The Relationship Between Knowledge, Intelligence, and Freedom

[rousseau]

There is a lot of talk about free will at this forum, but not enough talk of freedom. I think most of us can agree that that people are 'free in the world' in the sense that they are free to move and act, but one thing we don't often discuss, and something I think about a lot are our degrees of being free within that framework.

To me one of the main kickers here that lends itself to our degree of being free in the world is a. intelligence, and b. the knowledge that follows from intelligence. A simple maxim could go something like we cannot do, think, or feel that which we cannot perceive. In a nutshell, knowing more about how the world works, and about yourself, opens up avenues of action that could not have been taken had you not had the knowledge of that avenue.

Take an extreme example, a small child with little to no knowledge of the world. Essentially they have no control over themselves or how they act in the world. Similarly, even as adults our behaviour can only go as far as the bounds of what we know, and so those who know very little will be very unfree, relative to those who know a lot.

This is where I think you get into talk from the more arrogant varieties of intelligent people of persons being 'automatons'. To me, it's more that certain brands of people know so little about the world, and have no way of perceiving those things, and so their day to day routine is usually very simple and unexceptional. Their freedom is bound by their knowledge or lack thereof.

 

[steve_bank]

There is no possible test to acess free will.

Knowledge can be tested.

Intelligence can be tested within the bounds of whoever designs the test and what areas are being covered. MENSA used to a free online sample test.

I do not think knowledge directly equates to freedom, I'd use the word understanding. A PHD in philosophy without real world experience does not lead to understanding. The term street smarts vs academic knowledge.

Freedom is a definition, whatever fits the definition is freedom. I think the common meaning is the latitude to choose your own way without structural political and other limitations.

Atheist freedom of life path vs religious social coercion.





It was a mix of general knowledge, pattern recognition, and multidimensional reasoning based on high school level math and science. Not Much different in form than the 8th grade IQ test I took. Back in the 7os it was questioned wheteher or not standard IQ was a rounded enough measure. The term emotional IQ came up.

 

[fast]

Awe, if we only knew then what we know now!

If we could turn back the clocks ... our attitudes toward money, our outlook and perspectives, our sense of moral concern, navigating relationships, organizing our aspirations, prioritizing the daily tasks, objectives, and goals would all be broached from position of advantage. Hell, you need only be smart enough to be near average, to succeed.

Transport your mind to the mind of a child in a third world country where even the menial tasks are hardcore. You'd have more than a taste of the greater more positive side of a capitalist country with freedom like the US. The point is, regardless of where you'd favor, your world of possibility has been lit up for the journey.

I think the disadvantaged need no fair playing field. They need the taste of success. We are not without this freedom you speak of, but then again, it's like being locked in a cell with no acute awareness that the keys are within reach. With an IQ of 90 and a sense of what you know transformed and soaked into the minds of those with few chances of success otherwise would undoubtedly journey past many obstacles of life with ease.

There are just simply too many success stories to deny that people have the freedom to succeed (disadvantaged or otherwise), but without sound guidance that can be trusted, the road is shaky and rough.

 

[DBT]

Intelligence and knowledge enables possibilities that may otherwise not be viable options, career pathways, management positions, Academic pursuits, Science, etc.

 

[steve_bank]

It all started with control of fire, the rest as they say is history.

 

[fromderinside]

RU Kidding me. It started with picking up chipped hard pieces and using them as tools and weapons. The rest is evolution.

 

[fast]

No, history came much later, so there's a lot of which is prehistoric unaccounted for in those statements.

 

[bigfield]

To me one of the main kickers here that lends itself to our degree of being free in the world is a. intelligence, and b. the knowledge that follows from intelligence. A simple maxim could go something like we cannot do, think, or feel that which we cannot perceive. In a nutshell, knowing more about how the world works, and about yourself, opens up avenues of action that could not have been taken had you not had the knowledge of that avenue.

Sometimes--and this is merely an exception to the rule--we are freed by an inability to feel or think. Sociopaths can accumulate huge personal gains and great social position simply by doing things that are unconscionable to other people.

 

[fromderinside]

Before rituals there were geese and cats. Before Psychology and it personality and ego there were Fighting fish and baboons.

My lesson for today comes from cats. There is a beauty in the hisses of two newly thrown together cats that set the stage for the adjusting to a new situation 'cause humans wanted it.

Declarations like intelligence and knowledge constructions get into my craw, leave an itch which, of course, I'm now scratching.

