What are we going to do about black people and all their guns?

[Loren Pechtel]

Does it occur to you that news reports aren't a good representation of the overall pattern? What makes the news are the things that are out of the ordinary. You see the outliers, not the average.

The average shooting is a criminal shooting another criminal, no witnesses. Such cases don't make the news.

Thus you see the outliers--the crazies, the public shootings, sometimes the domestics.

The public shootings normally only happen in areas where people are cowed by the gangs, otherwise there would be too much trouble with witnesses. Thus they're almost always done by non-whites.

Thus the shootings in the news by whites are basically always crazies or domestics and the latter are at best local news. The crazies we often hear about nationwide, though.

it occurs to me Loren, that the news media reports these stories through a particular narrative and it is a narrative they don't use when speaking about non white people. This even though the people they choose to cover tend to look alike,

However if the people involved look like my kid, there is another specific narrative that harks back to his color. If the people believe as his friend Shaddie believes, worships as shaddie does, then they get a narrative too, center around their mosque.

But when the shooter is white, their is no white group that gets blamed. When it was made clear that white men were responsible for Oklahoma city, white men were not then targeted en masse.

You're not addressing the point.

 

[Sabine Grant]

your points are pointless.

White shooters are covered in the media as is need of therapy and as lone wolves.
Non white shooters are covered as thugs and terrorists.

At no point have I or anyone else said black folk don't shoot people so showing that black people shoot people does what, exactly?

I explained this in the other thread but by then you were off to the rant races.

No one has said only black people get locked up. No one has said anything you want to rave against. So you just say they did and take off from there.

So you earn a

FAIL

Does it occur to you that news reports aren't a good representation of the overall pattern? What makes the news are the things that are out of the ordinary. You see the outliers, not the average.

The average shooting is a criminal shooting another criminal, no witnesses. Such cases don't make the news.

Thus you see the outliers--the crazies, the public shootings, sometimes the domestics.

The public shootings normally only happen in areas where people are cowed by the gangs, otherwise there would be too much trouble with witnesses. Thus they're almost always done by non-whites.

Thus the shootings in the news by whites are basically always crazies or domestics and the latter are at best local news. The crazies we often hear about nationwide, though.

it occurs to me Loren, that the news media reports these stories through a particular narrative and it is a narrative they don't use when speaking about non white people. This even though the people they choose to cover tend to look alike,

However if the people involved look like my kid, there is another specific narrative that harks back to his color. If the people believe as his friend Shaddie believes, worships as shaddie does, then they get a narrative too, center around their mosque.

But when the shooter is white, their is no white group that gets blamed. When it was made clear that white men were responsible for Oklahoma city, white men were not then targeted en masse.

What I have noticed Athena is that such incidence of WS motivated shooting does not result in all sorts of negative stereotyping targeting "white men". If we can speak of folks who automatically perceive a young Black man walking as a threat, do we ever speak of automatically perceiving a young White man walking as a threat?

Now mind you that that type of "perceived threat" mental process affecting folks who feed on negative stereotyping based on ethnicity is certainly not unique to your nation, Athena. France tends to cultivate similar mentalities. Just that it is mostly our French of Northern African origin who pay the price of negative stereotyping.

 

[AthenaAwakened]

your points are pointless.

White shooters are covered in the media as is need of therapy and as lone wolves.
Non white shooters are covered as thugs and terrorists.

At no point have I or anyone else said black folk don't shoot people so showing that black people shoot people does what, exactly?

I explained this in the other thread but by then you were off to the rant races.

No one has said only black people get locked up. No one has said anything you want to rave against. So you just say they did and take off from there.

So you earn a

FAIL

Does it occur to you that news reports aren't a good representation of the overall pattern? What makes the news are the things that are out of the ordinary. You see the outliers, not the average.

The average shooting is a criminal shooting another criminal, no witnesses. Such cases don't make the news.

Thus you see the outliers--the crazies, the public shootings, sometimes the domestics.

The public shootings normally only happen in areas where people are cowed by the gangs, otherwise there would be too much trouble with witnesses. Thus they're almost always done by non-whites.

Thus the shootings in the news by whites are basically always crazies or domestics and the latter are at best local news. The crazies we often hear about nationwide, though.

it occurs to me Loren, that the news media reports these stories through a particular narrative and it is a narrative they don't use when speaking about non white people. This even though the people they choose to cover tend to look alike,

However if the people involved look like my kid, there is another specific narrative that harks back to his color. If the people believe as his friend Shaddie believes, worships as shaddie does, then they get a narrative too, center around their mosque.

