“Revolution in Thought: A new look at determinism and free will"

[peacegirl]

The brain receives information from the external world by means of the eyes,

True.

which detect light and convey information to the visual cortex for processing and generating vision.

True.

That cannot be an instant process. We do not, and cannot, see instantly. The claim is ridiculous.

Wrong. Everything you mentioned works with real-time vision. You just don't understand why. There is no violation of physics.

 

[peacegirl]

Light conveys information. The brain constructs mental imagery.

Light is a condition of sight. It does nothing more. You are giving credit to light that it doesn't have, but you fail to see it because it isn't obvious. It's not your fault. This is why everyone believes we see reality in a delay.

 

[DBT]

I don’t know. So let’s drop it.

This has to be a joke!

So now you are responding to your own responses and contradicting them???

No, I was just adding on to the post that had already timed out.

Yet failed to address the question.

I did not.

If light conveys visual information about the world around us, and light has velocity and travel time....how is 'real time seeing/light at the eye/instant vision, possible?

Given that light is demonstrably being emitted or reflected, which the eyes detect, and it is the information that light provides that the brain uses to generate sight...how can instant vision possibly work?

This question has not been addressed.

 

[peacegirl]

I don’t know. So let’s drop it.

This has to be a joke!

So now you are responding to your own responses and contradicting them???

No, I was just adding on to the post that had already timed out.

Yet failed to address the question.

I did not.

If light conveys visual information about the world around us, and light has velocity and travel time....how is 'real time seeing/light at the eye/instant vision, possible?

Light does not convey, which implies travel time. This is problematic and will prevent you from understanding that there is no violation of physics.

Given that light is demonstrably being emitted or reflected, which the eyes detect, and it is the information that light provides that the brain uses to generate sight...how can instant vision possibly work?

This question has not been addressed.

I am working hard to address this. Who knows if i will succeed. The eyes detect light. That is a fact, but light does not travel with the image. I'm saying this as bluntly as as i can because people are trying to tell me that the wavelength/frequency of the object is different than the author saying the image DOES NOT TRAVEL.

 

[peacegirl]

Light conveys information. The brain constructs mental imagery.

We see the object in real time. This is

Light conveys information. The brain constructs mental imagery.

Light does not convey information. Light allows us to see what's out there in the real world. The brain does not reconstruct mental imagery. It uses what is seen and applies it to one's repertoire of experiences to categorize it for later retrieval.

 

[peacegirl]

I don’t know. So let’s drop it.

This has to be a joke!

So now you are responding to your own responses and contradicting them???

No, I was just adding on to the post that had already timed out.

Yet failed to address the question.

I did not.

If light conveys visual information about the world around us, and light has velocity and travel time....how is 'real time seeing/light at the eye/instant vision, possible?

Given that light is demonstrably being emitted or reflected, which the eyes detect, and it is the information that light provides that the brain uses to generate sight...how can instant vision possibly work?

This question has not been addressed.

ADDED TO PREVIOUS POST: Because the light does not provide information. It reveals information through it's properties. Light does the same thing whether we see in delayed time or real time. You are making it appear as if seeing in real time removes the very light we need to see. It does not.

 

[Michael S. Pearl]

light does not provide information. It reveals information through it's properties.

Light which reaches the eye is transformed into information during the eye->brain processing. The light travels, and traveling necessarily takes time.

[The brain] uses what is seen and applies it to one's repertoire of experiences to categorize it for later retrieval.

Categorization is part of assessment. Assessment is not necessary for seeing to occur. Assessment, when it occurs, is always and necessarily sequentially posterior to the physiological process which effects seeing.

 

[peacegirl]

light does not provide information. It reveals information through it's properties.

Light which reaches the eye is transformed into information during the eye->brain processing. The light travels, and traveling necessarily takes time.

[The brain] uses what is seen and applies it to one's repertoire of experiences to categorize it for later retrieval.

Categorization is part of assessment. Assessment is not necessary for seeing to occur. Assessment, when it occurs, is always and necessarily sequentially posterior to the physiological process which effects seeing.

 

[peacegirl]

light does not provide information. It reveals information through it's properties.

Light which reaches the eye is transformed into information during the eye->brain processing. The light travels, and traveling necessarily takes time.

