Venezuela now has two Presidents - Maury Povich coming next to let country know who is the leader

[dismal]

Well yeah, it was a sham. But so is swearing in yourself as a President.

a) He didn't "swear himself in" he was sworn in by the duly elected congress as their leader.
b) His argument would be he's the most democratically elected person in the country.
c) He's probably right.

Don't forget:

d) His entire plan revolves around being President for a month until new elections can be had

and

e) apparently the Venezuelan Constitution says that when the Presidency becomes vacant the leader of the congress becomes President until a new election can be held. They are declaring that with the end of Maduro's first term and the 2nd election being widely recognized as a sham the Presidency is effectively vacant.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

Don't forget:

d) His entire plan revolves around being President for a month until new elections can be had

and

e) apparently the Venezuelan Constitution says that when the Presidency becomes vacant the leader of the congress becomes President until a new election can be held. They are declaring that with the end of Maduro's first term and the 2nd election being widely recognized as a sham the Presidency is effectively vacant.

If that's the case, it would mean that there's one guy saying that they should follow the laws and one guy saying fuck the laws. Support for the guy saying they should follow the laws is therefore warranted.

 

[dismal]

Don't forget:

d) His entire plan revolves around being President for a month until new elections can be had

and

e) apparently the Venezuelan Constitution says that when the Presidency becomes vacant the leader of the congress becomes President until a new election can be held. They are declaring that with the end of Maduro's first term and the 2nd election being widely recognized as a sham the Presidency is effectively vacant.

If that's the case, it would mean that there's one guy saying that they should follow the laws and one guy saying fuck the laws. Support for the guy saying they should follow the laws is therefore warranted.

Well, except that In Venezuela these days Maduro makes up the laws and decides what they say.

 

[Tom Sawyer]

Oh ya. Good point. Shoot these criminal motherfuckers.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

It is a shame that the U.S. news has refused to cover (more than very superficially) what has been happening in Venezuela for the last year or two.

It's not covered much because it's not really news. Venezuela has royally fucked itself, while the exact details change the overall picture is the same. Where's the news?

 

[skepticalbip]

It is a shame that the U.S. news has refused to cover (more than very superficially) what has been happening in Venezuela for the last year or two.

It's not covered much because it's not really news. Venezuela has royally fucked itself, while the exact details change the overall picture is the same. Where's the news?

There were a hell of a lot of serious actions taken by the Venezuelan government spanning more than a decade that were quite newsworthy. If they had been covered then everyone that finds the current situation surprising and startling would just be nodding and saying that they saw it coming. They would have a good understanding of how Venezuela was fucked, which most still don't. They only hear now what the final situation is but not how it came to this. An understanding of poor policy decisions in other countries that cumulatively resulted in this situation can help prevent them being made here.

 

[PyramidHead]

It is a shame that the U.S. news has refused to cover (more than very superficially) what has been happening in Venezuela for the last year or two.

It's not covered much because it's not really news. Venezuela has royally fucked itself, while the exact details change the overall picture is the same. Where's the news?

There were a hell of a lot of serious actions taken by the Venezuelan government spanning more than a decade that were quite newsworthy. If they had been covered then everyone that finds the current situation surprising and startling would just be nodding and saying that they saw it coming. They would have a good understanding of how Venezuela was fucked, which most still don't. They only hear now what the final situation is but not how it came to this. An understanding of poor policy decisions in other countries that cumulatively resulted in this situation can help prevent them being made here.

 

[dismal]

There were a hell of a lot of serious actions taken by the Venezuelan government spanning more than a decade that were quite newsworthy. If they had been covered then everyone that finds the current situation surprising and startling would just be nodding and saying that they saw it coming. They would have a good understanding of how Venezuela was fucked, which most still don't. They only hear now what the final situation is but not how it came to this. An understanding of poor policy decisions in other countries that cumulatively resulted in this situation can help prevent them being made here.

View attachment 19876

How exactly did US sanctions cause Venezuela’s problems?

 

[Loren Pechtel]

It is a shame that the U.S. news has refused to cover (more than very superficially) what has been happening in Venezuela for the last year or two.

It's not covered much because it's not really news. Venezuela has royally fucked itself, while the exact details change the overall picture is the same. Where's the news?

There were a hell of a lot of serious actions taken by the Venezuelan government spanning more than a decade that were quite newsworthy. If they had been covered then everyone that finds the current situation surprising and startling would just be nodding and saying that they saw it coming. They would have a good understanding of how Venezuela was fucked, which most still don't. They only hear now what the final situation is but not how it came to this. An understanding of poor policy decisions in other countries that cumulatively resulted in this situation can help prevent them being made here.

The thing is those actions were pretty much not newsworthy. Venezuela fucked itself, they oppressed any dissent of their dictator. The exact flavor of the fucking and oppression isn't news.

Furthermore, what we see now isn't a big surprise. Sooner or later someone was going to challenge him.