 

[steve_bank]

Before rituals there were geese and cats. Before Psychology and it personality and ego there were Fighting fish and baboons.

My lesson for today comes from cats. There is a beauty in the hisses of two newly thrown together cats that set the stage for the adjusting to a new situation 'cause humans wanted it.

Declarations like intelligence and knowledge constructions get into my craw, leave an itch which, of course, I'm now scratching.

There are rituals that appear cultural in species other than humans. In some chimp cultures a male may allow himself to be dry humped by a competing male as a signal of end of a conflict.

Canines will roll over on their backs exposing bellies to an aggressive alpha ,ale as a sign of acceptance of dominance.

Horses rub necks as a bonding ritual.

There is great film called Snow Monkeys Of Japan. Part of it captured a clan of monkeys discovering a hot spring in winter. It showed how they tentatively explored the water to finally looking like a bunch of people in a spa. They swam around and groomed each other.

 

[fromderinside]

Before rituals there were geese and cats. Before Psychology and it personality and ego there were Fighting fish and baboons.

My lesson for today comes from cats. There is a beauty in the hisses of two newly thrown together cats that set the stage for the adjusting to a new situation 'cause humans wanted it.

Declarations like intelligence and knowledge constructions get into my craw, leave an itch which, of course, I'm now scratching.

There are rituals that appear cultural in species other than humans. In some chimp cultures a male may allow himself to be dry humped by a competing male as a signal of end of a conflict.

Canines will roll over on their backs exposing bellies to an aggressive alpha ,ale as a sign of acceptance of dominance.

Horses rub necks as a bonding ritual.

There is great film called Snow Monkeys Of Japan. Part of it captured a clan of monkeys discovering a hot spring in winter. It showed how they tentatively explored the water to finally looking like a bunch of people in a spa. They swam around and groomed each other.

Uh, one teaching area was Comparative, now sociobiology, psychology. Macaques movies were part of introductory psych back in oh 61. That was before I dropped out of school, enlisted in Navy, went to Japan saw macaques for myself, went to work for IBM, then State of CA, got bachelors, masters, and phd and won a postdoc, then became a human research (factors/ergonomics/biophysics) scientist for DoD then MDC/Boeing.*

What's your point?

*^_overthetop.

 

[steve_bank]

Before rituals there were geese and cats. Before Psychology and it personality and ego there were Fighting fish and baboons.

My lesson for today comes from cats. There is a beauty in the hisses of two newly thrown together cats that set the stage for the adjusting to a new situation 'cause humans wanted it.

Declarations like intelligence and knowledge constructions get into my craw, leave an itch which, of course, I'm now scratching.

There are rituals that appear cultural in species other than humans. In some chimp cultures a male may allow himself to be dry humped by a competing male as a signal of end of a conflict.

Canines will roll over on their backs exposing bellies to an aggressive alpha ,ale as a sign of acceptance of dominance.

Horses rub necks as a bonding ritual.

There is great film called Snow Monkeys Of Japan. Part of it captured a clan of monkeys discovering a hot spring in winter. It showed how they tentatively explored the water to finally looking like a bunch of people in a spa. They swam around and groomed each other.

Uh, one teaching area was Comparative, now sociobiology, psychology. Macaques movies were part of introductory psych back in oh 61. That was before I dropped out of school, enlisted in Navy, went to Japan saw macaques for myself, went to work for IBM, then State of CA, got bachelors, masters, and phd and won a postdoc, then became a human research (factors/ergonomics/biophysics) scientist for DoD then MDC/Boeing.*

What's your point?

*^_overthetop.

Sometimes a lot of education can inhibit the ability to see simple conclusions.

 

[fromderinside]

I agree. Still, what's your point.

Let me guess. You are making a common problem from the twenties to the sixties, before sociobiology, - thank you Dr. Wilson - among ethologists. They took in human terms what other species were doing even though on close analysis there was nothing at all similar in behavior or motivation.

Simple story. My favorite prof from the sixties noted that African Mouth Breeders demonstrate learning with an Aha response of dashing to the bottom of the take when they 'realized' they had learned that touching a tube in water led to 'reward' of a meal worm. Worse he noted it was exactly after three experiences of the association this happened leading him to declare it was lawful and related to differences among species in proportions of autonomic that were sympathetic or parasympathetic.

Nice story not true, still based on observation and facts just contaminated by wishful thinking.