[The brain] uses what is seen and applies it to one's repertoire of experiences to categorize it for later retrieval.

Categorization is part of assessment. Assessment is not necessary for seeing to occur. Assessment, when it occurs, is always and necessarily sequentially posterior to the physiological process which effects seeing.

I agree that what we see comes first before any assessment can be made.

 

[DBT]

And what we do see is based on the light that was emitted or reflected by the objects in our environment, which entails travel time between the objects and the eyes and brain for processing and representing as vision.

Which means that the authors claim is wrong.

 

[peacegirl]

And what we do see is based on the light that was emitted or reflected by the objects in our environment, which entails travel time between the objects and the eyes and brain for processing and representing as vision.

Which means that the authors claim is wrong.

You’re rejecting the whole claim because you won’t allow yourself to see that there is no violation of physics. Light travels at 186,000 miles a second but light that is reflected off an object (the wavelength/frequency) does not become the pattern that takes on a life of its own. The object’s reflection is constantly being replaced with new photons but we are seeing that object now. If the object changes its characteristics, we will see this change instantly, not in delayed time. You keep thinking in terms of traveling (reflected) light that brings the past to us through space/time, which is why you’re unable to visualize how this works or that it even can work. I know this is hard. I hope you don’t give up.

 

[pood]

And what we do see is based on the light that was emitted or reflected by the objects in our environment, which entails travel time between the objects and the eyes and brain for processing and representing as vision.

Which means that the authors claim is wrong.

You’re rejecting the whole claim because you won’t allow yourself to see that there is no violation of physics. Light travels at 186,000 miles a second but light that is reflected off an object (the wavelength/frequency) does not become the pattern that takes on a life of its own. The object’s reflection is constantly being replaced with new photons but we are seeing that object now. If the object changes its characteristics, we will see this change instantly, not in delayed time. You keep thinking in terms of traveling (reflected) light that brings the past to us through space/time, which is why you’re unable to visualize how this works or that it even can work. I know this is hard. I hope you don’t give up.

Utter twaddle from first to last, as always.

 

[DBT]

And what we do see is based on the light that was emitted or reflected by the objects in our environment, which entails travel time between the objects and the eyes and brain for processing and representing as vision.

Which means that the authors claim is wrong.

You’re rejecting the whole claim because you won’t allow yourself to see that there is no violation of physics. Light travels at 186,000 miles a second but light that is reflected off an object (the wavelength/frequency) does not become the pattern that takes on a life of its own. The object’s reflection is constantly being replaced with new photons but we are seeing that object now. If the object changes its characteristics, we will see this change instantly, not in delayed time. You keep thinking in terms of traveling (reflected) light that brings the past to us through space/time, which is why you’re unable to visualize how this works or that it even can work. I know this is hard. I hope you don’t give up.

We only see the object changing because it is either emitting or reflecting light. Without the light, we see nothing. Pitch black.

Quite simply, we don't see objects without light. The eyes detect light. That is their function. Easily testable, go into a dark room, flip the light switch......

 

[peacegirl]

And what we do see is based on the light that was emitted or reflected by the objects in our environment, which entails travel time between the objects and the eyes and brain for processing and representing as vision.

Which means that the authors claim is wrong.

You’re rejecting the whole claim because you won’t allow yourself to see that there is no violation of physics. Light travels at 186,000 miles a second but light that is reflected off an object (the wavelength/frequency) does not become the pattern that takes on a life of its own. The object’s reflection is constantly being replaced with new photons but we are seeing that object now. If the object changes its characteristics, we will see this change instantly, not in delayed time. You keep thinking in terms of traveling (reflected) light that brings the past to us through space/time, which is why you’re unable to visualize how this works or that it even can work. I know this is hard. I hope you don’t give up.

Utter twaddle from first to last, as always.

Typical Pood. Just can't accept the truth.

 

[peacegirl]

And what we do see is based on the light that was emitted or reflected by the objects in our environment, which entails travel time between the objects and the eyes and brain for processing and representing as vision.

Which means that the authors claim is wrong.

You’re rejecting the whole claim because you won’t allow yourself to see that there is no violation of physics. Light travels at 186,000 miles a second but light that is reflected off an object (the wavelength/frequency) does not become the pattern that takes on a life of its own. The object’s reflection is constantly being replaced with new photons but we are seeing that object now. If the object changes its characteristics, we will see this change instantly, not in delayed time. You keep thinking in terms of traveling (reflected) light that brings the past to us through space/time, which is why you’re unable to visualize how this works or that it even can work. I know this is hard. I hope you don’t give up.