- - - Updated - - -

There were a hell of a lot of serious actions taken by the Venezuelan government spanning more than a decade that were quite newsworthy. If they had been covered then everyone that finds the current situation surprising and startling would just be nodding and saying that they saw it coming. They would have a good understanding of how Venezuela was fucked, which most still don't. They only hear now what the final situation is but not how it came to this. An understanding of poor policy decisions in other countries that cumulatively resulted in this situation can help prevent them being made here.

View attachment 19876

Socialist propaganda piece.

Vietnam: Communist-backed coup that took part of the country. We tried to retake it.

The others sided with the Russians and thus made themselves part of the cold war.

And we haven't even tried to pull a coup in Venezuela. We have provided moral support to those who have attempted it, that's all.

 

[skepticalbip]

There were a hell of a lot of serious actions taken by the Venezuelan government spanning more than a decade that were quite newsworthy. If they had been covered then everyone that finds the current situation surprising and startling would just be nodding and saying that they saw it coming. They would have a good understanding of how Venezuela was fucked, which most still don't. They only hear now what the final situation is but not how it came to this. An understanding of poor policy decisions in other countries that cumulatively resulted in this situation can help prevent them being made here.

The thing is those actions were pretty much not newsworthy. Venezuela fucked itself, they oppressed any dissent of their dictator. The exact flavor of the fucking and oppression isn't news.

Furthermore, what we see now isn't a big surprise. Sooner or later someone was going to challenge him.

We apparently have different ideas of what is newsworthy. It isn't so much the recent challenge to Maduro's authority that I find surprising. Events that I find newsworthy dates back even to Chavez and policies he set in place that eventually led to this challenge to Maduro.

The Chavez nationalization of the oil industry made a little news but there was no follow up of decisions put in place that led to the decline of that industry like removing experienced managers and workers that were in the opposition and then a massive increase in the number of oil workers even though they had no or little experience as reward for being in Chavez's party. Then the nationalization of the farming industry that had been quite productive and again massively staffing that industry with partisans that had no experience in agriculture - those farms then failed because costs exceeded profits and the fields went fallow. The same happened in the nationalized industrial industries. Then there was a rewriting of the Constitution to allow Chavez to serve more terms. The formation of the National Constituent Assembly filled with partisans to replace the authority of the properly elected National Assembly that was controlled by the opposition... etc. etc.

As I said there was a hell of a lot going on there that more than a decade ago spelled serious problems ahead. I was interested in what was happening so had to rely on news outlets like Al Jezerra, Deutche Wella, BBC, etc. because there was nothing on US media.

 

[ZiprHead]

Pompeo names Elliott Abrams special envoy to Venezuela

This will surely go well.

 

[Jayjay]

If the military doesn't turn, this counter-revolution will fail like so many others elsewhere in the world before it.

 

[ZiprHead]

John Bolton Says Ultimate Goal In Venezuela Is To Take Their Oil

It's 2003 all over again, right down to the mustachioed John Bolton, who freely admitted to Fox Business host Trish Regan on Thursday night that the ultimate goal of United States activity in Venezuela is to take over their oil production -- or, in simpler terms, take their oil.

 

[barbos]

There are no good guys in this mess.
I wonder what was John Bolton doing for a living between his stints in the government .

 

[Loren Pechtel]

We apparently have different ideas of what is newsworthy. It isn't so much the recent challenge to Maduro's authority that I find surprising. Events that I find newsworthy dates back even to Chavez and policies he set in place that eventually led to this challenge to Maduro.

Note the root word of "news": "new". Venezuela was fucking itself with nationalization. That made the news. Exactly what was getting nationalized isn't something of relevance to most people and thus not news.

As I said there was a hell of a lot going on there that more than a decade ago spelled serious problems ahead. I was interested in what was happening so had to rely on news outlets like Al Jezerra, Deutche Wella, BBC, etc. because there was nothing on US media.

Many of us could see there were serious problems ahead. It was discussed on here many times, those of us on the economic right knew what was going to happen, some on the economic left denied it, and then stuck their heads in the sand as it was happening and some blamed everything that went wrong on Maduro, deifying Chavez.

 

[skepticalbip]

We apparently have different ideas of what is newsworthy. It isn't so much the recent challenge to Maduro's authority that I find surprising. Events that I find newsworthy dates back even to Chavez and policies he set in place that eventually led to this challenge to Maduro.

Note the root word of "news": "new". Venezuela was fucking itself with nationalization. That made the news. Exactly what was getting nationalized isn't something of relevance to most people and thus not news.

As I said there was a hell of a lot going on there that more than a decade ago spelled serious problems ahead. I was interested in what was happening so had to rely on news outlets like Al Jezerra, Deutche Wella, BBC, etc. because there was nothing on US media.

Many of us could see there were serious problems ahead. It was discussed on here many times, those of us on the economic right knew what was going to happen, some on the economic left denied it, and then stuck their heads in the sand as it was happening and some blamed everything that went wrong on Maduro, deifying Chavez.

