Solar will soon be cheaper than coal fueled power

[Loren Pechtel]

Nobody has claimed it's stopped cold.

You said it needed 100% backup from conventional sources. That is a claim that it is stopped cold.

I don't have any good data on power production when it goes behind clouds but we can get a decent back of the envelope from photography:

No, we can't. Partly because you're looking at visual light intensity, and not power generation, but mainly because this doesn't touch your core assumption here - that solar panels are designed for cloudless days and anything short of that results in an unexpected hole that has to be plugged somehow. Or to put it another way, that solar power is designed by idiots.

I'm in a country where horizon to horizon cloud is normal. We manage to use solar power just fine. Therefore your contention that some special measure must be taken when clouds appear is nonsense.

The darkest of clouds will drop the production below what the inverter needs to run.

 

[lpetrich]

Solar has a place and that is for people who are ignorant of the costs they are imposing on society to feel good about themselves.

Evidence presented: {}

dismal, you might enjoy reading this: Renewable Energy Boosted By Shift From Green Idealism To "Hard Economics"

HSBC, in a research report entitled “The Rise of Renewables,” says renewable energy is now becoming mainstream, boosted by a shift away from “green idealism” – that underpinned many over-generous and badly managed subsidy schemes – to “hard economics”, where the costs of the technology will win out over fossil fuels.

The report is a follow-up to its recent assessment that fossil fuels investments risk being stranded as a result of climate change policies, changing economics, including plunging commodity prices, and the impact of new technologies such as solar and storage.

In terms of actually producing energy it's a mole on a gnats ass.

 Growth of photovoltaics -- approximately exponential, from 100 megawatts in 1991 to 100 gigawatts in 2012. World electricity consumption was about 2.3 terawatts in 2008 ( Electric energy consumption) So it will take 16 - 17 years to become 100% of world electricity production.

 

[Togo]

You said it needed 100% backup from conventional sources. That is a claim that it is stopped cold.

I don't have any good data on power production when it goes behind clouds but we can get a decent back of the envelope from photography:

No, we can't. Partly because you're looking at visual light intensity, and not power generation, but mainly because this doesn't touch your core assumption here - that solar panels are designed for cloudless days and anything short of that results in an unexpected hole that has to be plugged somehow. Or to put it another way, that solar power is designed by idiots.

I'm in a country where horizon to horizon cloud is normal. We manage to use solar power just fine. Therefore your contention that some special measure must be taken when clouds appear is nonsense.

The darkest of clouds will drop the production below what the inverter needs to run.

Great, but that happens when thunderstorms are directly overhead, which is about once every two years over here. Yet you're claiming that it needs 100% backup from other sources.

Nuclear reactors get shut down whenever there is a safety hazard, or for regular inspection. That's what prevents accidents and allows their safety record to be quite good. How often do you suppose that happens? Do they need 100% backup?

 

[Loren Pechtel]

You said it needed 100% backup from conventional sources. That is a claim that it is stopped cold.

I don't have any good data on power production when it goes behind clouds but we can get a decent back of the envelope from photography:

No, we can't. Partly because you're looking at visual light intensity, and not power generation, but mainly because this doesn't touch your core assumption here - that solar panels are designed for cloudless days and anything short of that results in an unexpected hole that has to be plugged somehow. Or to put it another way, that solar power is designed by idiots.

I'm in a country where horizon to horizon cloud is normal. We manage to use solar power just fine. Therefore your contention that some special measure must be taken when clouds appear is nonsense.

The darkest of clouds will drop the production below what the inverter needs to run.

Great, but that happens when thunderstorms are directly overhead, which is about once every two years over here. Yet you're claiming that it needs 100% backup from other sources.

Nuclear reactors get shut down whenever there is a safety hazard, or for regular inspection. That's what prevents accidents and allows their safety record to be quite good. How often do you suppose that happens? Do they need 100% backup?

When it comes to conventional powerplants there is far more than 100% backup.

The problem with solar is that all the panels in an area must be considered one plant because the weather will take them all out at the same time.