The Russian Hacking Fiasco

[Will Wiley]

The Russian Hacking Fiasco

There’s no proof that Russia hacked the US elections.

There’s no proof that Russian officials or Russian agents colluded with members of the Trump campaign.

There’s no proof that Russia provided material support of any kind for the Trump campaign or that Russian agents hacked Hillary Clinton’s emails or that Russian officials provided Wikileaks with emails that were intended to sabotage Hillary’s chances to win the election.

So far, no one in any of the 17 US intelligence agencies has stepped forward and verified the claims of Russian meddling or produced a scintilla of hard evidence that Russia was in anyway involved in the 2016 elections.

No proof means no proof. It means that the people and organizations that are making these uncorroborated claims have no basis for legal action, no presumption of wrongdoing, and no grounds for prosecution. They have nothing. Zilch. Their claims, charges and accusations are like the soap bubbles we give to our children and grandchildren. The brightly-colored bubbles wobble across the sky for a minute or two and then, Poof, they vanish into the ether. The claims of Russia hacking are like these bubbles. They are empty, unsubstantiated rumors completely devoid of substance. Poof.

 

[Deepak]

[YOUTUBE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zk_VszbZa_s[/YOUTUBE]

 

[whichphilosophy]

The Russian Hacking Fiasco

There’s no proof that Russia hacked the US elections.

There’s no proof that Russian officials or Russian agents colluded with members of the Trump campaign.

There’s no proof that Russia provided material support of any kind for the Trump campaign or that Russian agents hacked Hillary Clinton’s emails or that Russian officials provided Wikileaks with emails that were intended to sabotage Hillary’s chances to win the election.

So far, no one in any of the 17 US intelligence agencies has stepped forward and verified the claims of Russian meddling or produced a scintilla of hard evidence that Russia was in anyway involved in the 2016 elections.

No proof means no proof. It means that the people and organizations that are making these uncorroborated claims have no basis for legal action, no presumption of wrongdoing, and no grounds for prosecution. They have nothing. Zilch. Their claims, charges and accusations are like the soap bubbles we give to our children and grandchildren. The brightly-colored bubbles wobble across the sky for a minute or two and then, Poof, they vanish into the ether. The claims of Russia hacking are like these bubbles. They are empty, unsubstantiated rumors completely devoid of substance. Poof.

Essentially the investigation is based on a theory, or an excuse to explain why Clinton did not get into the White House.

 

[none]

The Russian Hacking Fiasco

There’s no proof that Russia hacked the US elections.

There’s no proof that Russian officials or Russian agents colluded with members of the Trump campaign.

There’s no proof that Russia provided material support of any kind for the Trump campaign or that Russian agents hacked Hillary Clinton’s emails or that Russian officials provided Wikileaks with emails that were intended to sabotage Hillary’s chances to win the election.

So far, no one in any of the 17 US intelligence agencies has stepped forward and verified the claims of Russian meddling or produced a scintilla of hard evidence that Russia was in anyway involved in the 2016 elections.

No proof means no proof. It means that the people and organizations that are making these uncorroborated claims have no basis for legal action, no presumption of wrongdoing, and no grounds for prosecution. They have nothing. Zilch. Their claims, charges and accusations are like the soap bubbles we give to our children and grandchildren. The brightly-colored bubbles wobble across the sky for a minute or two and then, Poof, they vanish into the ether. The claims of Russia hacking are like these bubbles. They are empty, unsubstantiated rumors completely devoid of substance. Poof.

I'm not sure there has been an investigation

 

[repoman]

I truly have little doubt that Trump would be the kind of scummy guy who very likely would take advantage of the dealings with did have with known Russian business men (who likely bailed his ass out several times) who are basically high end criminals to try to get a favor like the hacking done.

But, I haven't seen dead to rights proof. Also, if he got some of his former business partners to hack Clinton/DNC etc, that is not the Russian government.

I wonder if there are people in the IRS who actually have enough of the info on Trump's business holdings to see that he has gotten loans from Russian shell companies but can't release that info without going to jail forever.

Trump has denied ANY deals with "Russia", which to a normal person means any company based in Russia even if it uses a shell based in say the Caymans.

However, if one of those Russian companies got hacked it would show financials related to Trump or a shell company of his.

