that play out. I think Putin knows this and so is putting his cards on the table.

The US is just trying to stop Russian expansion. Eastern Europe should have the right to rule themselves and not be subject to mother Russia invasion.

 

[barbos]

The US has been provoking Russia (and China), but maybe only as a means to stop them emerging as rivals. they would like to isolate Russia, particularly from Europe, as this will help keep America's dominant position globally. What America doesn't want is a nuclear confrontation. They are game enough to push things as far as they can without having that play out. I think Putin knows this and so is putting his cards on the table.

The US is just trying to stop Russian expansion. Eastern Europe should have the right to rule themselves and not be subject to mother Russia invasion.

And Russia wants to stop US expansion, Eastern Europe should have the right to rule themselves and not be subject to US invasion

 

[Togo]

The US is just trying to stop Russian expansion. Eastern Europe should have the right to rule themselves and not be subject to mother Russia invasion.

And Russia wants to stop US expansion, Eastern Europe should have the right to rule themselves and not be subject to US invasion

Can you give an example of a US invasion?

 

[Perspicuo]

No, it doesn't. That all started because the US stationed its nuclear missiles in Turkey, and the Soviets obviously wanted them out, so came up with stationing their own in Cuba. They succeeded when the US agreed to remove their nukes from Turkey.

Nevertheless, it was a Russian policy that was reversed, and was reversed because the US didn't want Russian missiles in Cuba.

I know that the Jupiters in Turkey were part of the deal (and that their presence was part of the reason for the Soviet policy in the first place); but the USSR remained in-range of US intermediate range missiles in other NATO countries (notably West Germany) even after the Turkish Jupiters were decommissioned, while the US successfully dictated that the Russians should not base IRBMs within striking distance of the USA.

All these years you've been thinking Kennedy is the hero who won that match? LOL -your government's propaganda worked real well, it appears!

I have never thought that; and I am not aware of any propaganda from my government to that effect - although I have seen plenty from the US government.

No man is an island. People and groups of people affect each other. There is no control. There is influence, pressure and negotiation. The US does not control Russia and never has. It's all bilateral. Your example is in no way the story of direct control, but instead of the typical push and pull of major rival powers between each other. If the US controlled Russia, Putin would be out of power and Ukraine would be complete and without covert Russian troops.

 

[barbos]

And Russia wants to stop US expansion, Eastern Europe should have the right to rule themselves and not be subject to US invasion

Can you give an example of a US invasion?

Iraq War

 

[barbos]

Nevertheless, it was a Russian policy that was reversed, and was reversed because the US didn't want Russian missiles in Cuba.

I know that the Jupiters in Turkey were part of the deal (and that their presence was part of the reason for the Soviet policy in the first place); but the USSR remained in-range of US intermediate range missiles in other NATO countries (notably West Germany) even after the Turkish Jupiters were decommissioned, while the US successfully dictated that the Russians should not base IRBMs within striking distance of the USA.

All these years you've been thinking Kennedy is the hero who won that match? LOL -your government's propaganda worked real well, it appears!

I have never thought that; and I am not aware of any propaganda from my government to that effect - although I have seen plenty from the US government.

No man is an island. People and groups of people affect each other. There is no control. There is influence, pressure and negotiation. The US does not control Russia and never has. It's all bilateral. Your example is in no way the story of direct control, but instead of the typical push and pull of major rival powers between each other. If the US controlled Russia, Putin would be out of power and Ukraine would be complete and without covert Russian troops.

Placing nukes in Turkey was fucking crazy and so is putting NATO to Ukraine.
Krushev was right, Kennedy was wrong.
Funny thing is, after Cold War ended it was revealed that Soviet Union has never had any plans for attacking or invading Europe/US, none whatsoever. But US/NATO did have a plan for first nuclear strike.

 

[Harry Bosch]

And Russia wants to stop US expansion, Eastern Europe should have the right to rule themselves and not be subject to US invasion

The difference here is that Eastern Europeans invite U.S. soldiers to come temporarily. Whereas Russians enter to invade and destabilize.

 

[barbos]

And Russia wants to stop US expansion, Eastern Europe should have the right to rule themselves and not be subject to US invasion

The difference here is that Eastern Europeans invite U.S. soldiers to come temporarily. Whereas Russians enter to invade and destabilize.

Temporarily? really?
Crimeans invited Russia too.
And secondly, eastern Europeans are not as inviting as you think, far from it.

