Religious Morality

[steve_bank]

Branching from a post on god of atheism...

If it is in the bible it is moral, of course. Morally objective and absolute? Does not pass the laugh test.

There is widespread Christian support for an ethically and morally repugnant Trump. Moral relativism. Christians openly say they know it but choose to support him because they think he will expand thieir religious freedom and power.


Christians throughput history through today are the worse kind of moral relativists..

Moral relativism is the view that moral judgments are true or false only relative to some particular standpoint (for instance, that of a culture or a historical period) and that no standpoint is uniquely privileged over all others.

 

[Cheerful Charlie]

Modern Near East archaeology has debunked the Torah and Joshua as real history. There was no 400 year Egyprian captivity. No exodus, no 40 years in the wilderness. No genocidal invasion of Canaan. And thus no Moses on the mount giving Moses 613 laws. This Bible "morality" is not from God, and is not in any way objective morality. It is made up by some less than moral ancient priest. All the atocities commanded by this priest's God never happened. Yet some 2,700 years later, these lies are still causing pain and suffering. Such as the hammer verses of Leviticus 18 and 20, used to harass gays.

 

[Politesse]

If it is in the bible it is moral, of course.

Hardly.

 

[steve_bank]

Modern Near East archaeology has debunked the Torah and Joshua as real history. There was no 400 year Egyprian captivity. No exodus, no 40 years in the wilderness. No genocidal invasion of Canaan. And thus no Moses on the mount giving Moses 613 laws. This Bible "morality" is not from God, and is not in any way objective morality. It is made up by some less than moral ancient priest. All the atocities commanded by this priest's God never happened. Yet some 2,700 years later, these lies are still causing pain and suffering. Such as the hammer verses of Leviticus 18 and 20, used to harass gays.

The 613 Mitzvot are taken out of the entire Old Testament, Moses only got the 10 Commandments.

The 613 Mitzvot

The 613 Mitzvot

www.jmu.edu

What is mitzvot in Hebrew?
What is a Mitzvah? | PJ Library
The literal meaning of the Hebrew word mitzvah is commandment, but the generally accepted sense is that of a good deed.Jun 5, 2017

 

[steve_bank]

If it is in the bible it is moral, of course.

Hardly.

Sometimes I get the impression you live in a kind of fantasy reality divorced from the historical reality of Christianity and religion in general.

To believing Christians god and the bible are the absolute moral authority. The moral relativism comes in when Christians interpret scripture to fit a situation. The 'Mark Of Ham' was uses by Christian slave holders to justify subjugating blacks. The current polarized issue on abortion.

Christians freely quote mine the bible to support a position. I know tat from personal experience. Probably a consequence of the Reformation which got rid of papal moral authority.

JFKs campaign meeting with non Catholic Chrtians should be online. His being Catholicc was an issue for Chistians who feared he would be under the moral authrity of the pope. Papal defintion of moral interretaion of scripture versus Protestant various inerpretaions.

How Christian Slaveholders Used the Bible to Justify Slavery

Read an excerpt from 'The Great Stain: Witnessing American Slavery' by Noel Rae

time.com

Modern liberal Christians promoting gay marriage ignoring biblical traditions and the words of Jesus .

 

[Politesse]

If it is in the bible it is moral, of course.

Hardly.

Sometimes I get the impression you live in a kind of fantasy reality divorced from the historical reality of Christianity and religion in general.

To believing Christians god and the bible are the absolute moral authority. The moral relativism comes in when Christians interpret scripture to fit a situation. The 'Mark Of Ham' was uses by Christian slave holders to justify subjugating blacks. The current polarized issue on abortion.

Christians freely quote mine the bible to support a position. I know tat from personal experience. Probably a consequence of the Reformation which got rid of papal moral authority.

JFKs campaign meeting with non Catholic Chrtians should be online. His being Catholicc was an issue for Chistians who feared he would be under the moral authrity of the pope. Papal defintion of moral interretaion of scripture versus Protestant various inerpretaions.

How Christian Slaveholders Used the Bible to Justify Slavery

Read an excerpt from 'The Great Stain: Witnessing American Slavery' by Noel Rae

time.com

Modern liberal Christians promoting gay marriage ignoring biblical traditions and the words of Jesus .

It's weird that you're accusing me of ignorance for disagreeing with you, while citing a bunch of evidence that shows that in fact things are not so simple as you describe in the post I objected to. How are there all these public debates, if all Christians, let alone all other people, understand the moral authority of "The Bible" - a book whose very composition is up for vigorous debate - in the same way?

 

[Thomas II]

 

[Politesse]

How else to celebrate the coming of the Pale Galilean? At whose breath the world goes gray, as the children feed on the fullness of his death...

 

[Thomas II]

How else to celebrate the coming of the Pale Galilean? At whose breath the world goes gray, as the children feed on the fullness of his death...

 

[steve_bank]

If it is in the bible it is moral, of course.

Hardly.

Sometimes I get the impression you live in a kind of fantasy reality divorced from the historical reality of Christianity and religion in general.