But when the shooter is white, their is no white group that gets blamed. When it was made clear that white men were responsible for Oklahoma city, white men were not then targeted en masse.

What I have noticed Athena is that such incidence of WS motivated shooting does not result in all sorts of negative stereotyping targeting "white men". If we can speak of folks who automatically perceive a young Black man walking as a threat, do we ever speak of automatically perceiving a young White man walking as a threat?

Now mind you that that type of "perceived threat" mental process affecting folks who feed on negative stereotyping based on ethnicity is certainly not unique to your nation, Athena. France tends to cultivate similar mentalities. Just that it is mostly our French of Northern African origin who pay the price of negative stereotyping.

I don't know if I ever told you this, but my cousin Naomi was stationed in Paris when she was in the air force. She was overseas for about a year, working at the US embassy. Anyway she remember her first time going into a shop to buy a pair of shoes. She got the same looks and stares she got back home, the same following her around, that is right up until she spoke. "Ah, you are an American. How can we help you? Will you be in Paris long? What brings you here. Hope you enjoy your visit. If you don't see anything you like, please come back in a few days. We will have a new shipment in." Naomi soon found out that American trumped black, only people kept expecting to her sing and know Jerry Lewis. .

 

[Sabine Grant]

your points are pointless.

White shooters are covered in the media as is need of therapy and as lone wolves.
Non white shooters are covered as thugs and terrorists.

At no point have I or anyone else said black folk don't shoot people so showing that black people shoot people does what, exactly?

I explained this in the other thread but by then you were off to the rant races.

No one has said only black people get locked up. No one has said anything you want to rave against. So you just say they did and take off from there.

So you earn a

FAIL

Does it occur to you that news reports aren't a good representation of the overall pattern? What makes the news are the things that are out of the ordinary. You see the outliers, not the average.

The average shooting is a criminal shooting another criminal, no witnesses. Such cases don't make the news.

Thus you see the outliers--the crazies, the public shootings, sometimes the domestics.

The public shootings normally only happen in areas where people are cowed by the gangs, otherwise there would be too much trouble with witnesses. Thus they're almost always done by non-whites.

Thus the shootings in the news by whites are basically always crazies or domestics and the latter are at best local news. The crazies we often hear about nationwide, though.

it occurs to me Loren, that the news media reports these stories through a particular narrative and it is a narrative they don't use when speaking about non white people. This even though the people they choose to cover tend to look alike,

However if the people involved look like my kid, there is another specific narrative that harks back to his color. If the people believe as his friend Shaddie believes, worships as shaddie does, then they get a narrative too, center around their mosque.

But when the shooter is white, their is no white group that gets blamed. When it was made clear that white men were responsible for Oklahoma city, white men were not then targeted en masse.

What I have noticed Athena is that such incidence of WS motivated shooting does not result in all sorts of negative stereotyping targeting "white men". If we can speak of folks who automatically perceive a young Black man walking as a threat, do we ever speak of automatically perceiving a young White man walking as a threat?

Now mind you that that type of "perceived threat" mental process affecting folks who feed on negative stereotyping based on ethnicity is certainly not unique to your nation, Athena. France tends to cultivate similar mentalities. Just that it is mostly our French of Northern African origin who pay the price of negative stereotyping.

I don't know if I ever told you this, but my cousin Naomi was stationed in Paris when she was in the air force. She was overseas for about a year, working at the US embassy. Anyway she remember her first time going into a shop to buy a pair of shoes. She got the same looks and stares she got back home, the same following her around, that is right up until she spoke. "Ah, you are an American. How can we help you? Will you be in Paris long? What brings you here. Hope you enjoy your visit. If you don't see anything you like, please come back in a few days. We will have a new shipment in." Naomi soon found out that American trumped black, only people kept expecting to her sing and know Jerry Lewis. .

It does not surprise me at all.Had she been from Senegal and of course would be fluent in French which would indicate "Black from Africa", the following around and other negative stereotype fueled behavior would have been ongoing and forget customer service!

When I was a student, I worked in an upper class clothing store in Cannes, my hometown. The head sales associate who trained me ( I was the store interpreter in view of their international clientele) gave me the 101 on which type of customer was to be greeted with a red carpet and bowing (so to speak). The list excluded "les noirs" and "les Arabes" (Blacks and Arabs). Then came the day when a very Arab looking person walked in, wearing a white djellaba. Head sales associate gave him a disdainful gaze and signaled me to watch closely this "very Arab looking " man. Very Arab looking man finally addressed me in an English reflecting the traits of having been educated in British English. I related to the sales associate that our "very Arab looking " man did not speak French and I would have to conduct any sales with him (since Mr sales associate did not speak any English). The moment our very Arab looking man in our exchanges revealed he was from Saudi Arabia and looking to purchase several suits for his....body guards, Mr Sales associate became very animated and if there had been a red carpet to lay under this unusual customer feet, he would have done so.

