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Shooting reported at Paris magazine Charlie Hebdo

12 Dead in Paris Murder Spree - Obama flashback: "The future must not belong to those who slander Islam"

The previous thread seemed to minimize the scale of this tragedy so in the category of "Islam is a religion of peace", much of the World's morning news greeting was horrific:

http://abcnews.go.com/International...rench-satirical-paper-police-witness-28050653

PARIS (AP) — Masked gunmen stormed the offices of a satirical newspaper that caricatured the Prophet Muhammad, methodically killing 12 people Wednesday, including the editor, before escaping in a car. It was France's deadliest terrorist attack in half a century.

Shouting "Allahu akbar!" as they fired, the men also spoke fluent, unaccented French in the military-style noon-time attack on the weekly paper Charlie Hebdo, located near Paris' Bastille monument. The publication's depictions of Islam have drawn condemnation and threats before — it was firebombed in 2011 — although it also satirized other religions and political figures.

President Francois Hollande said it was a terrorist act "of exceptional barbarism," adding that other attacks have been thwarted in France in recent weeks. Fears have been running high in France and elsewhere in Europe that jihadis returning from conflicts in Syria and Iraq will stage attacks at home.


...France raised its security alert to the highest level and reinforced protective measures at houses of worship, stores, media offices and transportation. Schools closed across Paris, although thousands of people jammed Republique Square near the site of the shooting to honor the victims, waving pens and papers reading "Je suis Charlie" — "I am Charlie." Similar rallies were held in London's Trafalgar Square as well as Madrid, Berlin and Brussels.

There was no immediate claim of responsibility for the shootings, which the Paris prosecutor said also wounded 11 people — four of them seriously — and was condemned by world leaders as an attack on freedom of expression. Supporters of the militant Islamic State group praised it.

...The staff was in an editorial meeting and the gunmen headed straight for the paper's editor, Stephane Charbonnier — widely known by his pen name Charb — killing him and his police bodyguard first, said Christophe Crepin, a police union spokesman. Minutes later, two men strolled out to a black car waiting below, calmly firing on a police officer, with one gunman shooting him in the head as he writhed on the ground, according to video and a man who watched in fear from his home across the street.

The witness, who refused to allow his name to be used because he was afraid for his safety, said the attackers were so methodical that he first mistook them for France's elite anti-terrorism forces. Then they fired on the officer.


"They knew exactly what they had to do and exactly where to shoot. While one kept watch and checked that the traffic was good for them, the other one delivered the final coup de grace," he said. "They ran back to the car. The moment they got in, the car drove off almost casually."

The witness added: "I think they were extremely well-trained, and they knew exactly down to the centimeter and even to the second what they had to do."

Eight journalists, a guest and two police officers were killed, said Paris prosecutor Francois Molins, giving a partial breakdown of the 12 dead. Among those killed were Bernard Maris, an economist who was a contributor to the newspaper and was heard regularly on French radio, and cartoonists Georges Wolinski and Berbard Verlhac, better known as Tignous.

"Hey! We avenged the Prophet Muhammad! We killed Charlie Hebdo," one of the men shouted in French, according to video shot from a nearby building and broadcast on French TV. Other video showed two gunmen in black at a crossroads who appeared to fire down one of the streets. A cry of "Allahu akbar!" — Arabic for "God is great" — could be heard amid the gunshots.

The video showed the killers moving deliberately and calmly, with one even bendnig over to toss a fallen shoe back into the small black car before it sped off. The car was later found abandoned in northern Paris, the prosecutor said, and they hijacked a Renault Clio. There were conflicting accounts of whether the manhunt was for two or three attackers.

Corinne Rey, the cartoonist who said she was forced to let the gunmen in, said the men spoke fluent French and claimed to be from al-Qaida. In an interview with the newspaper l'Humanite, she said the entire shooting lasted perhaps five minutes, and she hid under a desk.

The security analyst group Stratfor said the gunmen appeared to be well-trained, "from the way they handled their weapons, moved and shot. These attackers conducted a successful attack, using what they knew, instead of attempting to conduct an attack beyond their capability, failing as a result."...



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Islam is a complex religion, like Christianity.

The books of Islam can be used by those wanting to do violence and by those wanting peace. Just as the Christian books can be used for either.

The fact that Muslims are carrying out violent attacks has nothing to do with their religion.

They are responding to political events and have political goals. Religion is just what the leaders with political goals use to motivate their supporters who are exploited, even to the point of suicide.
 
Islam is a complex religion, like Christianity.

The books of Islam can be used by those wanting to do violence and by those wanting peace. Just as the Christian books can be used for either.

The fact that Muslims are carrying out violent attacks has nothing to do with their religion.

They are responding to political events and have political goals. Religion is just what the leaders with political goals use to motivate their supporters who are exploited, even to the point of suicide.

Untermensche, there is simply no violent act you will attribute to religion.

If your stated aim is avenging the Prophet (peace be upon him) and you shout 'God is Great', it still has nothing to do with Islam. The fact that it was targeted on the magazine that allegedly insulted the Prophet (peace be upon him) is also no evidence it has to do with Islam.

Next you'll be telling us that going to mosque isn't motivated by Islam either.
 