You are right about the denial of those on the economic left. That is one of the reasons that if the news had at least given occasional updates like when Chevez would nationalize and then destroy a major industry such as their large agricultural enterprises at least, some of those denying would have had to acknowledge what was happening and why. Then maybe they would come to question some socialist policies. As it is, they now seem to not blame the problems on socialist policies but on oil prices and CIA intervention. Watching history in action provides a great learning opportunity.

 

[Trausti]

John Bolton Says Ultimate Goal In Venezuela Is To Take Their Oil

It's 2003 all over again, right down to the mustachioed John Bolton, who freely admitted to Fox Business host Trish Regan on Thursday night that the ultimate goal of United States activity in Venezuela is to take over their oil production -- or, in simpler terms, take their oil.

Hell, have you forgotten that American Oil companies had their assets expropriated? And after the expropriation oil production tanked. He's not wrong to say that if American Oil companies went back to Venezuela, it would be win-win.

 

[4321lynx]

It is a shame that the U.S. news has refused to cover (more than very superficially) what has been happening in Venezuela for the last year or two.

It's not covered much because it's not really news. Venezuela has royally fucked itself, while the exact details change the overall picture is the same. Where's the news?

There were a hell of a lot of serious actions taken by the Venezuelan government spanning more than a decade that were quite newsworthy. If they had been covered then everyone that finds the current situation surprising and startling would just be nodding and saying that they saw it coming. They would have a good understanding of how Venezuela was fucked, which most still don't. They only hear now what the final situation is but not how it came to this. An understanding of poor policy decisions in other countries that cumulatively resulted in this situation can help prevent them being made here.

CiberCuba, an Online news source based in Spain reports What Guaido said:

Juan Guaidó: "Es hora de que salgan los cubanos de las Fuerzas Armadas y puestos de decisión en Venezuela"

Time that the Cubans in the Armed Forces go away and leave the decisions (...To be made..) in Venezuela.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Independent_digital_media_in_Cuba#CiberCuba

Anyone here know how many Cubans are occupying high-ranking posts in Venezuela's armed forces? How many Cuban and (?other) nationalities have "volunteered" to serve there in the past 10-20 years?

 

[4321lynx]

And this is an article in today's CC

Publicado el Domingo, 27 Enero, 2019 - 13:29 (GMT-5)

El Gobierno cubano habría activado ya un plan de contingencia para sacar a sus tropas de Venezuela, según el intelectual cubano Carlos Alberto Montaner.

El escritor y periodista afirma además que Raúl Castro y Díaz-Canel habrían dado "la discreta orden" a sus tropas para que salgan de Venezuela sin montar mucho ruido.

Según Montaner, el núcleo duro de la contrainteligencia cubana en Venezuela son unos 3.000 agentes. En su opinión, Cuba se ha dado cuenta de que no puede frenar la caída de Maduro y tampoco quiere enfrentarse a Estados Unidos

I apologize for the Google translation that follows

Published on Sunday, January 27, 2019 - 13:29 (GMT-5)

The Cuban government has already activated a contingency plan to get its troops out of Venezuela, according to Cuban intellectual Carlos Alberto Montaner.

The writer and journalist also affirms that Raúl Castro and Díaz-Canel would have given "the discreet order" to their troops to leave Venezuela without making much noise.

According to Montaner, the hard core of the Cuban counterintelligence in Venezuela is about 3,000 agents. In his opinion, Cuba has realized that it can not stop the fall of Maduro and does not want to face the United States either.


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carlos_Alberto_Montaner

I spoke before I looked. It's the best Google translation that I have ever seen. ?CIA at work?

 

[dismal]

John Bolton Says Ultimate Goal In Venezuela Is To Take Their Oil

It's 2003 all over again, right down to the mustachioed John Bolton, who freely admitted to Fox Business host Trish Regan on Thursday night that the ultimate goal of United States activity in Venezuela is to take over their oil production -- or, in simpler terms, take their oil.

Hell, have you forgotten that American Oil companies had their assets expropriated? And after the expropriation oil production tanked. He's not wrong to say that if American Oil companies went back to Venezuela, it would be win-win.

A couple points (addressing some other posts too): the Venezuelan oil industry was nationalized long before Chávez. Chavez’ predecessors had allowed foreign companies to come in and develop some heavy oil deposits because they were a) technically challenging for the national oil company, b) so far down the list of the National oil company’s priorities for capital they wouldn’t get to them for decades, c) they argued (somewhat dubiously) they didn’t count against the OPEC quota. These projects soon became a major source of the nations oil output

Never much for rationality when symbolism is involved, Chávez nationalized these projects. Guess what happened? The output cratered, the capital generated by these projects dried up, and Venezuela lost huge judgements in international courts for violating the agreements it had made. Win - win - win. Special bonus: OPEC quota no longer a problem! Producing nowhere close to it.

Oh well when these nationalizations don’t work and production of everything plummets they can always make it up by printing more money right? Not like that causes 23 million percent inflation or something.