We only see the object changing because it is either emitting or reflecting light. Without the light, we see nothing. Pitch black.

Quite simply, we don't see objects without light. The eyes detect light. That is their function. Easily testable, go into a dark room, flip the light switch......

Our eyes detect light. There is no gap between the light that is at our eyes and the object seen.

 

[DBT]

And what we do see is based on the light that was emitted or reflected by the objects in our environment, which entails travel time between the objects and the eyes and brain for processing and representing as vision.

Which means that the authors claim is wrong.

You’re rejecting the whole claim because you won’t allow yourself to see that there is no violation of physics. Light travels at 186,000 miles a second but light that is reflected off an object (the wavelength/frequency) does not become the pattern that takes on a life of its own. The object’s reflection is constantly being replaced with new photons but we are seeing that object now. If the object changes its characteristics, we will see this change instantly, not in delayed time. You keep thinking in terms of traveling (reflected) light that brings the past to us through space/time, which is why you’re unable to visualize how this works or that it even can work. I know this is hard. I hope you don’t give up.

We only see the object changing because it is either emitting or reflecting light. Without the light, we see nothing. Pitch black.

Quite simply, we don't see objects without light. The eyes detect light. That is their function. Easily testable, go into a dark room, flip the light switch......

Our eyes detect light. There is no gap between the light that is at our eyes and the object seen.

The light that is "at our eyes" travelled from the object to the eyes, and that entails distance and time.

There is no way around it.

 

[peacegirl]

And what we do see is based on the light that was emitted or reflected by the objects in our environment, which entails travel time between the objects and the eyes and brain for processing and representing as vision.

Which means that the authors claim is wrong.

You’re rejecting the whole claim because you won’t allow yourself to see that there is no violation of physics. Light travels at 186,000 miles a second but light that is reflected off an object (the wavelength/frequency) does not become the pattern that takes on a life of its own. The object’s reflection is constantly being replaced with new photons but we are seeing that object now. If the object changes its characteristics, we will see this change instantly, not in delayed time. You keep thinking in terms of traveling (reflected) light that brings the past to us through space/time, which is why you’re unable to visualize how this works or that it even can work. I know this is hard. I hope you don’t give up.

We only see the object changing because it is either emitting or reflecting light. Without the light, we see nothing. Pitch black.

Quite simply, we don't see objects without light. The eyes detect light. That is their function. Easily testable, go into a dark room, flip the light switch......

Our eyes detect light. There is no gap between the light that is at our eyes and the object seen.

The light that is "at our eyes" travelled from the object to the eyes, and that entails distance and time.

There is no way around it.

That’s where you’re wrong! Light is always traveling but the image is not.

 

[DBT]

And what we do see is based on the light that was emitted or reflected by the objects in our environment, which entails travel time between the objects and the eyes and brain for processing and representing as vision.

Which means that the authors claim is wrong.

You’re rejecting the whole claim because you won’t allow yourself to see that there is no violation of physics. Light travels at 186,000 miles a second but light that is reflected off an object (the wavelength/frequency) does not become the pattern that takes on a life of its own. The object’s reflection is constantly being replaced with new photons but we are seeing that object now. If the object changes its characteristics, we will see this change instantly, not in delayed time. You keep thinking in terms of traveling (reflected) light that brings the past to us through space/time, which is why you’re unable to visualize how this works or that it even can work. I know this is hard. I hope you don’t give up.

We only see the object changing because it is either emitting or reflecting light. Without the light, we see nothing. Pitch black.

Quite simply, we don't see objects without light. The eyes detect light. That is their function. Easily testable, go into a dark room, flip the light switch......

Our eyes detect light. There is no gap between the light that is at our eyes and the object seen.

The light that is "at our eyes" travelled from the object to the eyes, and that entails distance and time.

There is no way around it.

That’s where you’re wrong! Light is always traveling but the image is not.

There is no travelling image. Light conveys information that the eyes convert into nerve impulses which the visual cortex processes and uses to generate mental imagery in the form of sight. We see the world around us through the means of this process.