Supreme Court upholds Arizona redistricting commission

[Nice Squirrel]

I like the truncated 1st:

Congress shall make no law.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

I like the truncated 1st:

Congress shall make no law.

The current Congress is going out of its way to be the most awesome advocate of that ever.

 

[fromderinside]

I like the truncated 1st:

The current Congress is going out of its way to be the most awesome advocate of that ever.

What?

The House has voted to repeal ACA again?

 

[dismal]

Um, because the Constitution does specifically say this power belongs to a state legislature?

Arizona Constitution Article 4, Part 1 Sections 1 & 2:

Section 1. (1) Senate; house of representatives; reservation of power to people. The legislative authority of the state shall be vested in the legislature, consisting of a senate and a house of representatives, but the people reserve the power to propose laws and amendments to the constitution and to enact or reject such laws and amendments at the polls, independently of the legislature; and they also reserve, for use at their own option, the power to approve or reject at the polls any act, or item, section, or part of any act, of the legislature.

(2) Initiative power. The first of these reserved powers is the initiative. Under this power ten per centum of the qualified electors shall have the right to propose any measure, and fifteen per centum shall have the right to propose any amendment to the constitution.

The Arizona Constitution says the People reserved the right to also make any law or any amendment to their constitution.

And you are quoting Arizona law because it trumps the US Constitution?

 

[Tom Sawyer]

And you are quoting Arizona law because it trumps the US Constitution?

Why would it need to trump the US Constitution when the US Constitution is perfectly in line with the ruling?

 

[jonatha]

The text of the decision makes it clear that there is both precedent and constitutional reason backing it up.

Ginsberg's remark about the people having the power of the legislature, which led to all this fulminating, was an afterthought - hardly more significant to the opinion than a footnote.

 

[dismal]

And you are quoting Arizona law because it trumps the US Constitution?

Why would it need to trump the US Constitution when the US Constitution is perfectly in line with the ruling?

It is? My copy says this power belongs to the legislature.

- - - Updated - - -

The text of the decision makes it clear that there is both precedent and constitutional reason backing it up.

Ginsberg's remark about the people having the power of the legislature, which led to all this fulminating, was an afterthought - hardly more significant to the opinion than a footnote.

"have the power of the legislature" not equal "the legislature".

If the legislature didn't do it, the legislature didn't do it.

 

[ksen]

Arizona Constitution Article 4, Part 1 Sections 1 & 2:

Section 1. (1) Senate; house of representatives; reservation of power to people. The legislative authority of the state shall be vested in the legislature, consisting of a senate and a house of representatives, but the people reserve the power to propose laws and amendments to the constitution and to enact or reject such laws and amendments at the polls, independently of the legislature; and they also reserve, for use at their own option, the power to approve or reject at the polls any act, or item, section, or part of any act, of the legislature.

(2) Initiative power. The first of these reserved powers is the initiative. Under this power ten per centum of the qualified electors shall have the right to propose any measure, and fifteen per centum shall have the right to propose any amendment to the constitution.

The Arizona Constitution says the People reserved the right to also make any law or any amendment to their constitution.

And you are quoting Arizona law because it trumps the US Constitution?

How does the Arizona constitution trump the US constitution in this situation?

What is it about Art. 4 Secs 1 & 2 that you think goes against the US constitution?

- - - Updated - - -

I guess we now know some on the Right actually have limits when it comes to States' Rights.

- - - Updated - - -

If the legislature didn't do it, the legislature didn't do it.

Good thing the Arizona constitution defines legislature as "senate, house of representatives and reservation of power to the people." So the legislature did do it.

 

[dismal]

Good thing the Arizona constitution defines legislature as "senate, house of representatives and reservation of power to the people." So the legislature did do it.

That's not what the language you posted says.

Can you muster an argument that does not involve pretending things don't say what they say?

 

[Tom Sawyer]

Why would it need to trump the US Constitution when the US Constitution is perfectly in line with the ruling?

It is? My copy says this power belongs to the legislature.

And who defines what the word "legislature" means? If there's a dispute and two parties have two different definitions of it, who does your constitution give the authority of deciding which one is the legal definition to?

 

[dismal]

It is? My copy says this power belongs to the legislature.

And who defines what the word "legislature" means? If there's a dispute and two parties have two different definitions of it, who does your constitution give the authority of deciding which one is the legal definition to?

Do you really need someone to tell you what a state legislature is?

 

[ksen]

Good thing the Arizona constitution defines legislature as "senate, house of representatives and reservation of power to the people." So the legislature did do it.

That's not what the language you posted says.

Can you muster an argument that does not involve pretending things don't say what they say?

The article of the AZ constitution clearly says the people of AZ have legislative authority.

 

[dismal]

That's not what the language you posted says.

Can you muster an argument that does not involve pretending things don't say what they say?

The article of the AZ constitution clearly says the people of AZ have legislative authority.

Does it say they are the legislature?

What you posted so far suggests not.

 

[Keith&Co.]

The article of the AZ constitution clearly says the people of AZ have legislative authority.

Does it say they are the legislature?

What you posted so far suggests not.

The definition of 'legislature' is 'a group, usually elected, that has the power to create and change laws.' If the voters can change laws by referendum or lynching their congress, or by any other means, then they're a legislature.

 

[Sarpedon]

So let me get this straight dismal, you are essentially arguing that the clause in which the people of Arizona in their own state constitution reserved certain powers to themselves is UnConstitutional because it might cause them to pass laws that the Federal constitution, written a century earlier, mind, rather carelessly reserves for the state 'legislature' because thats how the states did it in 1785?

I do so love how conservatives pretend to be for states rights, but only when it suits them.

 

[dismal]

Does it say they are the legislature?

What you posted so far suggests not.

The definition of 'legislature' is 'a group, usually elected, that has the power to create and change laws.' If the voters can change laws by referendum or lynching their congress, or by any other means, then they're a legislature.

No, being able to propose laws and vote on referendums does not make you the legislature.

 

[dismal]

So let me get this straight dismal, you are essentially arguing that the clause in which the people of Arizona in their own state constitution reserved certain powers to themselves is UnConstitutional because it might cause them to pass laws that the Federal constitution, written a century earlier, mind, rather carelessly reserves for the state 'legislature' because thats how the states did it in 1785?

I do so love how conservatives pretend to be for states rights, but only when it suits them.

If you would like to make an argument on the topic or directed at something I have said I may respond.

 

[ksen]

The article of the AZ constitution clearly says the people of AZ have legislative authority.

Does it say they are the legislature?

What you posted so far suggests not.

No, it doesn't. I got a bit too zealous with that claim.

However, legislative authority does rest with the people of AZ per their constitution.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

And who defines what the word "legislature" means? If there's a dispute and two parties have two different definitions of it, who does your constitution give the authority of deciding which one is the legal definition to?

Do you really need someone to tell you what a state legislature is?

No, it's a body whom the citizens of a state have voted to represent them. Like electoral commissions or congress.

 

[Keith&Co.]

The definition of 'legislature' is 'a group, usually elected, that has the power to create and change laws.' If the voters can change laws by referendum or lynching their congress, or by any other means, then they're a legislature.

No, being able to propose laws and vote on referendums does not make you the legislature.

Well, you were getting silly with the courts defining a ham sandwich as a legislature. The dictionary seems to support this decision quite well, better than your imaginary court would have.