Obama flashback, to the same speech from which the (mis)quote in the OP/Title [see maxparrish's post above] was cherry-picked:

"There are no words that excuse the killing of innocents. There is no video that justifies an attack on an Embassy. There is no slander that provides an excuse for people to burn a restaurant in Lebanon, or destroy a school in Tunis, or cause death and destruction in Pakistan."

Context, max, context...
 
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I am concerned that I will be forced to submit to Islam or my family will be in peril. Living free may be hard to achieve.
 
Islam is a complex religion, like Christianity.

The books of Islam can be used by those wanting to do violence and by those wanting peace. Just as the Christian books can be used for either.

The fact that Muslims are carrying out violent attacks has nothing to do with their religion.

They are responding to political events and have political goals. Religion is just what the leaders with political goals use to motivate their supporters who are exploited, even to the point of suicide.

Untermensche, there is simply no violent act you will attribute to religion.

If your stated aim is avenging the Prophet (peace be upon him) and you shout 'God is Great', it still has nothing to do with Islam. The fact that it was targeted on the magazine that allegedly insulted the Prophet (peace be upon him) is also no evidence it has to do with Islam.

Next you'll be telling us that going to mosque isn't motivated by Islam either.

Religion is the insanity evil people use to get people to do evil things.

But religion is a tool. It is not the root cause.

The root cause is the real world and the events in the real world.
 
Wolinski death ! Cant believe it.
Cabu was even more iconic here, it's going to take time to imagine political cartooning without him.

Is this a good time to ask what is the maximum percentage of muslim country of origin that should be allowed in France?

If say France eventually was 60% Muslim country of origin what would happen to the society and government?

Can't let liberal notions of equality be the way you become a slave to a radicalized sharia government. Would that classify as irony?
And that's exactly the kind of post that, if you were a public figure, would have earned you a scathing drawing in Charlie Hebdo (Charb and Tignous were great at tackling this kind of nonsense)
 
Obama flashback, to the same speech from which the (mis)quote in the OP/Title was cherry-picked:

"There are no words that excuse the killing of innocents. There is no video that justifies an attack on an Embassy. There is no slander that provides an excuse for people to burn a restaurant in Lebanon, or destroy a school in Tunis, or cause death and destruction in Pakistan."

Context, max, context...
Like he gives a fuck about context.
I am concerned that I will be forced to submit to Islam or my family will be in peril. Living free may be hard to achieve.
Yeah, you think lots of things.

Here is Higgins Easy To Remember What Will Actually Happen to you List:
  • You will likely have your life negatively affected by corporations abusing their influence with Government
  • You will likely have your privacy invaded by the Federal Government
  • You will not likely have your life influenced by Islam in any way, shape, or form
 
aeebee50 said:
I am concerned that I will be forced to submit to Islam or my family will be in peril. Living free may be hard to achieve.

Why are you worried about that? Muslims haven't won an offensive war against a non muslim country since 1420. They are still grotesquely underdeveloped. They can't cooperate. They can't produce their own weapons (not on enough of a scale). They are no real threat.

What he have is muslim leaders, concerned about violence between muslims, attempt to redirect it outwards, towards non muslims. This in turn favors non muslim leaders, who use fear of islam as a means of rallying their own followers, again directing violence back towards the muslims.
 
Untermensche, there is simply no violent act you will attribute to religion.

If your stated aim is avenging the Prophet (peace be upon him) and you shout 'God is Great', it still has nothing to do with Islam. The fact that it was targeted on the magazine that allegedly insulted the Prophet (peace be upon him) is also no evidence it has to do with Islam.

Next you'll be telling us that going to mosque isn't motivated by Islam either.

Religion is the insanity evil people use to get people to do evil things.

But religion is a tool. It is not the root cause.

The root cause is the real world and the events in the real world.

no, untermensche.

No-one would believe that depicting the Prophet (peace be upon him) is a capital offense, but for religion.

but frankly, if you believe this has 'nothing to do with religion', nothing I say could possibly change your mind. You have your own religion which involves believing the utterly, breathtakingly, gobsmackingly absurd.
 
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aeebee50 said:
I am concerned that I will be forced to submit to Islam or my family will be in peril. Living free may be hard to achieve.

Why are you worried about that? Muslims haven't won an offensive war against a non muslim country since 1420.

Well, the tide is generally considered to have turned for good in 1683 (Siege of Vienna). Not that this affects your point that we have little to fear from muslim countries in terms of conventional warfare. Not that anyone ever says we do.

One just hates to ignore Poland's great military victories.
 
Untermensche, there is simply no violent act you will attribute to religion.

If your stated aim is avenging the Prophet (peace be upon him) and you shout 'God is Great', it still has nothing to do with Islam. The fact that it was targeted on the magazine that allegedly insulted the Prophet (peace be upon him) is also no evidence it has to do with Islam.

Next you'll be telling us that going to mosque isn't motivated by Islam either.

Religion is the insanity evil people use to get people to do evil things.

But religion is a tool. It is not the root cause.

The root cause is the real world and the events in the real world.
Reliousity is PART of the 'real world' though. I don't see how they can be separated.
 
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