I would assume that despite Trump being dumb enough to run the Trump U scam, that any business dealings and loans from Russian companies would be hidden very well by the most sharkish of lawyers possible. He probably has people picked by the organized crime type lawyers that his dad had from the time when Donald Trump had to sign business deals because daddy was legally disallowed because of his past chicanery.

This makes me sad that we didn't get the much more honest, intelligent and self made business man, Ross Perot as president. If only he were 6'2" and didn't have that squeaky voice he may have won. Humans are primates after all...

 

[Keith&Co.]

It has been eight months since the inception of this unprecedentedly-pathetic and infinitely-irritating propaganda campaign,

Unprecedented?
Counterpunch doesn't remember Ken Starr, then?

 

[Will Wiley]

Essentially the investigation is based on a theory, or an excuse to explain why Clinton did not get into the White House.

From the Counterpunch article. It's about control of natural resources.
Do people really believe that the US has no interest in controlling natural resources???

But why has Russia been chosen as the target in this deep state-media scam? What has Russia done to deserve all the negative press and unsupported claims of criminal meddling?

That’s easy. Just look at a map. For the last 16 years, the US has been rampaging across North Africa, the Middle East and Central Asia. Washington intends to control critical oil and natural gas reserves in the ME, establish military bases across Central Asia, and remain the dominant player in an area of that is set to become the most populous and prosperous region of the world. It’s the Great Game all over again, only this time-around, Uncle Sam is in the drivers seat not the Queen of England.

But one country has upset that plan, blocked that plan, derailed that plan.

Russia.

 

[Will Wiley]

The Russian Hacking Fiasco

I'm not sure there has been an investigation

So...all those intelligence agencies pointed the finger at Russia without any investigation at all? That's even worse!

 

[Will Wiley]

This makes me sad that we didn't get the much more honest, intelligent and self made business man, Ross Perot as president. If only he were 6'2" and didn't have that squeaky voice he may have won. Humans are primates after all...

America is full of honest intelligent courageous men and women. Unfortunately politics is not always the place you find them. And not many of them have the money to run for President

 

[whichphilosophy]

It has been eight months since the inception of this unprecedentedly-pathetic and infinitely-irritating propaganda campaign,

Unprecedented?
Counterpunch doesn't remember Ken Starr, then?

How was Ken Starr's investigation into 2 suicides, then later the Monica Lewinski affair related to an investigation into something that is not even established to have happened in the first place?

 

[repoman]

From the Counterpunch article. It's about control of natural resources.
Do people really believe that the US has no interest in controlling natural resources???

But why has Russia been chosen as the target in this deep state-media scam? What has Russia done to deserve all the negative press and unsupported claims of criminal meddling?

That’s easy. Just look at a map. For the last 16 years, the US has been rampaging across North Africa, the Middle East and Central Asia. Washington intends to control critical oil and natural gas reserves in the ME, establish military bases across Central Asia, and remain the dominant player in an area of that is set to become the most populous and prosperous region of the world. It’s the Great Game all over again, only this time-around, Uncle Sam is in the drivers seat not the Queen of England.

But one country has upset that plan, blocked that plan, derailed that plan.

Russia.

China is also fucking with that plan pretty hard, especially in Africa. But they are the manufacturing powerhouse of the world now so there is not much recourse.

 

[Ford]

Unprecedented?
Counterpunch doesn't remember Ken Starr, then?

How was Ken Starr's investigation into 2 suicides, then later the Monica Lewinski affair related to an investigation into something that is not even established to have happened in the first place?

Starr's investigation was part of a larger effort by the GOP (and only the GOP) to remove President Clinton from office by any means available. It was purely political. In that way, it is not at all related to the FBI's investigation of possible Russian influence on our election.

 

[Keith&Co.]

an investigation into something that is not even established to have happened in the first place?

I think it's way too early to start claiming that there's nothing established, yet. The investigation is still in progress. People keep pretending that there's been investigation after investigation, but they probably watch too many cop shows where the murder is resolved in 43 minutes not counting commercials.
These things take time, and the Republicans keep insisting there's been enough time, enough investigations. But the simple truth is that we cannot yet say it's done.