 

[Harry Bosch]

Temporarily? really? Crimeans invited Russia too. And secondly, eastern Europeans are not as inviting as you think, far from it.

I hate to say it, but eastern Ukraine is gone. Russia will not give it up. But would you agree to condemn Putin if Russia invaded Western Ukraine? How about Finland, Poland, and or the ural countries. I'm trying to determine if your support of Putin has any limits. Btw: to save you the time, I think that the U.S. Should stay out of the Mid East.

 

[barbos]

Temporarily? really? Crimeans invited Russia too. And secondly, eastern Europeans are not as inviting as you think, far from it.

I hate to say it, but eastern Ukraine is gone. Russia will not give it up. But would you agree to condemn Putin if Russia invaded Western Ukraine? How about Finland, Poland, and or the ural countries. I'm trying to determine if your support of Putin has any limits. Btw: to save you the time, I think that the U.S. Should stay out of the Mid East.

Ural countries? what are these?
US should stay out of Europe too.
Yes, Eastern Ukraine is pretty much gone and US is to blame for this.

 

[Harry Bosch]

Ural countries? what are these? US should stay out of Europe too. Yes, Eastern Ukraine is pretty much gone and US is to blame for this.

(sigh). Does your allegiance have any limitations? Let's assume that US is to blame for all problems. Does that give Russia the right to continue its expansion west?

 

[barbos]

Ural countries? what are these? US should stay out of Europe too. Yes, Eastern Ukraine is pretty much gone and US is to blame for this.

(sigh). Does your allegiance have any limitations? Let's assume that US is to blame for all problems. Does that give Russia the right to continue its expansion west?

(sigh). Ural countries? what are these?
And what expansion?

 

[Harry Bosch]

(sigh). Ural countries? what are these?

If you answer my question first, then I'll answer yours. Again: does your support of Putin and mother Russia have any limitations?

 

[barbos]

(sigh). Ural countries? what are these?

If you answer my question first, then I'll answer yours. Again: does your support of Putin and mother Russia have any limitations?

My answer involves asking you and getting answer.
But your question is loaded one.
So, Ural countries? what are these?

 

[Harry Bosch]

My answer involves asking you and getting answer. But your question is loaded one. So, Ural countries? what are these?

I made a mistake, I meant "Baltic" states. Not Ural. So you are saying that your support of mother Russia has no limitations?

 

[Togo]

And Russia wants to stop US expansion, Eastern Europe should have the right to rule themselves and not be subject to US invasion

Can you give an example of a US invasion?

Iraq War

Iraq is in eastern Europe?

Funny thing is, after Cold War ended it was revealed that Soviet Union has never had any plans for attacking or invading Europe/US, none whatsoever. But US/NATO did have a plan for first nuclear strike.

???
The plans for a Soviet invasion of Eastern Europe in the event of war were found shortly after the Berlin Wall went down have been discussed extensively for years. They involve forming the Eastern European units into columns, consolidating supplies while pushing feelers into NATO territory. This would force NATO to use their nuclear weapons on small numbers of scout units, at which point Russian retaliation would wipe out the NATO 'square' formations and then rush across the irradiated territory with the columns, trying to reach the sea. If NATO didn't use do a first nuclear strike, Warpac forces would launch their own strike on day 5, regardless.

The Cold war plans of both sides have been extensively discussed and analysed for decades. What weird propaganda have you been consuming that would deny that both sides had war plans? It would be the absolute height of stupidity not to draw up plans. And of course they'd involve Russian invading Western Europe, because taking out Western Europe before the US could move troops and material there in larger numbers was their best hope for winning a conflict.

The really scary thing about the Cold war is the extent to which both sides can and did make extensive preparations to use massed nukes on the other, and how paper-thin the civic defences against that really were.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

And Russia wants to stop US expansion, Eastern Europe should have the right to rule themselves and not be subject to US invasion

Can you give an example of a US invasion?

Iraq War

Iraq is in eastern Europe?

Funny thing is, after Cold War ended it was revealed that Soviet Union has never had any plans for attacking or invading Europe/US, none whatsoever. But US/NATO did have a plan for first nuclear strike.

???
The plans for a Soviet invasion of Eastern Europe in the event of war were found shortly after the Berlin Wall went down have been discussed extensively for years. They involve forming the Eastern European units into columns, consolidating supplies while pushing feelers into NATO territory. This would force NATO to use their nuclear weapons on small numbers of scout units, at which point Russian retaliation would wipe out the NATO 'square' formations and then rush across the irradiated territory with the columns, trying to reach the sea. If NATO didn't use do a first nuclear strike, Warpac forces would launch their own strike on day 5, regardless.