To believing Christians god and the bible are the absolute moral authority. The moral relativism comes in when Christians interpret scripture to fit a situation. The 'Mark Of Ham' was uses by Christian slave holders to justify subjugating blacks. The current polarized issue on abortion.

Christians freely quote mine the bible to support a position. I know tat from personal experience. Probably a consequence of the Reformation which got rid of papal moral authority.

JFKs campaign meeting with non Catholic Chrtians should be online. His being Catholicc was an issue for Chistians who feared he would be under the moral authrity of the pope. Papal defintion of moral interretaion of scripture versus Protestant various inerpretaions.

How Christian Slaveholders Used the Bible to Justify Slavery

Read an excerpt from 'The Great Stain: Witnessing American Slavery' by Noel Rae

time.com

Modern liberal Christians promoting gay marriage ignoring biblical traditions and the words of Jesus .

It's weird that you're accusing me of ignorance for disagreeing with you, while citing a bunch of evidence that shows that in fact things are not so simple as you describe in the post I objected to. How are there all these public debates, if all Christians, let alone all other people, understand the moral authority of "The Bible" - a book whose very composition is up for vigorous debate - in the same way?

Things are that simple.

Christians freely interpret scripture to fit a situation.

In the news the pope is facing opposition from American bishops over his liberal interpretation of Christianity. One specific is opening the RCC to gays.

INIsraell the Zionist interpretation of sculpture to say Jews have a right to Playtime, god gave it to them. Said explicitly by Netiquette.

Anti abortion Christians who say god does not wabt abortion, so they must make it illegal.

My guess is you self segregate with those you are conformable with.


If that conflicts with your image of Jesus and Christiabity, join the crowd. Being gay and identifying as Chistian drves conservves Christians crazy.

You are defending yiur personal interpretaion as gay hating Evangelicals defend their interpretation and image.

Ctalic politcians in Poland are strongly anti gay. To the point they are getting push back from the EU.

 

[Learner]

Branching from a post on god of atheism...

If it is in the bible it is moral, of course. Morally objective and absolute? Does not pass the laugh test.

As often with atheists. With much effort, they try to make the Ancient Hebrews stand out - deliberately painting the 'false impression' that they alone are a "brutal and bloodthirsty" lot, whilst ignoring the rest of the ancient world. The false impression hinted of the ancient world somehow suggests that other nations existing with the Hebrews were "peaceful and harmless".

The Hebrews made their laws to avoid doing what other nations were doing. You know like um... the abomination where nations were sacrificing babies to molok?

There is widespread Christian support for an ethically and morally repugnant Trump. Moral relativism. Christians openly say they know it but choose to support him because they think he will expand thieir religious freedom and power.

I suppose the counter to that descriptive language is to say atheists murder people - and we can see these atrocities by the historical records of these non-religious governing nations.

Christians throughput history through today are the worse kind of moral relativists..

Like the above language being applied:

Atheists are historically murderers.

Moral relativism is the view that moral judgments are true or false only relative to some particular standpoint (for instance, that of a culture or a historical period) and that no standpoint is uniquely privileged over all others.

Although between the Christian and atheist. They argue one side is better than the other.

 

[steve_bank]

Learner

Again to you, you are hard pressed to claim that Christians a whole represent any kinid of morality that should be adhered to.

Over here it is Christians who make up the bulk of Trump's support that may et him reelected. There was a collective value judgment, Trump supports conservative Chrtians so they look the ther way at his morality and ethics.

The bible is ambiguous at best if you actually read 'what god says' to the ancient Jews.

Are there moral and ethical Christians? Sure. But then there are moral Hindus, atheists, and Muslims.

 

[TomC]

As often with atheists. With much effort, they try to make the Ancient Hebrews stand out - deliberately painting the 'false impression' that they alone are a "brutal and bloodthirsty" lot, whilst ignoring the rest of the ancient world.

I see it as just the opposite. Bronze age Israelites were morally and ethically primitive, like pretty much everyone.
The difference is that modern people refer to it as moral justification for ugly ethics, because it's in the Christian Bible. "God says..." is used to justify nasty things from spouse abuse and gay bashing to war and racism.

You may not, I doubt that you do. You seem to have thoroughly adopted a secular morality.

But around here(southern Indiana USA) lots of people do.

True story:
A young, 20ish, man found out his younger, teen, brother was gay. Guy beat up his little brother, so badly the kid was hospitalized for a week.
At some preliminary court hearing, the perp blurted out, "Well, if I were gay I'd want somebody to beat the queer out of me!"
The perp used The Golden Rule to justify nearly killing his little brother.

Tom

 

[steve_bank]

Learner,

The point is the ancient Hebrews who Christians revere were no better or worse than any others.

Certainly not morally any different than other culture. Actuality read the entire bible. The corruption and immorality of the iconic Hew leaders like David. Murder, adultery, power politics.

Selective morality derived from the bible.

The idea that ancient Jews were perennial victims is a Jewish cultural myth.