But even at the worst case, if nothing ever happened with Russia and Trump, and all the probes are negative, and all the monitoring is coming up empty and Trump's efforts to make the investigations simply go away is NOT the behavior of a guilty man, then this would be very much like Starr's efforts. He couldn't find the smoking gun he wanted, but the Republicans kept giving him time, and rope, and money, to keep hounding at Clinton for a growing shopping list of charges that could be used against Clinton. Whitewater didn't pan out, and we ended up with adultery.

But i doubt that the Russia connection investigation will also result in a 'didn't pan out' footnote. Der Trumpf is not behaving like a man with nothing to hide... Comey's dismissal reeks of CYA with poor efforts to rationalize it for public consumption.

But then again, maybe Donald just hates being President, because it's work, and he blames Comey for getting him the job. It would also be in character.

 

[whichphilosophy]

an investigation into something that is not even established to have happened in the first place?

I think it's way too early to start claiming that there's nothing established, yet. The investigation is still in progress. People keep pretending that there's been investigation after investigation, but they probably watch too many cop shows where the murder is resolved in 43 minutes not counting commercials.
These things take time, and the Republicans keep insisting there's been enough time, enough investigations. But the simple truth is that we cannot yet say it's done.

But even at the worst case, if nothing ever happened with Russia and Trump, and all the probes are negative, and all the monitoring is coming up empty and Trump's efforts to make the investigations simply go away is NOT the behavior of a guilty man, then this would be very much like Starr's efforts. He couldn't find the smoking gun he wanted, but the Republicans kept giving him time, and rope, and money, to keep hounding at Clinton for a growing shopping list of charges that could be used against Clinton. Whitewater didn't pan out, and we ended up with adultery.

But i doubt that the Russia connection investigation will also result in a 'didn't pan out' footnote. Der Trumpf is not behaving like a man with nothing to hide... Comey's dismissal reeks of CYA with poor efforts to rationalize it for public consumption.

But then again, maybe Donald just hates being President, because it's work, and he blames Comey for getting him the job. It would also be in character.

Ken Starr started with 2 oddities ( suicides) hence something that actually happened in which to then probe further. It expanded to Monica Lewinsky and contained live recordings provided by Linda Tripp. This was something to probe further.

The current investigation has nothing concrete.

 

[Ford]

These things take time, and the Republicans keep insisting there's been enough time, enough investigations.

Funny, isn't it? When a Clinton is the target of an investigation, the GOP will keep at it no matter how long it takes...depending.

The investigation of Benghazi lasted from the waning months of 2012 until more or less exactly when the electoral college was won by Trump four years later.

Which is also more or less exactly when the Republicans decided that any investigation into the Russian connection was suddenly a giant waste of time.

Coincidence?

 

[Keith&Co.]

The current investigation has shown me nothing concrete.

FIFY.

- - - Updated - - -

Coincidence?

I think 'pathology' is the word you're looking for, there.

 

[whichphilosophy]

These things take time, and the Republicans keep insisting there's been enough time, enough investigations.

Funny, isn't it? When a Clinton is the target of an investigation, the GOP will keep at it no matter how long it takes...depending.

The investigation of Benghazi lasted from the waning months of 2012 until more or less exactly when the electoral college was won by Trump four years later.

Which is also more or less exactly when the Republicans decided that any investigation into the Russian connection was suddenly a giant waste of time.

Coincidence?

The Hilary Clinton investigation was a waste of time and went on too long, other than she stupidly put her mail on a private server and it seems her own words seemed to act against herself.

 

[whichphilosophy]

FIFY.

- - - Updated - - -

Whatever way it is worded, there's still no beef on the table.

 

[Keith&Co.]

FIFY.

- - - Updated - - -

Whatever way it is worded, there's still no beef on the table.

No one's put beef on YOUR table.
You're not in a position to evaluate the entire catering effort.

Did you notice how with Flynn, time goes on and more and more stuff comes to light?

We've yet to see everything the various investigators have found so far...

 

[whichphilosophy]

Whatever way it is worded, there's still no beef on the table.

No one's put beef on YOUR table.
You're not in a position to evaluate the entire catering effort.

Did you notice how with Flynn, time goes on and more and more stuff comes to light?

We've yet to see everything the various investigators have found so far...

If there's no beef on the public's table, then they can't evaluate what it would taste like.
So Flyn made did some paid talks. How is that influencing the elections?