The Jewish Jesus

[steve_bank]

Jumping over from the thread on religious texts.

Here you go NR, The Jewish Jesus


TV show by a rabbi on Jesus.

The Jewish Jesus

If you search on Jewish Jesus you will get a number of hits.

Marketing 101, if you are thinking of selling what you think is a new idea do a market search first and see what you are up against.

 

[No Robots]

Jumping over from the thread on religious texts.

Here you go NR, The Jewish Jesus


TV show by a rabbi on Jesus.

The Jewish Jesus

If you search on Jewish Jesus you will get a number of hits.

Marketing 101, if you are thinking of selling what you think is a new idea do a market search first and see what you are up against.

I'm not proposing anything new when I talk about the Jewish Jesus. All I'm saying is that this is a huge phenomenon that is growing. I'm just helping it grow by presenting it to the internet atheist community.

 

[No Robots]

In response to your post in the other thread:

It certainly is the case that there is diversity of opinion among Jews. I have made myself quite clear about which Jewish thinkers I follow.

 

[No Robots]

Btw, thanks for starting this thread. No need to burden SLD's thread with all our rambling discussion.

 

[Politesse]

The.. knowledge that Jesus was Jewish is a "new idea"? I'm pretty sure everyone has known that for roughly 2010 years.

 

[No Robots]

The.. knowledge that Jesus was Jewish is a "new idea"? I'm pretty sure everyone has known that for roughly 2010 years.

Weird, then, how folks around here seem to think he's a Greco-Roman demigod, crucified in outer space and who counts African pygmies among his original followers.

 

[TomC]

The.. knowledge that Jesus was Jewish is a "new idea"? I'm pretty sure everyone has known that for roughly 2010 years.

Weird, then, how folks around here seem to think he's a Greco-Roman demigod, crucified in outer space and who counts African pygmies among his original followers.

Probably because you are confusing Jesus with Christ. Jesus was a Jewish guy. Christ is a miracle working demigod who Ascended to Heaven and became part of a pantheon known as The Trinity.
Tom

 

[No Robots]

The.. knowledge that Jesus was Jewish is a "new idea"? I'm pretty sure everyone has known that for roughly 2010 years.

Weird, then, how folks around here seem to think he's a Greco-Roman demigod, crucified in outer space and who counts African pygmies among his original followers.

Probably because you are confusing Jesus with Christ. Jesus was a Jewish guy. Christ is a miracle working demigod who Ascended to Heaven and became part of a pantheon known as The Trinity.
Tom

This attempt to divide Jesus from Christ is nothing but a last-ditch attempt to preserve something non-Jewish in this whole matter. As Hyam Maccoby puts it:

While progress is being made towards the recovery of the historical, as opposed to the mythical, Jesus, desperate measures continue to try and preserve Jesus's uniqueness in some way that still makes Christianity the highest religion.

By making Jesus and Christ out to be separate entities, Gentiles hope to preserve for themselves a little dress-up pagan demi-god, rather than face having to deal with someone whom they would regard as just another mouthy Jew.

 

[steve_bank]

A Jesus if there was one singular flesh and blood person would have been Jewish.

The gospel depiction as I understand mythology is a demigod.

God for a father and a human mother.
Some but not all the powers of the god father.
The demigod dies in an heroic act and goes to be with the god.

I expect the gospel Jesus would have been blasphemy to Jews, the idea of a human being a son of god.

The demigod Jesus would resonate with Greek and Roman gentiles.



There are no contemporaneous accounts of the gospel Jesus. The gospel Jesus is a fiction. IMO words attributed to Jesus are a conflation of several people and events. The result of oral communications being the main method of communication. Adding to that literary license of the writers.

NR is preaching an idea of a pure biblical based Jewishness, a Jewish Jesus based on the gospel Jesus. The world is becoming Jewish and will be one big collective.

He is combining Marx and his world Jewish idea. Never mind Marx was raised Christian and became atheist.

 

[No Robots]

I expect the gospel Jesus would have been blasphemy to Jews, the idea of a human being a son of god.

Here is an actual Jewish account of the principle of oneness with God:

What sources support the premise that a Jew can get closer to G‑d through communication with a rebbe? Moreover, doesn’t Judaism frown on intermediaries between humans and G‑d? The answer lies in the mitzvah u’ledavka bo,7 which means to cleave to G‑d. Maimonides,8 based on the words of the Talmud, asks, “How is it possible that one should cleave to G‑d? G‑d is fire and we are physical. One who touches fire will burn.” The Sages answer, “‘To cleave unto Him’ means that we should cleave to wise men and to their disciples,” i.e., tzaddikim. We cleave through connection with a tzaddik, who is one with G‑d.

Gentiles generally have a very superficial understanding of Judaism.

 

[steve_bank]

I expect the gospel Jesus would have been blasphemy to Jews, the idea of a human being a son of god.

Here is an actual Jewish account of the principle of oneness with God:

What sources support the premise that a Jew can get closer to G‑d through communication with a rebbe? Moreover, doesn’t Judaism frown on intermediaries between humans and G‑d? The answer lies in the mitzvah u’ledavka bo,7 which means to cleave to G‑d. Maimonides,8 based on the words of the Talmud, asks, “How is it possible that one should cleave to G‑d? G‑d is fire and we are physical. One who touches fire will burn.” The Sages answer, “‘To cleave unto Him’ means that we should cleave to wise men and to their disciples,” i.e., tzaddikim. We cleave through connection with a tzaddik, who is one with G‑d.

Gentiles generally have a very superficial understanding of Judaism.

I think it is you who do not understand the Jewish community today let alone 2000 years ago. Your premise is that because people read Jewish literature IOW the bible they are Jewish and the world is going to your imagined version of Jesus and Judaism.

Do you keep kosher? I don't, but I do like Hebrew National hot dogs. Does that make me Jewish? They make great pickles too.

And now we jump over to the long running thread on an historical Jesus....

For all practical proposes you appear to be the same as Christians. You make the loosely defined gospel Jesus into your own version.

 

[No Robots]

Do you keep kosher? I don't, but I do like Hebrew National hot dogs. Does that make me Jewish? They make great pickles too.

 

[DBT]

So did Jesus come only for the lost sheep of the house of Israel or for all nations, as in Matthew 24:14?

 

[No Robots]

So did Jesus come only for the lost sheep of the house of Israel or for all nations, as in Matthew 24:14?

Great question. The answer is that, like all great revolutionaries, Jesus expected quick success at first. He was solely focused at this time on the house of Israel. But those dreams of success were crushed. Over time, he came to see that the salvation of Israel was dependent on the salvation of the whole of mankind, and vice versa. His limited nationalist vision was killed, and in its place was born a new universalist vision. This universalism was always latent in Judaism, but Jesus realized that the time had come to openly proclaim it. The heathen had matured to the point of being able to receive at least the rudiments of Judaism.

 

[DBT]

So did Jesus come only for the lost sheep of the house of Israel or for all nations, as in Matthew 24:14?

Great question. The answer is that, like all great revolutionaries, Jesus expected quick success at first. He was solely focused at this time on the house of Israel. But those dreams of success were crushed. Over time, he came to see that the salvation of Israel was dependent on the salvation of the whole of mankind, and vice versa. His limited nationalist vision was killed, and in its place was born a new universalist vision. This universalism was always latent in Judaism, but Jesus realized that the time had come to openly proclaim it. The heathen had matured to the point of being able to receive at least the rudiments of Judaism.

Was it Jesus or his followers? How do we know? Paul appeared to be the universalist, but he had never met Jesus the man.