What's our most basic assumptions?

[Speakpigeon]

What would be our most basic assumption when we try to understand anything about reality?

Hopefully, all properly articulated answers will be entered in a poll to see which one may be best.

You can always submit several answers.

The assumption that there's a reality to begin with doesn't count.

The assumption that one should be clever enough to understand something doesn't count.

I won't submit any answer myself to retain some credibility as a fair judge and competent arbiter. I promise to be fair and impartial.
EB

 

[ruby sparks]

The assumption that there's a reality to begin with doesn't count.

Ok so on a thread asking about our most basic assumptions, you want to exclude what is arguably our single most basic assumption?

 

[rousseau]

I guess the first delineation would depend on your belief in a creator

if(iBelieveInGod)
    - everything emanates from God
    - divine plan
else
    - the universe works on natural, quantifiable laws that we can measure and understand
endif

After that point we should be able to understand all observable behavior and phenomena within the framework of our assumptions about natural law

 

[phands]

TANSTAAFL . (nod to Robert Heinlein)

 

[Speakpigeon]

TANSTAAFL . (nod to Robert Heinlein)

There ain't no such thing as a free lunch? Can't you find something more basic than that? You're not trying.
EB

 

[Speakpigeon]

I guess the first delineation would depend on your belief in a creator

if(iBelieveInGod)
    - everything emanates from God
    - divine plan
else
    - the universe works on natural, quantifiable laws that we can measure and understand
endif

After that point we should be able to understand all observable behavior and phenomena within the framework of our assumptions about natural law

You obviously meant to say that either leg of the alternative could be your basic assumption, and that different people will choose one or the other, but your bit of code says that your most basic assumption before that is the alternative itself, i.e. either I believe in God or I don't...
EB

 

[Speakpigeon]

The assumption that there's a reality to begin with doesn't count.

Ok so on a thread asking about our most basic assumptions, you want to exclude what is arguably our single most basic assumption?

Because too easy and whimsical. We're doing serious business here! You have to work for your lunch (TANSTAAFL). I could accept you don't have clue but that would be a bit lax. I'm sure you should be able to elucidate some assumption you make and you would want to insist on. You could start tentatively with one super lame assumption and work backward and see how far you can go. UM is guaranteeing you won't have to go back to any infinite monkey business. Hard work, yeah, but you can do it!
EB

 

[ruby sparks]

The assumption that there's a reality to begin with doesn't count.

Ok so on a thread asking about our most basic assumptions, you want to exclude what is arguably our single most basic assumption?

Because too easy and whimsical. We're doing serious business here! You have to work for your lunch (TANSTAAFL). I could accept you don't have clue but that would be a bit lax. I'm sure you should be able to elucidate some assumption you make and you would want to insist on. You could start tentatively with one super lame assumption and work backward and see how far you can go. UM is guaranteeing you won't have to go back to any infinite monkey business. Hard work, yeah, but you can do it!
EB

Er......

Tell you what. Consider changing the thread title to 'which of our most basic assumptions do I, Speakpigeon, personally think are worth talking about?' (subtitle: I am going to leave out what is arguably the single most basic one).

 

[rousseau]

I guess the first delineation would depend on your belief in a creator

if(iBelieveInGod)
    - everything emanates from God
    - divine plan
else
    - the universe works on natural, quantifiable laws that we can measure and understand
endif

After that point we should be able to understand all observable behavior and phenomena within the framework of our assumptions about natural law

You obviously meant to say that either leg of the alternative could be your basic assumption, and that different people will choose one or the other, but your bit of code says that your most basic assumption before that is the alternative itself, i.e. either I believe in God or I don't...
EB

The point of differentiating them that way is to highlight the fact that our basic assumptions about how reality work are contingent on the ontologies we assume about reality. There is no objective 'basic assumption'.. there is a 'basic assumption based on what we believe about the nature of the universe'. That is unless you want to assume materialism for the purpose of this conversation and start from there.