The Cold war plans of both sides have been extensively discussed and analysed for decades. What weird propaganda have you been consuming that would deny that both sides had war plans? It would be the absolute height of stupidity not to draw up plans. And of course they'd involve Russian invading Western Europe, because taking out Western Europe before the US could move troops and material there in larger numbers was their best hope for winning a conflict.

The really scary thing about the Cold war is the extent to which both sides can and did make extensive preparations to use massed nukes on the other, and how paper-thin the civic defences against that really were.

It's weird that someone would think that the Soviets didn't have plans for invading Europe drawn up. Canada has plans for invading the US, FFS. Doesn't mean we'll ever do it (unless Hillary gets elected and we need to launch an invasion because your country has proven that it's weak and feeble and therefore ripe for conquest, of course), but it's the job of the military to war game out any potential conflicts well in advance of their ever becoming needed.

 

[barbos]

And Russia wants to stop US expansion, Eastern Europe should have the right to rule themselves and not be subject to US invasion

Can you give an example of a US invasion?

Iraq War

Iraq is in eastern Europe?

You did not specify that.
then Kosovo, Yugoslavia.

Funny thing is, after Cold War ended it was revealed that Soviet Union has never had any plans for attacking or invading Europe/US, none whatsoever. But US/NATO did have a plan for first nuclear strike.

???
The plans for a Soviet invasion of Eastern Europe in the event of war were found shortly after the Berlin Wall went down have been discussed extensively for years.

These were not plans for actual expansion. it was contingency plans for retaliatory strikes, it would be stupid to have shitload of tanks and no plans for for using them. Whereas US had actual plan(s) for first nuclear strike to take out the whole SU. Looking at the recent history of US I tend to think that the only reason these plans were not implemented and I still alive is because SU managed to maintain MAD, thanks to these ICBM subs. Of course one can say SU have never been in a position to mount first nuclear strike with even remote chance of success, but the fact is, US generals were the one thinking about it, not russian generals.

 

[barbos]

My answer involves asking you and getting answer. But your question is loaded one. So, Ural countries? what are these?

I made a mistake, I meant "Baltic" states. Not Ural. So you are saying that your support of mother Russia has no limitations?

Very peculiar mistake I must say, can you elaborate?

 

[Perspicuo]

Nevertheless, it was a Russian policy that was reversed, and was reversed because the US didn't want Russian missiles in Cuba.

I know that the Jupiters in Turkey were part of the deal (and that their presence was part of the reason for the Soviet policy in the first place); but the USSR remained in-range of US intermediate range missiles in other NATO countries (notably West Germany) even after the Turkish Jupiters were decommissioned, while the US successfully dictated that the Russians should not base IRBMs within striking distance of the USA.

All these years you've been thinking Kennedy is the hero who won that match? LOL -your government's propaganda worked real well, it appears!

I have never thought that; and I am not aware of any propaganda from my government to that effect - although I have seen plenty from the US government.

No man is an island. People and groups of people affect each other. There is no control. There is influence, pressure and negotiation. The US does not control Russia and never has. It's all bilateral. Your example is in no way the story of direct control, but instead of the typical push and pull of major rival powers between each other. If the US controlled Russia, Putin would be out of power and Ukraine would be complete and without covert Russian troops.

Placing nukes in Turkey was fucking crazy and so is putting NATO to Ukraine.
Krushev was right, Kennedy was wrong.
Funny thing is, after Cold War ended it was revealed that Soviet Union has never had any plans for attacking or invading Europe/US, none whatsoever. But US/NATO did have a plan for first nuclear strike.

Placing nukes in Turkey was a provocation towards a sworn enemy. Russia officially is a friend. If you look at the European map, you will see NATO countries sharing borders with non-members, which creates no problem whatsoever. In the 1990s, Rus and US were friends and partners. What went wrong? What suddenly made NATO a horrible thing for Russia? Evidently, the one factor begins with a P ends with an N and rhymes with UTI. He decided it was a great idea to ruffle feathers over everything. And he was right, it's a brilliant idea to make his fantasies of virtual dictatorship reality, and it's worked like a gem, up to the last minute as of now. He wants a new USSR. He has come to Latin America to strengthen ties with Cuba, Venezuela and Nicaragua, as if... wanting to revive Soviet alliances? Could that be? His steps sure coincide with it.