Even more animated when I asked him to follow me outside while I pointed to the parked Camaro with a plate reading "SA 2". Part of the flotilla of cars owned by the Royal Saudis vacationing on the Riviera during the Summer. I will give you the equivalent in English of the worst thing that man could have said at that moment " well at least, he is not a rat face from Algeria". I bit my tongue very hard. Oh I had my own moments of giving him disdainful gazes as Mahmoud and I became friends and I was invited several times to the parties held at the Royals summer villa. While Mr sales associate would plead with me to get him an invitation. Which he never got.

 

[Metaphor]

Oh I had my own moments of giving him disdainful gazes as Mahmoud and I became friends and I was invited several times to the parties held at the Royals summer villa. While Mr sales associate would plead with me to get him an invitation. Which he never got.

Oh, how wonderful for you, to be invited to the summer home of autocratic thugs and murderers. Of course the royals weren't in the Islamic hellhole they ruled over, but merely in a summer home in a not-insane country, so instead of secretly breaking every sharia rule, they could do it openly, and never mind the peasants!

 

[Sabine Grant]

Oh I had my own moments of giving him disdainful gazes as Mahmoud and I became friends and I was invited several times to the parties held at the Royals summer villa. While Mr sales associate would plead with me to get him an invitation. Which he never got.

Oh, how wonderful for you, to be invited to the summer home of autocratic thugs and murderers.

What makes you conclude that it was wonderful for me? As you seem to portray me at that time in my life as someone who would long to be included in the lives of the wealthy.That I somehow considered it a privilege to be marveling over and the focus of my dreams and wants. Whereas, Mr sale associate certainly considered it as part of his dreams and wants to be feasting on the crumbs of the wealthy while setting aside his racism and prejudice targeting Arabs the moment the Arabs in question were wealthy. But you ignored that point while pausing as an individual whose approval I should have depended on to choose who I were to socialize with.

I have got news for you : had you been an acquaintance of mine from that time and on, you would have spent ample energy being outraged at the number of people I have socialized with you would not approve of.

Of course the royals weren't in the Islamic hellhole they ruled over, but merely in a summer home in a not-insane country, so instead of secretly breaking every sharia rule, they could do it openly, and never mind the peasants!

That is pretty much an accurate description of those very wealthy members of the "Arabes" category who would otherwise be treated like insignificant crap by Mr. sales associate if it were not for their wealth. The point drawn via my sharing that anecdote with Athena being to confirm the rampant if not overt mentality her cousin Naomi encountered in Paris as a representative of the ethnic minority " Les Noirs".

Let's try to figure out the root of the why and how behind such mentalities polarizing on 2 French ethnic minority groups : the common factor both groups share being their immigrant origins from nations colonized by France. The typical colonial mentality being that natives of those colonies were savages in need of our intervention to become civilized. The general perception among French colonials living in Africa having been the alleged inferiority of those native populations. French colonialism having been a phenomenon of institutionalized racism and White Supremacy in our now ex colonies. That French culture is plagued with negative stereotyping targeting specifically those 2 groups might reflect the White Supremacist sentiment of the colonial times. Lingering into the sense of moral and racial superiority while persisting in vilifying ethnic groups we once mistreated and exploited in the course of our colonialism.

Could there be a similar root cause in the US fueling the persistence to negatively stereotype members of the specific ethnic minority group, Blacks? Blacks were indeed mistreated and exploited under another institutionalized manifestation of White Supremacy and racism. They are indeed still vilified today via negative stereotyping. Any single time anyone's negative stereotyping targets Blacks as a whole, it presents Black folks as THE problem. They become the scapegoat for all sorts of ills. While the actual culprits behind specific ills certainly do not cause the onset of persistent negative stereotyping affecting their majority ethnic group as a whole. Their majority ethnic group does not become THE problem and scapegoats for all sorts of ills present in the American society.

More importantly is the reality that it is not about ethnicity. It is about a shift towards a culture of violence and dismissal of the rights of our fellow human beings to live and pursue happiness. When did that shift occur? Why did it occur? How did this nation shift from the intended purpose of the Second Amendment to its misuse and abuse? IMO such topic which requires deep exploration into US history would be far more productive than threads obsessing on ethnicity.