I bring up this side of the conversation, because from an anthropological perspective the assumptions we make about reality are subjective, and people are a diverse bunch. So I guess it just depends on whether you want to talk about the basic assumptions we make across our species, or the basic assumptions we make starting from the materialist frame.

 

[Speakpigeon]

Because too easy and whimsical. We're doing serious business here! You have to work for your lunch (TANSTAAFL). I could accept you don't have clue but that would be a bit lax. I'm sure you should be able to elucidate some assumption you make and you would want to insist on. You could start tentatively with one super lame assumption and work backward and see how far you can go. UM is guaranteeing you won't have to go back to any infinite monkey business. Hard work, yeah, but you can do it!
EB

Er......

Tell you what. Consider changing the thread title to 'which of our most basic assumptions do I, Speakpigeon, personally think are worth talking about?' (subtitle: I am going to leave out what is arguably the single most basic one).

Hey, that's privilege coming with posting the OP. Seems fair enough. I would hope you're making assumptions by the shitload everyday of your life just enough to survive. Shouldn't be difficult to find one I haven't ruled out that seems more basic than the others.
EB

 

[Speakpigeon]

I guess the first delineation would depend on your belief in a creator

if(iBelieveInGod)
    - everything emanates from God
    - divine plan
else
    - the universe works on natural, quantifiable laws that we can measure and understand
endif

After that point we should be able to understand all observable behavior and phenomena within the framework of our assumptions about natural law

You obviously meant to say that either leg of the alternative could be your basic assumption, and that different people will choose one or the other, but your bit of code says that your most basic assumption before that is the alternative itself, i.e. either I believe in God or I don't...
EB

The point of differentiating them that way is to highlight the fact that our basic assumptions about how reality work are contingent on the ontologies we assume about reality.

OK, so these assumed "ontologies" are our basic assumptions and different people may assume different ontologies. And they seems a good candidate for being most basic.

There is no objective 'basic assumption'.. there is a 'basic assumption based on what we believe about the nature of the universe'. That is unless you want to assume materialism for the purpose of this conversation and start from there.

Nah. I certainly think our most basic assumptions are necessarily subjective. If one's most basic assumption is that the world is entirely material, then even this one would have to be subjective.

I bring up this side of the conversation, because from an anthropological perspective the assumptions we make about reality are subjective, and people are a diverse bunch. So I guess it just depends on whether you want to talk about the basic assumptions we make across our species, or the basic assumptions we make starting from the materialist frame.

No such suggestion in the OP that I can see. What would be our most basic assumption when we try to understand anything about reality? So, your "ontologies we assume about reality" seems a good one. Maybe someone who "assumes God" could do a coming out and explain here how in their view that would help us understand reality.
EB

 

[Valjean]

The world is as we perceive it.
Our senses paint an accurate picture of reality.

 

[Speakpigeon]

The world is as we perceive it.
Our senses paint an accurate picture of reality.

Good one. Seems very basic to me. Most people certainly would have it. And we have it even before we could have a chance to try better.
EB

 

[Juma]

The world is as we perceive it.
Our senses paint an accurate picture of reality.

Which relies on
- there is something that is not me
- there is a world out there
- the senses reflect something outside ourselves.
- the senses reflect that world outside ourselves.
- stuff you dont see changing probably stays the same
Etc

 

[The AntiChris]

Stuff happens for a reason (the assumption of adequate determinism).

 

[bigfield]

The assumption that there's a reality to begin with.

 

[fromderinside]

The assumption there is an is.

 

[ruby sparks]

The assumption that there's a reality to begin with.

Oh you rebel you. You know that one's been disallowed by the threadmeister.

 

[ruby sparks]

Seriously, I've got one.

The assumption that if you start a thread with a question, you get to decide which answers count and which don't.

 

[untermensche]

The world is as we perceive it.
Our senses paint an accurate picture of reality.

There is a more basic assumption which is true.

There is me and there are the things I perceive.

I am perceiving things.

Something is perceiving them.

I perceive therefore I exist.

The most basic assumptions are well known already.

Descartes explained it a while ago.